View Full Version : Ending the Loudness Wars.....


Darkspeed
06-10-2008, 11:09 PM
I'm a musician and an audio engineer. Over the past few years of working in my home studio, I've struggled at times with the notion that my music has to meet "industry RMS levels" which were generally put in place to compete on FM radio and it's broadcast limitations ..... Since reading the following article a while back , in the link I'm about to post, I think I've begun coming to terms with the fact that I'd rather have dynamics in my music then a massive headache from overly compressed signals. Are y'all with me. I bet most of you feel the exact same way. In the process of recording these days in the digital realm, we have a full 120dB dynamic range. The majority of what is released these days is pinned between OdB and -3dB.......That's like going to see an orchestra playing fortissimo all the time. Dynamism is what makes music human. We are still humans dammit!!! Anyway here is the link......A lot of you should already know who this man is. For those who don't, now you do......Peace.


http://www.barrydiamentaudio.com/loudness.htm

westend
06-10-2008, 11:46 PM
Very rewarding article. Playing Art's clips at the present and likin' 'em. Thanks:banana:

vincei
06-10-2008, 11:47 PM
Yep, nothing worst than highly compressed, distorted and clipped audio. I wonder what that is doing to our speakers. Luckily I avoid most of the new music today....:D

Gibsonian
06-11-2008, 05:50 AM
It's pretty easy to distinguish a recording that is clipping/compressed, and they don't tend to stay in the cd player very long in my house. Sadly, alot of good music just doesn't get listened to because of this. Look forward to recordings done properly in the future - maybe a labeling system to identify when digital clipping/compression is not part of t he recording??

Old1625
06-11-2008, 08:01 AM
Great article. :thmbsp:

As for dynamics I am for trying to find as real a recording as possible--one that captures as much of the dynamics of an orchestra or other performance.

But that doesn't comprise my entire listening enjoyment. Much of the classical music library I have is enjoyable to listen to on the house audio equipment here, but totally useless in the car, as road noise kills the low level stuff and the limitations of power in a typical automotive audio system kills the high level fortissimo stuff. So in the car I'm apt to listen to the typical "gain brained" studio stuff--mostly pop music or top 100, as it all falls within a certain db range.

As for live vs what is heard over audio equipment I think we can come close, but will almost always be able to tell one from the other. I've been to jazz and swing concerts, and can appreciate the difference. The Artie Shaw orchestra concerts I've been to have taught me that it would take some powerful audio equipment to duplicate the spl that band can generate.

It's a small wonder that most of the older folks I've known in my time seem to suffer a degree of hearing impairment.

Mystic
06-11-2008, 09:23 AM
....A lot of you should already know who this man is...



I sure know about him & have been gathering up Diament-mastered CDs at every opportunity. For starts, Barry's mastering of the Bob Marley & The Wailers album series is remarkable. He also did some nice work on Zep, U2, CSN and ELP material.

stuwee
06-11-2008, 10:08 AM
Just send e-mails to the record companies and producers of this dreck and, start sending the offending recordings back. Begging for not only a refund but, damages for pain and suffering:D

Sorry, don't beg, DEMAND:smoke:

edit: since this post is gettin' pushed down, I'm not speaking of Mr. Diaments work, but, the compressed format CD's

KeninDC
06-11-2008, 10:59 AM
Mr. Diament mastered the early, non-remastered (by Jimmy Page) Led Zep CDs. His HotH is an example of just how good a CD can sound.

Look for the CDs that are "produced," NOT "remastered" by Jimmy Page if you want a Diament offering.

superdog
06-11-2008, 12:21 PM
Yep, nothing worst than highly compressed, distorted and clipped audio. I wonder what that is doing to our speakers. Luckily I avoid most of the new music today....:D

I also avoid most new music.I have found that some of the new I do like that is compressed is more listenable on a lesser setup.

Zeromancer
06-11-2008, 02:28 PM
I also avoid most new music.I have found that some of the new I do like that is compressed is more listenable on a lesser setup.
If I do find newer music/artists that I like - I look for a vinyl release first.
I hardly even buy any cd's now - except blank cd-r's

slow_jazz
06-11-2008, 03:41 PM
I can't stand compressed recordings. No range too them. When you try to turn them up they just distort to unlistenable sounds.

resqguy
06-11-2008, 05:27 PM
From the article:

Music lovers have to ask why their records should be tailored for the lowest common denominator listening situations. Why not have a "compress" button on the player, either in the car or at home and leave the record itself whole for those occasions when we want all of the music?


Why not, indeed.

And the truth shall set you free!!

Mr. Lin
06-11-2008, 06:01 PM
That's a great article, it really spells out why compression is a bad thing.

ShaneC
06-11-2008, 06:03 PM
Music lovers have to ask why their records should be tailored for the lowest common denominator listening situations. Why not have a "compress" button on the player, either in the car or at home and leave the record itself whole for those occasions when we want all of the music?

Wasn't that called the "Loud" button?

the-real-mandak
06-11-2008, 06:07 PM
Dynamism is what makes music human. We are still humans dammit!!!

Only one argument against dynamism... money - It all ends there.

To those of you who turned away from new musik, get the "new" Radiohead relase (the box). It is properly the best new audiophile releas in the last few years. The box contains the album on 2x180g vinyl running at 45 rpm. All analouge from instrument to you're ears.

Good sound is out there, you just have to look for it.

ShaneC you mean the loudness button? it is like a kind of pre set EQ, it boosts the high and low at lover volume. It do not compress anything.

no1maestro
06-11-2008, 07:55 PM
Excellent article, good writing and a real explanation in down-to-earth language. Thanks for the link. I did a lot of recording, mostly analog, and only a couple of digital sessions but we fought to keep the dynamics as "real" as possible in the case of music. The only times I can imagine when compression should be used is on commercials. I know they did that in my commercial sessions.

Again, thanks for the link!!

Acoustic
06-11-2008, 10:17 PM
I've always thought why not let people have a choice and put a compression 'knob' on gear, mainly to adjust to there listening enviroment. Even my Comcast cable box has a few levels of compression to choose from.