New Tascam Cassette Deck For Digitizing

[Westy]

Just an update after much debating and sucking teeth i finally found my perfect partner for the job its a minty Tascam 122 MKIII Pro with very little miles from Germany and i should be hopefully receiving it this week :)
the reason i went for this was it was the only new so to speak deck i could find that has Independent head azimuth adjustment & precision FG servo direct drive capstan motor, which will be perfect for digitizing mass produced cassettes
Heres some photos, feedback appreciated

http://home.arcor.de/daniel.casetta/ebay/122mk3.jpg
http://home.arcor.de/daniel.casetta/ebay/122mk3a.jpg

I am still on the lookout for a new sound card for this process , preferably internal as i need to run my speakers, earphones, turntable and now this cassette deck from it, so i would appreciate any options you have for a very good card, i understand the flaws with having an internal with regard to noise issues but I feel an internal would suit my needs better, someone mentioned the M-audio, which ive found a nice internal with lots of ports here

http://cgi.ebay.com/M-AUDIO-REVOLUTION-7-1-HI-DEF-SURROUND-SOUND-PCI-Card_W0QQitemZ280193408699QQihZ018QQcategoryZ41787 QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

thoughts on that?

i would also need a professional Y RCA cord from my deck to soundcard, is there such a thing? i just have the cheap one from radioshack
thanks for any help

[BrocLuno]

Love the M-Audio 24/96. They make many flavors, but all are solid performers. The biggest deal for those of us hooking to a computer direct is the "port cable". Make sure it has the jacks and connections you need. My 24/96 came with an 8 port cable (2 RCA in, 2 RCA out, 2 DIN in/out and one MIDI). I think that is a good combination as it will interface with much Euro equipment like B&O TT, etc. Very sweet deal. And it comes with software that you can fool around with while learning the ins and out of digital conversion :)

Oh - the deck - great score and lovely piece of kit :) :) :)

[x_25]

I have also heard good things about M-audio. Although if I was going to be digitizing like that I would spend a bit more money and get the Audiophile 2496 (http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/Audiophile2496-main.html) for $120. Or if you have a more than that to splurge on a sound card there is the Delta 1010LT (http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/Delta1010LT-main.html) for $250. I haven't personally used eather of them but I have heard good things about them.

[Westy]

Thanks for the replies guys, it seems the general consensus is M-Audio 24/96.
excuse my ignorance but will i be able to have both turntable and cassette deck into both line-in (2 RCA ports) ready for digitizing when needed?
I also need to be have a port for for my speakers which has a sub woofer and i need a port for my earphones so i can listen to clean pops and crackles after ive digitized?
this is important to me, as i listen to everything from my hard drive :music:
thanks guys

[Scorpion8]

Looks great!

[Vintage TX]

Sweet !!
I love those Tascam's models, treat to listen too:thmbsp:

[Westy]

Love the M-Audio 24/96. They make many flavors, but all are solid performers. The biggest deal for those of us hooking to a computer direct is the "port cable". Make sure it has the jacks and connections you need. My 24/96 came with an 8 port cable (2 RCA in, 2 RCA out, 2 DIN in/out and one MIDI). I think that is a good combination as it will interface with much Euro equipment like B&O TT, etc. Very sweet deal. And it comes with software that you can fool around with while learning the ins and out of digital conversion :)

Oh - the deck - great score and lovely piece of kit :) :) :)

hi thanks for the reply
is this the version you mean with the 8 ports?
http://www.gigasonic.com/ebay_image/product/audiophile192.jpg

[Westy]

Anyone help me out on this? still looking for a new soundcard and unsure which one to go for :scratch2:
need something that will accept headphones aswell, or how i would accomplish it without having to plug my speakers out every time
cheers

[BrocLuno]

hi thanks for the reply
is this the version you mean with the 8 ports?
http://www.gigasonic.com/ebay_image/product/audiophile192.jpg

Yes, That's the one - It has the afore mentioned RCA connectors, Two DIN connectors (One can be used with your TASCAM :yes:) and the normal 1/8 inch sound card ports. Should do the job just fine :music: There will be enough ports for all your needs if your equipment is configured to match. For instance, you can run a B&O Turntable into the other DIN port and still have the RCAs free for whatever you want :D

[SPL db]

:lurk:

[Westy]

Yes, That's the one - It has the afore mentioned RCA connectors, Two DIN connectors (One can be used with your TASCAM :yes:) and the normal 1/8 inch sound card ports. Should do the job just fine :music: There will be enough ports for all your needs if your equipment is configured to match. For instance, you can run a B&O Turntable into the other DIN port and still have the RCAs free for whatever you want :D


thanks for the detailed explanation, seems like its the one to go for. Connecting my cassette and vinyl via the DIM connectors will that allow me digitize or playback only? I will be using powered monitors from this aswell and they don't have a headphone jack on them nor do I have a amp as my turntable has one built in, so would it be possible to have headphones attached at the same time as the speakers? to save me unplugging the wires every time. so all in ill have

Monitors
Cassette Deck
Turntable
Headphones

and what cabels/leads will i need? lol sorry to be a pain in the ass but ive never set something like this up before and need to source everything asap
thanks guys

[SaSi]

I am not sure if the M-audio 24/96 has a dedicated phono input. They are similar to microphone inputs in term of sensitivity, but the phono input needs a RIAA playback equalization curve.

You say your TT has an amplifier built in (??) What model is it? What outputs does it have?

I have been where you are and almost immediately deciced my old amplifier was going to become part of the project. Everything connected to the amplifier and the PC soundcard in TAPE-2 connectors. This allows recording of any source to the PC and dubbing from the TAPE-1 (cassette deck) to TAPE-2 (PC).

[manderson]

I don't understand why you're so hard set an an internal sound card. External sound cards for your application are much better suited. Even a single or dual input will do better by avoiding electronic noise inside the computer and also provide convenient input and output patch capability. Nevertheless, what you need is a GOOD mixer. I use an Allen & Heath MixWizard3 , but the new Mackie's are pretty comparable in sound quality for much less. "Think outside the bun!" You can port any audio component you want into one computer record input, which sounds like your ultimate objective. I still recommend the Audiofire2 or 4, having a headphone output right on the front panel.

------------------

Forgot to mention:

Keep digging and get it right the first time. You did it with the tape deck. Gorgeous! I love it. There was a great Tandberg on eBay a couple days ago, with the manual azimuth adjustment and all that. I almost went for it, but I'm more into making CD's.

[Westy]

I am not sure if the M-audio 24/96 has a dedicated phono input. They are similar to microphone inputs in term of sensitivity, but the phono input needs a RIAA playback equalization curve.

You say your TT has an amplifier built in (??) What model is it? What outputs does it have?

My Turntable is a Audio Technica AT-PL50 with two RCA outputs on the rear

I have been where you are and almost immediately deciced my old amplifier was going to become part of the project. Everything connected to the amplifier and the PC soundcard in TAPE-2 connectors. This allows recording of any source to the PC and dubbing from the TAPE-1 (cassette deck) to TAPE-2 (PC).

I have contemplated using a Amplifier but Id rather not go to the expense as I wouldn't really use it, because everything is digitized to My PC and playback is through my monitors, Thanks for your input though much appreciated

I don't understand why you're so hard set an an internal sound card. External sound cards for your application are much better suited. Even a single or dual input will do better by avoiding electronic noise inside the computer and also provide convenient input and output patch capability. Nevertheless, what you need is a GOOD mixer. I use an Allen & Heath MixWizard3 , but the new Mackie's are pretty comparable in sound quality for much less. "Think outside the bun!" You can port any audio component you want into one computer record input, which sounds like your ultimate objective. I still recommend the Audiofire2 or 4, having a headphone output right on the front panel.

I am hard set on a internal soundcard because everything is on my pc that I Play, So if i bought an external id still need an internal to listen to my media on my PC? Id ned an firewire card also which I dont have. TBH I wouldn't use a mixer or could afford its price tag, this is simply for my vinyl, cassette, monitors and playback, I wouldn't get the use out of a full mixer or have the room for it or could i justify spending the money on one unless I was going to become a producer or something :music:
thanks for your input though, it really means alot, I think ill just go for the M-AUDIO card and pull wires whenever needs be, seems to be the only solution to my lazy ways :thmbsp:
Once the A/D conversion is excellent that will do me just fine. the only card i have found on the market that would be better then the m-audio and have all the ports i could ever want would be the RME HDSP 9632 card but with a pricetag of $500+ I just cannot justify it

[BrocLuno]

The AT PL50 is not the best TT to use, but it will get you started well enough to see where you want to go with this. It will also afford you time while messing about to get the best equipment/cabling arrangement planned out as you change bits around working toward your next level (vinyl). You have the cassette side figured out.

The M-Audio board does not have a phono amp. You'll need one. Either the one in the TT (pretty noisy low performance amp as I hear), or a Hagerman Bugle or similar (highly recomemmended). You're doing OK so far. Just tighten up your plan and keep trucking.

I don't use the Euro DIN connections on my card, but they are two way as I understand it. You'll need a DIN cable that you can pick up at the local music equipment shop or off the 'Bay. The DIN connection is most often used for keyboards and mixers as it's pretty robust and minimizes the number of cable runs needed by the sound engineers at a concert/show set-up. It's a good way to get the signal in/out.

[manderson]

I am hard set on a internal soundcard because everything is on my pc that I Play, So if i bought an external id still need an internal to listen to my media on my PC? Id ned an firewire card also which I dont have.
External cards work exactly the same as internal, it's just that all of the signals are processed through the firewire port rather than the PCI bus. You can play all of your computer media with any external card. Of course, if you don't have a firewire port, enough said (except a firwire PCI card is only around $30.00).

Money's always a factor. You are obviously doing the right thing by shopping around to get the best for your money. I have been doing this stuff a long time and I am just a very strong proponent of external sound cards. So don't pay any attention to me if it's not what you want.

[Westy]

External cards work exactly the same as internal, it's just that all of the signals are processed through the firewire port rather than the PCI bus. You can play all of your computer media with any external card. Of course, if you don't have a firewire port, enough said (except a firwire PCI card is only around $30.00).
Money's always a factor. You are obviously doing the right thing by shopping around to get the best for your money. I have been doing this stuff a long time and I am just a very strong proponent of external sound cards. So don't pay any attention to me if it's not what you want.

Hey thanks for that, To be honest I didn't know how they worked and was very uneducated about them and upon further reading I found out that your firewire card can actually power your soundcard, so no need for a plug, that was one of my concerns was more wires and more plugs and more mess. I haven't ruled out getting an external and the more I look into them the more im falling in love :banana:
can you recommend a good PCI firewire card that will power my soundcard and have all necessary ports for the future? and also some of the best external cards on the market besides the Audiofire you've already mentioned
thanks guys much oblidged, this is a great forum with great members

[Westy]

The AT PL50 is not the best TT to use, but it will get you started well enough to see where you want to go with this. It will also afford you time while messing about to get the best equipment/cabling arrangement planned out as you change bits around working toward your next level (vinyl). You have the cassette side figured out.

The M-Audio board does not have a phono amp. You'll need one. Either the one in the TT (pretty noisy low performance amp as I hear), or a Hagerman Bugle or similar (highly recomemmended). You're doing OK so far. Just tighten up your plan and keep trucking.

I don't use the Euro DIN connections on my card, but they are two way as I understand it. You'll need a DIN cable that you can pick up at the local music equipment shop or off the 'Bay. The DIN connection is most often used for keyboards and mixers as it's pretty robust and minimizes the number of cable runs needed by the sound engineers at a concert/show set-up. It's a good way to get the signal in/out.

hey thanks alot man, you've been a great help thus far. the ATPL50 is a no thrills turntable with preamp, only cost me like $80. ive digitized with it a few times and results have been impeccable to be honest, I cant say a bad word about it, It does exactly what it says on the tin
In your opinion what would you regard as a very good turntable? I dont want any antiques, built in pre-amp is a nice feature, but usually i'd assume they're bottom of the rung in terms of quality

[Westy]

heres some ive been recommended that will have everything i need, and wont cost the earth, whats the pick of the bunch?

1) M-Audio Firewire Audiophile (External)

2) Native Instruments Audio Kontrol 1 (External)

3) M-Audio Delta 10/10 (Internal / PCI)

4) M-Audio Delta 66 (Internal & External / PCI)

5) Tascam US-144 (External)

[BrocLuno]

I suspect they are all good. I have not used any of these models, so I can't comment on individual unit features or performance. I will say that there are pros and cons to external. Must remember that folks like Tangerine Dream used to process all their synth music on internal boards tapped into their mixers, so I've never been convinced that it ALWAYS better to go external? It's like phono amps - sometimes it works out better, sometimes it's no improvement?

I decided not to go that way for two reasons - 1.) don't want to use up external ports on PC as it/they have other intermittent work like hooking to cameras, card readers, external HDDs, etc. So I don't want to have to unplug the stereo to use them. 2.) My audio systems are not that critical. By that I mean that a well designed internal board spaced one card bay away from all other cards inside the PC is quiet enough to do the job. All the other bits in my systems make more background noise than the sound card in my PC.

Now, remember I'm running an ASUS server board without on board graphics or embedded sound card. etc. It's a very clean mother board and the stray signals are very minimal. Your PC may not be that quiet internally?

External processors sometimes require a wall wart (power supply) too. So that adds to the cabling issues near the PC. All audio equipment needs cables in and out and the mess behind the equipment can get pretty frightening pretty quickly. Lately I have gone to video grade patch cables because they are quieter (better shielding), more robust connectors AND they come in colors, so I can tell which pairs go between which components. Adding an external sound processor, wall wart and cabling is adding too much to MY set-ups. Internal is just cleaner, FOR ME. Your results may vary, etc?

[manderson]

I suspect they are all good. I have not used any of these models, so I can't comment on individual unit features or performance. I will say that there are pros and cons to external. Must remember that folks like Tangerine Dream used to process all their synth music on internal boards tapped into their mixers, so I've never been convinced that it ALWAYS better to go external? It's like phono amps - sometimes it works out better, sometimes it's no improvement?

I decided not to go that way for two reasons - 1.) don't want to use up external ports on PC as it/they have other intermittent work like hooking to cameras, card readers, external HDDs, etc. So I don't want to have to unplug the stereo to use them. 2.) My audio systems are not that critical. By that I mean that a well designed internal board spaced one card bay away from all other cards inside the PC is quiet enough to do the job. All the other bits in my systems make more background noise than the sound card in my PC.

Now, remember I'm running an ASUS server board without on board graphics or embedded sound card. etc. It's a very clean mother board and the stray signals are very minimal. Your PC may not be that quiet internally?

External processors sometimes require a wall wart (power supply) too. So that adds to the cabling issues near the PC. All audio equipment needs cables in and out and the mess behind the equipment can get pretty frightening pretty quickly. Lately I have gone to video grade patch cables because they are quieter (better shielding), more robust connectors AND they come in colors, so I can tell which pairs go between which components. Adding an external sound processor, wall wart and cabling is adding too much to MY set-ups. Internal is just cleaner, FOR ME. Your results may vary, etc?


BrocLuno makes some good points. My system is set up as a small home recording studio. I have the external AudioFire12 with all inputs patched one-for-one to individual channel mixer outputs using a Mogami snake cable custom made by "hotwiredcables.com". This is the reason I chose the Allen & Heath mixer, because very few others have individual channel outputs, so it is perfectly suited for multi-track computer sequencing. My PC is also a special built "Quiet" computer which I built myself with most components purchased from "endpcnoise.com". Ultimate "no noise" was one of my major goals when putting the system together, both mechanically and electronically. But this is because of my application, and a little noise may not be as much of an issue for you. Having worked in the electronics and computer field my entire life, I will always argue against internal sound cards because of internal electronic generated noise, however, I will swallow my pride just this once and grant that it is not always noticeably critical with a good internal card.

I can't comment too much on the quality of the sound cards you have listed. My recommendation for the less expensive 2 and 4 channel EchoAudio products is based on the excellent performance I have experienced with the AudioFire12. It's like everything else. There is so much gear out there that it's really impossible to "test drive" all of it. Read all the reviews you can find and keep asking questions until you find the right one for you. I bought my father the AudioFire4 for Christmas 2006. He has an output from his home audio preamp feeding one set of inputs and can record vinyl, cassette, reel-to-reel, radio and anything he wants to the computer just by changing his preamp input selection. He as one of the outputs also running to an input on his preamp so he can play all of his computer media through the home audio system. Pretty thorough setup if you ask me, using only a four channel sound card which is really only utilizing two channels.