R2R newbie wants to know - subject - tape (normal/low noise)

[ta131js]

OK. You cassette people - move along, there is nothing here.:D

I'm an R2R newbie.
While my first deck was in the shop for repair/tuneup, I picked up some tapes from private parties. They are mostly prerecorded Scotch and RCA brand. I also managed to find a few 'new' ones - Maxell mostly.
Now, I'm ready to record and I have a question.
My AKAI 202D-SS has a tape selection switch - 'normal' and 'S.R.T.' which is for low noise - according to the owners manual. (super response tape?)
:banana: My question is - which brand/grade are considered low noise? Do they say "low noise" on the box?
There were three kinds of cassette if I remember correctly - normal, chrome and metal. I bought mostly chrome for recording, normal whenever I felt cheap, and when I started to think about metal, the CD era arrived. So what kinds/grades are there in R2R? Will I get the best out of my machine by using 'low noise' at the fastest speed?
I can use a quick lesson here.
Anyone?

TIA:thmbsp:

[Des_Lab]

Cassette tapes did not evolve in lockstep with reel tapes, so don't try and use that as a guide. The short answer is that, despite the many variations, ultimately, there were only two 'types' of reel tape: "normal" and "EE"*. The latter was a late arrival to the game and was a last ditch effort by Maxell/TDK, Teac and Akai to revive the [then] quickly sinking R2R market. It was for all intents and purposes, a reel to reel equivalent of "high bias". The effort did not succeed and only a handful of late model Teac and Akai decks were capable of using it. Maxell, TDK, and BASF each only made one grade of EE tape.

*Sony once made an "FeCr" (ferrichrome) reel tape. But it never caught on and was limited to only a few Sony decks as far as user capability.

Getting back into the domain of "normal", there are no hard and fast rules that I know of that define the specific tape types. In there, you will find 'low noise', 'high output', 'LHI', 'LHII', etc. All of those settings correspond more to the QUALITY of the tape versus the TYPE. The issue is really more of fine tuning the bias and eq with various oxides to get the best sound, based on the application (speech, LP, live, etc.). So the best advice I can give would be to experiment with different tapes to see what works best.

One other thing I should point out is that in MOST (but not all) cases, tapes marketed as "low noise" were *USUALLY* the "bottom" grades. Those are usually voice grade/red oxide tapes (so called because of the deep brown, almost maroon color of the tape).

Here is (based on my experience) a guide of some of the various tapes from lowest quality to highest:

LOW NOISE/HIGH OUTPUT

Maxell LN, Scotch #150, Ampex/Quantegy 641/642

ALL PURPOSE/MEDIUM QUALITY:

Maxell UD, Scotch #227, TDK 'AUDUA', TDK LX

HIGH PERFORMANCE

Maxell XLI, Ampex/Quantegy #407, Scotch "Classic", TDK GX

SUPER HIGH PERFORMANCE:

Quantegy #457, #499, 3M #986

TOP OF THE LINE:

Quantegy GP9, EMTEC SM900

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DL-Tape it to the limit

[ta131js]

I will keep your post for future reference. Quantegy huh? Never heard of the brand. I have to look them up.
Thanks DL.:thmbsp:

[mhardy6647]

Quantegy is what became of Ampex's tape business.

[wordman001]

There is only one R2R tape to use. Maxell UD 35-90 & UD 35-90B ( Back Coated for less Print Thru and Better winding) Use it for everything and you will be happy..... There's plenty available used and it's better than anything else new....- Joe M.:banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana:

[goldear]

I agree with much of what Des had to say above. Although I'm not sure that I completely agree with all of his tape classifications. Frankly most consumer machines cannot be biased up to the level required by the "best" tapes on his list, so I wouldn't even try, unless you simply like to be frustrated by the (bad) sound of a very underbiased tape.

One thing that needs to be pointed out here is that terms like "Hi-Bias" and "Low bias" do not map across very well to the cassette world. "High-bias", in open reel terms, maps roughly to a "type 1", or "Normal bias" Cassette tape. "Low bias" maps roughly to the (largely unkown) "type 0" tape classification, which usually means the really lousy, very old, so-called "red-oxide" tapes. In the cassette word these were tapes that you would have to lower your fine-bias control to the bottom of its range to get even half-way reasonable sound out of. TDKs "D" formulation could have been considered to be a borderline "type 0" tape for example.

So basically, these controls on your reel to reel are kind-of like the "fine bias" knob on any good cassette deck.

And, not that it applies to you, but the so-called "EE" tapes, directly map across to "type II", or "chrome" tapes, in the cassette world. And "metal" tape has never been produced for Analog open reel machines.

But the bottom line is that you will have to experiment to find the position which gets the best performance for a given tape. And the advice to buy Maxel tape is good. But I would also recomend the new Emtek LPR-35 tape as a current production tape that should be compatible with your machine.

[aarowsmith]

:tresbon:Well, here is what I feel on this matter of reel tapes and it is based on my real world testing on 4 different machines all 1/4" format 1/2 track, 4 track, 8 track machines. Fostex and Teac, also Tascam machines with Dolby C noise reduction and DBX and standard Dolby B.

I find that most tapes on the high scale perform very well and are very pleasing to listen to and all brands have their advantages and disadvantages to them.

For instance, one brand of reel tape may sound much brighter and have allot more background hiss, also it is do to the way your machine is set-up for that particular bias of tape formulation. So it may sound glorious or not.:thumbsdn:

And yet others can have a dead silent background, hence low noise, and also a very high output with very low distortion, as well perform excellent in the high end, mid range, and low end.

But, and but.....You just have to go out and buy a bunch of different brands and different model numbers of reel tapes. To just see which one You like personally for sound quality and very low noise in the background as well as tonal quality, another words tape saturation colorization in the sound. Sorry to make up words here, anyways............

You always also have to change your EQ settings and Bias setting switches/knobs on your particular reel machine if you want to see if the tape truly is performing at it's best possible quality and performance.

You may be suprised by trial and error on just how the "GOD" tape you thought , was the end all of all searches for the best of all the reel tapes and brands, really is just a piece of garbage, really, compared to some other brand and model of reel tape you have yet to try out!

I have been very suprised many times personally, about how many reel tapes turned out to either sound worse than others in some ways and or incredibly bad and it can't get any worse hence high noise and low output.

But some reel tapes seem to be that they are just outstanding, and it can't seem to possibly get any better? Well, bottom line is, pick the reel tape or several, that are the best for your particular machine, for both your electronics and your sound system. Also find the equipment that you can afford and has good quality, likewise, don't be afraid to try out new reel tape sometimes, because it can make a huge difference depending on what equipment you own. But for the most part, most reel machines can benefit greatly from different brands and model numbers of tapes and most reel machines made in the 70's and up are excellent quality and I will have to say blow away Cassetes out of the water and sometimes digital recording as well.

Besides you would have to plunk down $3,000 or more on a high end reel machine, a pre-amp made of Tubes, and then think about spending about the same or more on some New Glorious Loud Speakers made from "GOD's Hands" himself. Not to mention the mainternance cost to keep these high end machines running smoothly, unless of course you are a tech guy yourself and can maintain your equipment forever.

Well, or you could just buy many different kinds of reel tapes and experiment with them, and you will be truly happy you discovered that "GOD" tape that works very well on your machine to get the best sound quality for the money you are willing to spend.:thmbsp: