electrostatic headphones

[JGlenn]

Is there any reason now to use a pair of electrostatics with my magnavox 175? I have read that it may not work well with electrostatic speakers due to the impeadence issues, should I assume the same is true for the headphones ?

[JGlenn]

anybody?

[Aage]

Don't most ESH (ElectroStatic Headphones) come with a coupling box that connects to the speaker outs?

If so, I would assume the issue to be soved.

[JGlenn]

yes these ones do and thats exactly what I was wondering

[hammr7]

Most headphone jacks bypass the amplifier, so there shouldn't be any major problem with impedance matching. My old electrostatic headphones have been used on numerous pre-amps, cassette decks, receivers and integrated amps without problem. My guess is they would perform in a similar manner on portable CD players, satellite radio units, and Ipods as well.

[Aage]

yes these ones do and thats exactly what I was wondering

Then you're OK: the box is meant to simulate an 8-ohm load to your amp, so I don't think you will have any problem at all using it.

[mhardy6647]

Electrostatics (and electrets) run off the power amp via an adaptor box.

I think the OP's concern is an extrapolation of the difficult impedance load that electrostatic speakers (e.g., Quad ESL-57) present to a power amplifier. Electrostatics are quite reactive loads, and the load impedance is very low at high frequencies. Less stable amplifiers tend to go berserk when loaded with electrostatic speakers.

I don't know anything about electrostatic headphones, but I assume they load an amplifier similarly to electrostatic speakers. That said, I would assume that a Maggotbox amp wouldn't be unhappy driving an electrostatic speaker or headphone. I'd test it, gently (low volumes) at first. Probably not much risk of damaging the headphones, but I cannot guarantee that!

[hammr7]

I'm confused! I'm assuming the Magnavox 175 is a tube amp. I also assume that you have the black box (bias supply and amplifier) for your electrostatic headphones. Most electrostatics that have the black box are looking for line level (not amplified) feeds. In such instances you don't need another amplifier.

[mhardy6647]

Most electrostatics that have the black box are looking for line level (not amplified) feeds.
Are you sure about that? This isn't my understanding. Can you provide examples? (not trying to be difficult, I'm just confused now, too).

EDIT: whilst googling this very topic, I DID discover that Koss still makes electrostatic headphones. I did not know that!

EDIT^2: I did just find the ESP950 documentation online and confirm that its "energizer" does indeed take a line-level input! Sorry for my ignorance.
see: http://www.koss.com/koss/kossweb.nsf/csfapm

[stuwee]

I used to have a pair of AKG K340's electrostatic high and mids,dynamic lows, my little Sanyo Plus series int. amp drove them loud no problem,then I bought my SAE amp and pre, had to turn the pre all the way up for just a low sound, the pre has output metters on it and they were all the way in the red, I drive my Martin Logan electrostatic speakers no problem with SAE, so I don't understand either?:scratch2:
Craig

[pdennis]

Brief clarification:

Electrostatic headphones can be run off of an amp (that takes line level input), or an adaptor box (that you hook up to the speaker outputs on your own amp or receiver).

If your amp puts out at least 15 or 20 watts, I can't imagine that you would be stressing it by running electrostatics off of it through a transformer. Headphones have to move so much less air than a big ol' ES panel. I'm not an expert though, so I could be mistaken.

[Grainger49]

. . . I have read that it may not work well with electrostatic speakers due to the impeadence issues, should I assume the same is true for the headphones ?

The same thing is probably true with the headphones. They include some impedance matching device like electrostatic speakers. If your amp has problems with electrostatic speakers electrostatic headphones are likely the same.

But....... try it and keep the volume low. Periodically check the heat coming off your amp. If it has a problem with the impedance, heat will tell you so.

Then if everything is ok, increase the volume and keep checking.

What matters is what really works, not hearsay.

[hammr7]

Electrostatic headphones have a capacitive operating nature, not a resistive one like regular (i.e. moving coil or miniature) headphones and most regular speakers. It is voltage rather than wattage that is important. Depending upon the specific electrostatic headphones, the voltage maximums can be anywhere from 100V to 1,000V.

Headphones don't have to be played at maximum volume. Therefor many, if not most, tube amps have the voltages; but being able to tap them appropriately is another story.

[Grainger49]

hammr7, I am thinking from your earlier post that your ESH have a more versatile "Box" than most I have seen. The fact that a headset output works well with yours makes them special. The ones I am familiar with have speaker lead attachments to the amp. (Koss, AKG, and Stax are the ones I sold) And the worries of JGlenn that electrostatic speakers cause problems is appropriate for electrostatic headphones. I'll bet he doesn't have the option of using the headphone jack.

And I have been an electrostatic guy since the early 70s. So . . .


Electrostatic headphones have a capacitive operating nature, not a resistive one like regular (i.e. moving coil or miniature) headphones and most regular speakers.

You are right in that the electrostatic panels themselves are capacitive in nature. The impedance matching device I mentioned is usually a step up transformer, which is inductive (including a bias voltage fed center tapped into the secondary of the step up transformer). The combination of the capacitive panels and inductive step up transformers can drive many amplifiers to ruin. Most "regular" speakers/headphones are coils, therefore inductive in nature the move according to L(di/dt) which you can see is dominated by the reactive (inductive) part of the load. Coils are current devices. Regular speakers are only resistive in the case of magnetic plainer speakers.


It is voltage rather than wattage that is important. Depending upon the specific electrostatic headphones, the voltage maximums can be anywhere from 100V to 1,000V.

Yes, an electrostatic panel, speaker or headset, moves due to the magnitude of the voltage fed it, rather than the current (not wattage). It is a voltage device. That is why most electrostatic transformers trade current for voltage in a step up configuration.


Headphones don't have to be played at maximum volume. Therefore many, if not most, tube amps have the voltages; but being able to tap them appropriately is another story.

To access the high voltage swings available in a tubed amplifier you will have to tap into the primary of the output transformer. Not something you do unless you know what you are looking for. Tubed amps with NFB do not like to "See" an open load at the speaker terminals.

SET amps don't care about an open secondary.