Your favorite panel speakers....


The legendary quad ESL-57s, or the cool follow-up ESL-63? Carver Amazings, which, I hear, are "amazing", or the stylish and sublime Apogees? The affordable and much-loved Magneplanars, or the modern Martin Logans? Or is there another brand you favor?

Feel free to discuss the demands of the speakers on your gear (ohm loads, ect), the rarity of the models, the repairability of them, where they lack (usually bass response, it seems), where they excell (seemingly everywhere else), problems (tricky placement, glue drying, failures), pretty much it all.

Looking forward to some good responses...:thmbsp:

I have never heard the ESL's, but understand they are very good. The Martin Logans I listened to while very clear, always sounded dry and a bit etched to me. The Maggies have a warm enveloping sound, with a fast open midrange/top end, tight accurate bass and parts/repair is not an issue. The Apogees I've listened to didn't seem as seemless or coheriant across the frequency range. The Maggies are the only speaker I have listend to that truly dissapear. I never seem to say they sound good, rather the music is what sounds good. The Green Mountain Audio Continuum 1's they replaced were the best cone driver speaker I have owned, But I still listened to them more than the music with the same electronics.
I'm sure that there are High End speakers out there when connected to very High end electronics can do some amazing things. But, for the money the Maggie 1.6QR's to me are hard to beat.:banana::banana:
Jim

I worked in the same industrial park as Apogee, and actually painted a few of their custom color speakers. Nice speakers, wish I got the chance to listen to 'em.

Kelly (KFA888) has some "Superquad" Quad ESL 57s- I think Jensen supertweeters added to 'em. Mayber he'll chime in.

The Quads seem to be a bit of an effort to upkeep- at least the 57. The 63 seems to be an improvement in most areas- no beaming, wider soundstage, but not as nice a midrange. Dunno, as I've heard neither.

Maggies seem to be the best all-around bargain and performance.

I was not a fan of the pair of Martin Logans I heard, but that could have been source material and setup issues.

The Carver Amazings- never heard a bad word about them, only lots of praise.

bump.

What, are the panel fans too busy listening to their panels to respond?:scratch2::D

bump.

What, are the panel fans too busy listening to their panels to respond?:scratch2::D

Magnaplanar hands down ........ :banana::banana::banana:

The only panels I've ever heard have been MartinLogans... and they were terrific. Lottery winnings will finance my first pair.
Tom

I haven't listened to very many panel speakers..okay 1, but it was a doozy...Sound Lab A-1's. The 3-d imaging and reproduction of female voice absolutely blew me away.

I've heard panels from M/L and Magnepan. Between the two, as limited as my experience is, I prefer the Maggie sound.

I've not heard the other brands, but I would love to hear a set of Quads.

I've only seen the Carver Amazings pop up a few times over as many years. I've never heard a bad word about 'em.

I can imagine they're fairly rare speaker.

Here's a link to 'em..

http://www.stereophile.com/floorloudspeakers/290carver/

quad ESL 57 fans, a few links...

http://user.tninet.se/~vhw129w/mt_audio_design/quadpage.htm

http://www.audiophilia.com/hardware/Loudspeakers/reviews/quads.htm

http://www.nutshellhifi.com/MLS/MLS2.html

http://www.audioreview.com/cat/speakers/floorstanding-speakers/quad/PRD_120487_1594crx.aspx

Fans of the ESL-63s...

http://www.stereophile.com/floorloudspeakers/416/

http://www.quadesl.org/Hard_Core/ESL63History/esl63history.html

http://www.euronet.nl/users/temagm/audio/esl63.htm

http://www.audioreview.com/cat/speakers/floorstanding-speakers/quad/PRD_120486_1594crx.aspx

Apogee fans...

http://www.apogeespeakers.com/

http://www.apogeespeakers.com/mainpage.htm

http://www.apogeeacoustics.com/buyingguide.html

Martin Logans...

http://www.martinlogan.com/

I've always been a fan of Magnepans. Never had the chance to hear Quads or Apogees. Did have a limited exposure to Martin Logans, but they didn't do a lot for me (not certain whether it was the listening environment or the speakers at fault).

However, at last year's Fest, I had the chance to listen to a fully restored pair of KLH 9's:banana:. When I first entered the listening room, I thought they were one of the magnepan models. As I sat and listened to them, I was really impressed, they were so open with such incredible detail! After a while, I started looking for the subs:confused: as no Magnepan could have provided the bottom end that I was enjoying so much.

I finally had to reveal my ignorance and ask what they were:stupid: One more pair of speakers added to the dream list of gear that I'll never have:tears:

I'm almost afraid to listen to some of these, for fear of liking them too much and having to get them. Just like my fear of listening to tube equipment....

..Did have a limited exposure to Martin Logans, but they didn't do a lot for me (not certain whether it was the listening environment or the speakers at fault)...

I'm starting to think either the Martin Logans are either poorly executed or the stores that sell therm have them improperly set up or mated to electronics that aren't harmonious with them.

I'll give them the benefit of the doubt and go with the latter.

...However, at last year's Fest, I had the chance to listen to a fully restored pair of KLH 9's:banana:...

Yeah, dunno how I overlooked that in the list.

Probably because they're not often spoken of.

But I imagine they are great indeedy.

For people interested in the 9s...

http://www.stereophile.com/floorloudspeakers/666klh/

I'm a current Martin Logan owner and quite happy.
I've listened to the maggies and Quads and prefer the Logans.
Like most Electrostatics Logan's need and Amp with high Current and the ability to drive a low ohm impedance.

Don't forget the Finals, I've not heard them yet, but one of the guys on the Martin Logan Owners site sold his Summits and swears by them.

http://www.martinloganowners.com

I'm a current Martin Logan owner and quite happy.
I've listened to the maggies and Quads and prefer the Logans.
Like most Electrostatics Logan's need and Amp with high Current and the ability to drive a low ohm impedance.

Don't forget the Finals, I've not heard them yet, but one of the guys on the Martin Logan Owners site sold his Summits and swears by them.

http://www.martinloganowners.com

What's your experience with placement? Are they difficult?

I'm wondering if the fact I've heard Martin Logans primarily in the Best Buy/Magnolia showrooms (some being quite small and crammed with gear) and hooked up to all-digital gear is a culprit in the sound? It's gotta play at least a small role in it.



Are the Martin Logans sensitive to placement?


PS- I clicked on your "systems" link. Nice place! When can I stop by for a drink??

What's your experience with placement? Are they difficult?

I'm wondering if the fact I've heard Martin Logans primarily in the Best Buy/Magnolia showrooms (some being quite small and crammed with gear) and hooked up to all-digital gear is a culprit in the sound? It's gotta play at least a small role in it.



Are the Martin Logans sensitive to placement?


PS- I clicked on your "systems" link. Nice place! When can I stop by for a drink??

Logans can be difficult to place and the sweet spot is very narrow, but it is sweet!!

They need to be at least 3 feet from the backwall, and I prefer some absorption of the rear wave, others prefer diffusion. They also should be at least a couple of feet away from the side walls, and slightly toed in.

Logans are very sensitive, poor recordings will sound worse on them.
But good recordings come to life.

Women's vocals and jazz sound awesome on the Logans.

If your in Chicago the weekend of October 27th & 28th a few of us Loganites are gathering at my place, but you'll have to arm wrestle us for time in the sweet spot.

Your favorite panel speakers....


The legendary quad ESL-57s, or the cool follow-up ESL-63? Carver Amazings, which, I hear, are "amazing", or the stylish and sublime Apogees? The affordable and much-loved Magneplanars, or the modern Martin Logans? Or is there another brand you favor?

Feel free to discuss the demands of the speakers on your gear (ohm loads, ect), the rarity of the models, the repairability of them, where they lack (usually bass response, it seems), where they excell (seemingly everywhere else), problems (tricky placement, glue drying, failures), pretty much it all.

Looking forward to some good responses...:thmbsp:

For me, this hobby slipped into the background many years ago. Then, a couple of years ago, I caught a reference to a review of a modern speaker, in which the reviewer mentioned comparing them to Quads, and how they didn't stack up. For some reason, I noticed that same comment a couple more times, so I set off to learn something about them.

After some reading, I decided I wanted 63's, as I didn't want to deal with the amplification issues with the 57's. Finally found a set, however I'm still in the process of bringing them up to snuff.

What little bit I've heard from them, however, has blown me away. I'm mainly a rock and roll kind of guy, love deep bass. I've got Walsh 4's, F's, and now K-Horns. But the 63's are simply *amazing*, I found myself listening to tracks and artists I'd never pay much attention to, just because the quality of the sound was so good.

A good friend was so impressed he went out and bought a pair of Quad 989's, and I have spent some time listening to those. Best speaker I've ever heard, hands down.

I'll never give up my Walshes, I love the sound of them. Nor the K-Horns. But those Quads, wow!

I'm looking forward to hearing some of the others, but all I can say is I love my 63's!

bs

The original 1 ohm Apogees blew me away driven by big Krells.

...After some reading, I decided I wanted 63's, as I didn't want to deal with the amplification issues with the 57's...the 63's are simply *amazing*, I found myself listening to tracks and artists I'd never pay much attention to, just because the quality of the sound was so good.

A good friend was so impressed he went out and bought a pair of Quad 989's, and I have spent some time listening to those. Best speaker I've ever heard, hands down...

Oh man, I'd love to hear those 63s, or your friend's 989s...:thmbsp:

I had in the early 70's to the late 80's the Nines and powered them with a Futterman H3a. Since I lived in NYC, (still do) Julius the H3a designer, would come over my house listen to whatever vinyl was on the turntable and tweek my amp while listening. The last modification was to add a new bias supply and signed the underside of the transformer while doing so. He also left with me some external filtering electolytic capacitors which plugged into the front 8 pin sockets. I still remember the Nines as having the best sound I've heard. I own currently SoundLab A-3's yet they don't move me as the Nines did. My Nines met their demise when I went on vacation to calif and when i came back, the Nines where taken apart by the person watching my apt. At that time there was no means to their being repaired but i still have many of the parts such as the transformers and bass panels and a HF unit. I see that A.A. Janszens son has carried on his work, I am so tempted to listen to them.

Maggies forever since I heard my fist pair in 1971! Love the warm and very complete soundstage. I have heard Apogee`s, Quads, Amazing`s and many others. I like some but none does it for me like Maggies. JMHO