View Full Version : Welborne Labs business in trouble ? Be aware


Thierry77
06-17-2007, 09:29 AM
In order to prevent other people to get such troubles with that company, I report here the story of my negative customer experience with Welborne labs.

After having seeing very good appreciations of the DRD 300B kit on Enjoy The Music.COM, in March 2007 I ordered the Terraplane 300B kit which is a signature version of the DRD300B amplifier. The transaction was made by visa card and, immediately, my bank account has been charged for the total amount.

3 weeks later, I sent Ron Welborne a mail in order to get a shipping date. He answered me : "We have a few items that we are waiting on from suppliers but we expect to finally have them this week so we will be shipping your kit shortly. I will drop you an email just as soon as it ships."
I never received that email, and, since, he never answered to my other mails.

At the begening of May, I made a complaint to the Denver/Boulder Better Business Bureau (BBB), which is a mediation organism between consumers and businesses. I asked for the cancellation of my order and for a complete refund of all was charged to me. The BBB notified the dispute twice to the Welborne Labs company, without any answer from Ron Welborne.
This neglecting attitude of Ron Welborne is amazing for a businessman !

Finally, the BBB adviced me "You may wish to seek legal advice or small claims court for further recourse". They added "The Better Business Bureau develops and maintains Reliability Reports on companies in our service area. This information is available to the public and is frequently used by potential customers. In the case of your complaint, the company's failure to promptly give attention to the matter will be reflected in the report we give to consumers about them."

You can see the customers experience reports here : http://data.denver.bbb.org/commonreport.html?bid=90007851
The complaints seem to grow in number, and I encourage other people in trouble with that company to make complaints to the BBB.

After this attempt of mediation, and because of the serious damage undergone, I decided to make an as large publicity as possible, and to sue Welborne Labs for breach of trust and swindle. These offenses are severelly repressed in France. I think that is the same in the States.
In a few days, he will be officialy informed.

Of course, if any refund occurs in the interim, I will inform the forum...

Regards,
Thierry

bolly
06-17-2007, 09:46 AM
welcome to AK Thierry77! And best of luck resolving the situation you're in!

jrsh92
06-17-2007, 12:46 PM
http://ic3.gov/

JimJ[VT]
06-17-2007, 01:18 PM
^

I used that link once when a store selling online sent me a refund check that bounced...didn't expect anything but I got a call from an agent a week later saying he had talked to the dealer :thmbsp: Got the whole situation worked out.

For once, the gov't was effective for something...don't worry, not getting my hopes up :banana::smoke:

pustelniakr
06-17-2007, 01:29 PM
They lost my business when recently I ordered some nice (expensive) tonearm wire. They charged my card, never answered the order with a confirmation. After many weeks, I sent a follow-up email trying to find out if or when to expect shipment or delivery. Got a terse response, but a full refund. However, my customer was sentenced to several more weeks of waiting, while I had to order the Cardas wire from a good company in Canada.

My 2 cents...

Enjoy,
Rich P

240sx4u
06-17-2007, 02:44 PM
Rich, did you order the wire from take 5 in canada? I got my cryoed cardas tonearm wire from them.

Evan

Mike Stehr
06-17-2007, 03:25 PM
http://audiokarma.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=51981&d=1182111883....

pustelniakr
06-17-2007, 03:47 PM
Rich, did you order the wire from take 5 in canada? I got my cryoed cardas tonearm wire from them.

Evan
I did indeed.

Enjoy,
Rich P

Doctordirt
06-17-2007, 03:49 PM
;1206065']^

I used that link once when a store selling online sent me a refund check that bounced...didn't expect anything but I got a call from an agent a week later saying he had talked to the dealer :thmbsp: Got the whole situation worked out.

For once, the gov't was effective for something...don't worry, not getting my hopes up :banana::smoke:

OMG G-men!

herbman1975
06-17-2007, 04:19 PM
Welbourne Labs charged my card for tone arm wire also, then when I complained via e-mail 3 times several months later they finally refunded my money.

Where is this place in Canada for the Cardas wire?

240sx4u
06-17-2007, 07:36 PM
TakeFiveAudio.com

Good guys to deal with. Prompt shipping etc..

Evan

Chipp
06-17-2007, 11:17 PM
http://ic3.gov/

IC3 is incredibly effective. I'm a moderator on a large technology forum, an we discovered a rather large fraud scheme going on at several boards. Investigated it a little, gathered quite a few testimonials from scammed buyers, and sent it on to IC3. The scammer is now in a less-than-free location, and they were able to force him to return many people's payments. Very well-run organization.

I'm sorry to hear of your troubles with Welborne. :( Can't stand to see somebody screwed over buy a business.

Russellc
06-19-2007, 10:24 AM
I would nt order diddly from Welbourne "Labs" yeah, as if there is a lab! I have ordered items with poor response in the 90's. when I called with questions, he seemed very put out. The last time I ordered from him, it was a cardas DIN plug and suggested cardas cabeling, which was obviously too large for the part. that was the last straw...it took forever to get, and I gave up trying to get a response for return, ordered the correct size wire from elsewhere and made the too large stuff into an interconnect. I wouldnt bother with Welbourne again.

Russellc

spartanmanor
06-19-2007, 10:49 AM
I had a bad experience with him in the past. I ordered about $100 worth of parts from him online. Days, weeks, months passed with repeated emails to him and no response. Sure he will take your money gladly but that is about it.

I had to file a claim with my credit card company. The word should go out not to do business with this company.

I posted about this a while back and I got a lot of responses about the fact that he was a small company a nice guy and was very busy. BS the guy is a crook. If you can’t handle your business then quit but don’t take money from people without performing.

jcmjrt
06-19-2007, 11:30 AM
I posted about this a while back and I got a lot of responses about the fact that he was a small company a nice guy and was very busy.

I know that I didn't say that. I had to resort to my credit card company too. Posted about it near the beginning of the year. Bad business....good amps...but not worth the ride.

It's important to post about companies when we get good service from too so that we all can do business with people who care about their customers. They are out there and e.g. I've added takefiveaudio.com to my favorite links.

Another one that I've been happy with is soniccraft.com as well as partsexpress.com, tubesandmore.com and digikey.com

WhiteSE
06-19-2007, 11:36 AM
I have seen complaints like this on other boards as well...what a shame...good amps deserve better builders...;-)

spartanmanor
06-19-2007, 11:39 AM
I know that I didn't say that. I had to resort to my credit card company too. Posted about it near the beginning of the year. Bad business....good amps...but not worth the ride.



Sorry I wasn't referring to you. I did get some good advice as well by posting. That is when I started to take action. :D

DIVA_GEAR
06-23-2007, 10:44 AM
I had a bad experience with him in the past. I ordered about $100 worth of parts from him online. Days, weeks, months passed with repeated emails to him and no response. Sure he will take your money gladly but that is about it.

I had to file a claim with my credit card company. The word should go out not to do business with this company.

I posted about this a while back and I got a lot of responses about the fact that he was a small company a nice guy and was very busy. BS the guy is a crook. If you canít handle your business then quit but donít take money from people without performing.

I've had a same experience with Welborne labs. In fact I ordered 3 sets of Eichmann Silver Bullet Plug. Despite all the mail sent to Ron from Welborne Lab, there's no reply from them at all. Sigh..... Agreed this guy is a crook :thumbsdn: Just my luck.

cwujek
06-25-2007, 05:32 AM
Wow, what do you know. Same thing here. Ordered a bunch of stuff from him, took forever to receive. Lots of resistors ordered. When I FINALLY did get them, they were all thrown together, took me forever to go through with my multimeter and separate them all out. He was way off in what he gave me, I was missing a bunch of stuff. Emailed him about it, no response. Never done business with again, never will. Never knew it was such a widespread problem. I think its time for Welborne Labs to either shut down or reorganize its customer service policies....

Celt
06-25-2007, 09:31 AM
Ron Welborne is the worst kind of businessman. I see as of 10/6/07, his website shows that they've moved to a new location. No addy given as of yet.

John Benevol
10-06-2007, 01:20 AM
In order to prevent other people to get such troubles with that company, I report here the story of my negative customer experience with Welborne labs.

After having seeing very good appreciations of the DRD 300B kit on Enjoy The Music.COM, in March 2007 I ordered the Terraplane 300B kit which is a signature version of the DRD300B amplifier. The transaction was made by visa card and, immediately, my bank account has been charged for the total amount.

3 weeks later, I sent Ron Welborne a mail in order to get a shipping date. He answered me : "We have a few items that we are waiting on from suppliers but we expect to finally have them this week so we will be shipping your kit shortly. I will drop you an email just as soon as it ships."
I never received that email, and, since, he never answered to my other mails.

At the begening of May, I made a complaint to the Denver/Boulder Better Business Bureau (BBB), which is a mediation organism between consumers and businesses. I asked for the cancellation of my order and for a complete refund of all was charged to me. The BBB notified the dispute twice to the Welborne Labs company, without any answer from Ron Welborne.
This neglecting attitude of Ron Welborne is amazing for a businessman !

Finally, the BBB adviced me "You may wish to seek legal advice or small claims court for further recourse". They added "The Better Business Bureau develops and maintains Reliability Reports on companies in our service area. This information is available to the public and is frequently used by potential customers. In the case of your complaint, the company's failure to promptly give attention to the matter will be reflected in the report we give to consumers about them."

You can see the customers experience reports here : http://data.denver.bbb.org/commonreport.html?bid=90007851
The complaints seem to grow in number, and I encourage other people in trouble with that company to make complaints to the BBB.

After this attempt of mediation, and because of the serious damage undergone, I decided to make an as large publicity as possible, and to sue Welborne Labs for breach of trust and swindle. These offenses are severelly repressed in France. I think that is the same in the States.
In a few days, he will be officialy informed.

Of course, if any refund occurs in the interim, I will inform the forum...

Regards,
Thierry:tresbon:
I'd like to thank Thierry for keeping us informed and also providing the forum with the subsequent BBB investigation report.Good detective work.The same thing is occurring with my DRD order at the moment.Initially purchased via the welborne shopping cart.Lots of excuses initially also lied originally stating that the item had been shipped,when it had not.Now Ive had no response for 2 months and taking up the matter with Paypal.Shoppers be aware,paypal only guarantee your purchases for 45 days,after which time they absolve themselves of ANY responsibility,even though their transaction receipts do not mention any terms & conditions regarding this fact,allowing a definite legal loophole for anybody caught out like this.By the way Thierry was the matter finally settled?

Russellc
10-06-2007, 09:57 AM
This post should be made a sticky, perhaps no one else will fall prey to this poor excuse for a business. Do us all a favor Ron, close your doors!

Russellc

240sx4u
10-06-2007, 10:18 AM
Its truly unfortunate. I have an old welborne labs phono stage that I really enjoy.

I don't think anything has been resolved yet judging by the posts on audio asylum.

Evan

dividebytube
10-07-2007, 07:10 AM
I used to order wooden chassis boxes from Welborne Labs and he was always pretty honest / quick with the shipments. I haven't ordered anything from him recently so I can't comment further - just sad to see.

cjames28
10-25-2007, 09:35 PM
I too have had a bad experience with Welborne Labs. I ordered a ST-70 rebuild kit and only got part of the material I needed for the amp. Still waiting for the power transformer and the tubes! I'll never buy anything from Ron Welborne again.

cjames28
10-25-2007, 09:36 PM
I too have had a bad experience with Welborne Labs. I ordered a ST-70 rebuild kit and only got part of the material I needed for the amp. Still waiting for the power transformer and the tubes! I'll never buy anything from Ron Welborne again.

John Benevol
10-27-2007, 12:43 AM
Welborne Labs has treated me along with many others disgracefully.He has defrauded me.I have Consumer Protection Australia,IC3,Colorado State Attorneys Office,NAB Visa Card all working on this.WHY ON EARTH IS THIS MERCHANT OF DOOM STILL ALLOWED TO TRADE BY PAYPAL?WHY DO THEY CONTINUE TO ENDORSE A KNOWN AND PROVEN REPROBATE AND FLOUTING ALL APPLICABLE ETHICAL STANDARDS OF COMMERCIAL PRACTICE?A warning to anybody out there DON'T ORDER ANYTHING FROM WELBORNE LABS,you will never see your money again.

soundmotor
10-27-2007, 08:14 AM
Correct me if I'm wrong, but can't you sue in your home state small claims court?

It also seems that if everyone with a complaint against him unified and began sending written noticies to one Denver detective that action might be taken there.

Further, did anyone pay by mail?

If so, your local post office can get in on the act.

All the BBB can do is warn others off.

They cannot resolve anything.

PakProtector
10-27-2007, 09:09 AM
It also seems that if everyone with a complaint against him unified and began sending written noticies to one Denver detective that action might be taken there.



Let's see, RMAF was just in Denver...and nobody who got ripped off by Ron thought to take a break and pay him a visit? That would have made for a thread I'd like to read I think.
cheers,
Douglas

but seriously, SM's suggestion is a good one, somebody post a Denver detective's name and everybody can pille on.

Grumpy
10-27-2007, 10:31 AM
Let's see, RMAF was just in Denver...and nobody who got ripped off by Ron thought to take a break and pay him a visit? That would have made for a thread I'd like to read I think.
cheers,
Douglas

but seriously, SM's suggestion is a good one, somebody post a Denver detective's name and everybody can pille on.

That would have been a much easier task for those who attended RMAF if Welborne was there. They were not..

John Benevol
10-31-2007, 02:38 AM
RE WELBORNE LABS : any good folk out there seeking either a resolution or refund,I believe Ron is contactable on the following Email address (provided to me by Paypal)that is, providing he is either decent enough or man enough to face up to his responsibilities and reply...wlabs@wildblue.net.Good luck all,sincerely,John Benevoli.

clivetjm
10-31-2007, 04:59 AM
I frequent audio-talk, a UK based BB. One of the guys on there (Collin - Toppsy) ordered from Ron recently. He then heard about the problems some were having. It's pleasing to see that Toppsy has received the kit he ordered from Ron. His only gripe now is the £13 charge from Parcel Force for administering customs duty but we can't blame Ron for that!

http://www.audio-talk.co.uk/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=100&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=15

clivetjm
11-02-2007, 03:55 AM
It seems it was hasty to suggest a recent order with Ron worked out well. It seems some major parts are missing from said order.