I am an old two-channel analog guy that realizes that I need to step up to today's technology. I don't think that I will give up my old analog gear but it is apparent that I need to integrate today's digital storage and delivery technology with yesterday's equipment.

I want a music server that is independent of the computer(s) on my home network. After doing quite a bit of reading here on AK in the Digital Formats & Music server Forums, I think I need a NAS device with at least two drives so that the primary drive is automatically backed up onto a separate hard drive. It also seems that the Logitech Squeezebox Duet is the way to go for me but I am so new to digital that I am not sure yet. My head is spinning but I think I have narrowed things down somewhat.

Here is what I want to do:

* Rip all of my Cd's to a Hard drive in a lossless format with tags and artwork similar to iTunes (format yet to be determined but will probably become clear after more reading and further explanation).
* Allow the music server to be accessed from several locations with analog (for now at least) systems in my home. A few of these locations will have a PC located with them but others will not. For those that do not a remote control with a small LCD type of display will be necessary. I do have a hybrid wired / wireless network in my home but running additional wires is no problem at all for me.
* I do not necessarily need to access the music server from outside of my home network, at least I don't think I will want to.
* I would like to have the music server integrate easily with iTunes for the purpose of downloading playlists from the server to my iPod touch.
* While I do not presently have any audio gear that has digital inputs I want to make sure that whatever hardware I choose today will be compatible with both analog and digital equipment as it now exists. I can see this as my gateway into the world of digital audio in the not so distant future.:music:
* I like the idea of having the NAS being independent of but fully compatible with the computer(s) and the music delivery hardware like the iPod and the Squeezebox.

Like I said, I am new to digital audio. This is all new to me. I am not an IT person but have a general understanding of basic networks. Keeping this as simple and easy for me as possible is a real plus. If someone made a music server in-a-box much like a home theatre in-a box, I would be a good candidate for that. Realistically, I would be one that would opt for ease of installation and ease of use over having the absolute best performance. I did see that Logitech has partnered with NetGear to integrate their NAS devices with the Squeezebox Duet but I don't know enough about RAID devices to even guess which one would be a good choice. To give you an idea of the potential HD size that will be required, at this time I have 250 ~400 Cd's (and more coming all the time as people seem to be abandoning their collections) and approximately 1,000 LPs, of which I will only want to rip perhaps 200 ~ 300 to a digital format. Oh, the other thing is that I have a 530 Mhz Pentium 4 Media Center PC. The specs on the Squeezebox call for a 733 Mhz PC. If I will be using a current model NAS from Netgear does that matter?

Whew! Thanks for bearing with me through all that! I will appreciate any suggestions and guidance that can be offered as well as points to threads that I may have overlooked or need to re-visit.

Rich, if you do any tutoring I will bring your favorite beer! :D

I think I need a NAS device with at least two drives so that the primary drive is automatically backed up onto a separate hard drive.

I think you are describing 'RAID'. There are various types of RAID, identified by number. One of them would be the redundant live backup type. Just remember that a lightning strike will take out both drives, so some sort of non-live backup to USB drive has merit also.


* Rip all of my Cd's to a Hard drive in a lossless format with tags and artwork similar to iTunes (format yet to be determined but will probably become clear after more reading and further explanation).

I think you want FLAC. The squeezebox works fine with FLAC. FLAC supports tags and embedded images.


* Allow the music server to be accessed from several locations with analog (for now at least) systems in my home. A few of these locations will have a PC located with them but others will not.

You can use a PC as part of a squeezebox installation. I use the squeezebox server software (slimserver) and only a PC as the playback device. The software is free, so you can experiment with the system without buying anything. Add a duet if you decide you like it.

* I like the idea of having the NAS being independent of but fully compatible with the computer(s) and the music delivery hardware like the iPod and the Squeezebox.

250 ~400 Cd's (and more coming all the time as people seem to be abandoning their collections).

Weird, I've noticed people selling off CD collections as they move everything to PC. Not only must this not cool from a copyright perspective, but I'll bet some people are archiving to lossy formats like MP3, and not doing proper backups and stuff. I saw someone selling 600 discs at a garage sale last week. He told me he had backups and redundant copies and stuff, but admitted he was a bit nervous selling the discs. I plan to keep all of my physical CDs, just as a final backup.

Oh, the other thing is that I have a 530 Mhz Pentium 4 Media Center PC. The specs on the Squeezebox call for a 733 Mhz PC. If I will be using a current model NAS from Netgear does that matter?


I have about 275 CDs ripped to FLAC and it takes about 100Gig of disc. My server (which is also the player in my case) is a P3 550. It plays the music fine, but the web browser interface is too slow. This server also runs some other software, but I think the 550 is too slow overall. Not sure if the bottleneck is CPU or disk speed or what.

I definitely recommend ripping a few discs and trying out the squeezebox software. I use EAC for ripping to FLAC. A bit confusing, but supposedly EAC does a good job.

"Independent of the computer" is the hard part here, unless you want to (a) spend big bucks, or (b) get into serious high-tech DIY. Our member hpsenicka (who occasionally visits State College :)) has put together a nice DIY system that does what you want, at a pretty reasonable price (he had it in my room at Fest 2007), but I couldn't begin to tell you how to do it. You will likely need a computer for the actual ripping, I think.

Wow, thanks bholio! I appreciate your time and expertise. A few more pieces of the puzzle are now in place. And thanks Rich as well. The "independent of the computer" part is only that I would like to be certain that the music files are not only physically located outside of the computer but that the software to access them is not dependant on the computer or any one program. I want to avoid having to rip all of that music a second time when the computer gets replaced for any reason or if a newer kind of user interface software or device is introduced. On an ongoing day-to-day basis and for ripping new music to the storage device, I am fine with using one of the computers to do so. Maybe once I get a little bit further along with this project I will run my thoughts and plans past you, Henry, bholio and anyone else that cares to hear about them. :D

I have set up a network storage link device called the NSLU2. If I am not mistaken, AK'er hpsenicka uses the same device.

You can connect up to 2 USB drives to the NSLU2. To run a music server on the NSLU2, some hacking into the NSLU2 is needed, which is somewhat tricky. But instructions are available on the web. I read the instructions 5-6 times before actually doing it. It is very easy to entirely hose the NSLU2.

I hacked the NSLU2 and loaded onto it a linux variant called uNSLUng. A 250GB USB hard-drive is connected to the NSLU2. This drive stores all the music I have ripped so far. I use the FLAC (lossless) format, ripped using the EAC software.

For the music server, I installed the Slimserver (for squeezebox) and the Firefly (for the Roku) server. The slimserver ran really slowly on the NSLU2, and I gave up on that route. Firefly (also called mt-daapd) ran very well.

For a time, I was using the Roku as the music delivery device into my stereo.

The advantage with Firefly as the music server is that it will integrate with Itunes. That is, the NSLU2 and attached harddrive with music can be added to your Itunes library.

A picture, as they say, is worth many words. So, here is a schematic of my current set up. I do not use the Roku anymore.

http://home.att.net/~agopalak/wsb/media/70320/site1084.JPG

The "W1 Sender" and "W1 Receiver" are part of the Audioengine wireless adapter package that I recently acquired.

Hope this helps.

Ashok

I believe Sonos makes something that is plug in play that works with a NAS. You may be able to find more about it on this forum. I seem to remember that at least one person owned it.

I leave my computer on all the time and have found that it works for my purposes. My PS3, Roku, PSP, IO Data Linkplayer all share files located on it or on a NAS that is plugged into the network. My iTunes library is pointed at a USB drive plugged into the NAS and it works without a hitch.

If you plan to share playlists on iTunes, you will probably want to use Apple Lossless for your music.

Also, your iPod Touch can be used to control the Slimserver web interface that works with a Roku and most likely the Squeezebox. I wrote a bit about it here. (http://www.blog.uofmtiger.com/2008/01/05/ipod-touch-roku-perfection/)

The newest Touch software can be used to control iTunes that you have on a computer. This makes it easy to run a feed from the computer to a stereo and control it without sitting next to your PC (as long as iTunes is up and running on it).

This all looks really great. I feel like I am on the right track but am somewhat overwhelmed - as I expected. I will need to go slow and take it one step at a time. My main concern is that I start with the right underpinnings of the central storage location and file format so that I can make changes to the method(s) of access hardware and software as I grow into the 21st century. (The rest of my audio gear is barely half-way through the 20th!) Now, can I control the 8-track tape deck with the Squeezebox? I wonder if it has a USB connector on it somewhere. :scratch2:

Thanks again everyone. I really do appreciate you taking the time to post your advice. :thmbsp:

Ashok has provided a nice high-level description of a good solution.

For me, the Roku Soundbridge is still the preferred "client" device. I have 2 Roku units connected to 2 different systems. In both cases, the Soundbridge is feeding digital outputs to an external Entech DAC, which in turn provides analog signal to my stereo system AUX inputs.

A computer is used to rip music CDs into the FLAC digital file format, and store them on the NSLU2 device, which acts as both a file server, and a streaming media server.

The computer is not required for day-to-day operation, as I use the Roku handheld remote as the primary user interface.

A computer can be used if you prefer, but one of my goals was to be able to enjoy music without having to have a computer in the same room.

I've not had a real pleasant experience with my NAS. I bought an open box 1TB Maxtor Shared Storage II. It arrived DOA as did the next two. I sent the last one back to Maxtor for a new one as the seller, CDW, could only send me ones that don't work. Apparently, they don't check any of the returned items to see if they actually work. Note to self, never buy open box items from CDW. Once my new, working unit arrived, it was a snap to get setup. I will say that the technical support at Maxtor is excellent. After about a month, I started experiencing some issues with the unit. I attributed it to the inefficient fan. This thing runs at 40C. After I put a small external USB fan on it, it ran beautifully until this weekend. It bought the farm. I still have a few months on my warranty, but the love affair is over. Don't buy one of these things, no matter how inexpensive they are.

I had this thing in the hall closet with my G-22000 and the Sonos. I ran nightly backups from my PC to the Maxtor. It also served as my music server. It worked great until this weekend. I am so happy with the Sonos system. It allows me to sit on my ar$e and play my music.

I am now back to where I was in October, 2007....in search of a NAS or something that I can keep up 24/7. It seems that many of the external drives are not really made to stay on 24/7. So, I am considering a $299 pc from Dell as a music server and backup.

I am pretty frustrated in my search. Everything that I have found has poor customer reviews, except the D-Link DNS-323. There are so many positive reviews on Newegg, that I just might take a chance and get one. But then again, there's that $299 pc from Dell that should work just fine with a 1TB drive.

I have a 1TB Buffalo Tersaserver NAS that has never had a problem. It came installed with some software that actually works with my IO Data Linkplayer (networked DVD player), but my Roku cannot use the program. I did look into hacking my NAS, but it made more sense to keep a PC on all the time. It offers more flexibility because it can run and stream Firefly, Slimserver, Rhapsody, Tversity, Orb, WIZD, etc..

This is all excellent information. I am starting to learn but I have a long way to go. Once again, I appreciate everyone's help. I do need to do a lot more reading here on AK and elsewhere as well as exploring the various manufacturers web sites.

Until I read more in-depth information and get a better overall understanding, the following may be premature for me to ask so please bear with me. Maybe the responses will help me to focus on one or the other and allow me to narrow my research. It seems that Squeezebox and Roku are the prime manufacturers of the distribution hardware / user interface (for lack of better terms and understanding). I am curious about what the differences are and if the differences are likely to be significant to me as a novice. If the differences are minor and they are more about the differences in the user interface, then it would appear that it is just a judgement call as to which one I think I will be the most comfortable with. Consider that I am not an IT professional so simplicity, ease of installation and ease of use are all important for me. Versatility and expandability are important too but not as important as simplicity is for me.

Thanks, again!

This is all excellent information. I am starting to learn but I have a long way to go. Once again, I appreciate everyone's help. I do need to do a lot more reading here on AK and elsewhere as well as exploring the various manufacturers web sites.

Until I read more in-depth information and get a better overall understanding, the following may be premature for me to ask so please bear with me. Maybe the responses will help me to focus on one or the other and allow me to narrow my research. It seems that Squeezebox and Roku are the prime manufacturers of the distribution hardware / user interface (for lack of better terms and understanding). I am curious about what the differences are and if the differences are likely to be significant to me as a novice. If the differences are minor and they are more about the differences in the user interface, then it would appear that it is just a judgement call as to which one I think I will be the most comfortable with. Consider that I am not an IT professional so simplicity, ease of installation and ease of use are all important for me. Versatility and expandability are important too but not as important as simplicity is for me.

Thanks, again!

The Roku remote doesn't have a screen from which to views your choices/selections.

http://www.mathies.com/blog/electronics/roku_soundbridge.jpg

The old Squeezebox doesn't either.

http://www.planet-shop.eu/images/Squeezebox%20Wireless%20All-black.jpg

But the newer Squeezebox does.

http://www.slimdevices.com/images/duetgallery/1.jpg

The remote that comes with the Sonos has a screen, allowing you to sit most anywhere in your home and control the unit(s).

http://www.easternhifi.co.nz/assets/resized/img/sm/986/8/SonosBU130_W_F-0-700-0-450.jpg

The Roku Soundbridge and Squeeze box are popular because they are affordably priced. I also have a Soundbridge and it works well and sounds great. The Soundbridge requires a computer. The Sonos, does not.

The Roku has several different models. If you want a Roku, you are better off buying a used version because the newer M1001 upsamples 44.1 to 48khz. This has been reported to cause sound quality issues.

As I mentioned, you can use your iPod Touch to control the Roku if you have Slimserver installed on your computer/NAS. When using this setup, I really like the ability to search for a specific artist or album by typing it in on the Touch.

The Duet setup will cost you quite a bit more and you lose the display on the actual unit. It is still a lot cheaper than the Sonos, so I guess it really comes down to how badly you want to run without a computer and whether you want to hack a NAS.

Sometimes it helps to step back and try to better understand the goals and problems you're trying to solve and worry about the 'how' later... that way you aren't corralling yourself into a non-optimal solution. Also it can help keep one's head from spinning. :D

The "independent of the computer" part is only that I would like to be certain that the music files are not only physically located outside of the computer but that the software to access them is not dependant on the computer or any one program. I want to avoid having to rip all of that music a second time when the computer gets replaced for any reason or if a newer kind of user interface software or device is introduced.

Ahhhh... I was wondering about that. There are ways to move music files from your current computer to a new one. File formats seem to be fairly long lived (WAV, AIFF have been around for quite a few years).

Even if one goes by the wayside, often file format converters are available. The caveat is around lossy formats but you mentioned lossless.

Also... you can rip music from CDs using AIFF (on a Mac at least, can't speak to pc) and import into iTunes; just did that to create an audio test cd after inspiration from AK. I *think* you can associate artwork with these AIFF files, you can definitely include the info. So there's your iTunes integration. But, it's been my experience that as long as standard file formats are used, the files can be migrated between music players.

Worth keeping in mind, if you choose some gizmo that is intended as a digital music jukebox type thingy, it could get obsolete or break and you may be unable to migrate the data to a new gizmo... worth checking into, to see how hard that might be.

Breaking up the problem functionally may help to keep it sorted out. E.g., music ripping, storage, transmit, play. Maybe one device does all that or one device does some of it, others do other functions. But at least you identify the high level functionality to think about the problem more methodically.

I don't have any real specifics, but hopefully this is of some help in thinking about the problem.

Michael

OK, I think I am gaining a better understanding of all this but I am not yet settled on a plan. Until that happens - hopefully within the next several months, since I have a PC with an Ethernet connection in my mancave, and my DSL modem / router and PC with the music files is on an upper floor, does it make sense to simply get a DAC such as the Blue Circle Thingy http://www.bluecircle.com/index.php?menu_id=5002 ? The mancave PC is just a run of the mill Dell Optiplex 260 with it's internal soundcard. Will I need a better soundcard to use with the Thingy? If I end up with a Squeezebox or Roku, would that Thingy be worth using with them?

Is it true that iTunes does not work with FLAC? Or have you guys developed some workaround? As for an external drive to be left on 24/7, I have had good luck with the Western Digital MyBook. Mine has been on for 2 years straight without any problems.

I don't use iTunes except for Podcast playback. WMP or Winamp (winamp preferrably) are my methods for playback, and support FLAC indeed.

The mancave PC is just a run of the mill Dell Optiplex 260 with it's internal soundcard. Will I need a better soundcard to use with the Thingy? If I end up with a Squeezebox or Roku, would that Thingy be worth using with them?

Using a USB-DAC like the Thinggy basically bypasses the soundcard on your PC... it becomes irrelevant.

Any reasonably good external DAC would likely improve the performance of a stock Squeezebox or Roku SoundBridge.

Is it true that iTunes does not work with FLAC? Or have you guys developed some workaround? As for an external drive to be left on 24/7, I have had good luck with the Western Digital MyBook. Mine has been on for 2 years straight without any problems.


Check out FireFly as an altenative to using iTunes as a streaming server.

FireFly supports a number of file formats, including FLAC.

Thank you! I thought that would be the case but the one thing that I was sure about is that I was not sure! :rolleyes:

So, it sound like I could accomplish my original mission if I get a Lynksys NSLU2, a couple of 1TB USB drives (the second one to serve as a backup to the first with a scheduled backup and sleep / spin down in between backups), the Blue Circle Thingy for use with the mancave PC for now and the Roku or the Sqeezebox later (and elsewhere in the house), use FireFly as the music server software to supply the data / music to iTunes and hence my iPod Touch for portable use. Does FireFly handle the cover Art and tags that iTunes and the iPod use?

I have no problem with reloading all of my CDs (250 ~350?) in order to do it in the best way, which I seem to understand is FLAC as opposed to Apple Lossless, correct?

Whew! I hope all that makes sense to you. I'm not so sure that it makes sense to me though! :rolleyes: If there is a better overall approach that you suggest, I am still some time away from being able to commit to a plan and actually buy and install any equipment. One item that I have in my notes is a Lynksys / Cisco NAS200 for NAS use. I don't know or understand the pros and cons of it Vs the NSLU2 unless it was the NAS200 that was reported to be too slow to function as a music (and video???) server. I just don't recall.

Man, I have to be careful that this doesn't turn out to be a classic case of a little knowledge being dangerous for me and by me. :o It is a very interesting voyage of discovery for me though, thanks to everyone's help along the way. :thmbsp:

I have been reading and searching AK and elsewhere. It seems that the Linksys NAS200 gets panned for being too slow and quirky. If I understand it correctly, it seems to be ideal for use as a backup device, not a music server. On the other hand I found a lot of very interesting information on the Netgear RND2150 ReadyNAS Duo 500 GB Desktop Network Attached Storage, http://www.amazon.com/Netgear-RND2150-ReadyNAS-Desktop-Attached/dp/B0013G04AQ/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top . After reading information and user reviews it would seem that this black box may be exactly what I am looking for! :scratch2: I sure would appreciate some feedback from you fine folks that know if I am actually on the right track here. I am a few bits short of a byte about being confident enough to take the plunge without some guidance here. I am excited about what I have read so far but I can handle the disappointment of being redirected. :D

I want a music server that is independent of the computer(s) on my home network.

* I like the idea of having the NAS being independent of but fully compatible with the computer(s) and the music delivery hardware like the iPod and the Squeezebox.


I'd recommend a Macintosh or Windows machine (Macintosh prefered) connected to a Drobo (http://tinyurl.com/5fysyc) unit for direct attached storage, or via DroboShare for a true NAS solution.

The Drobo is fantastic, easy to use reliable storage than can be trivially upgraded to larger capacity as larger hard drives become available.

Remote Airport Express units can ship uncompressed digital audio either wired or wirelessly to remote locations. For serious listening, optical outputs and a DAC of your choice can drive your equipment. For less demanding listening, RCA via the internal DAC on the Airport Express will serve admirably.

And, rather than LCD screens, an iPhone or iPod Touch with the fantastic Remote application will allow you to find and play your music via tags and playlists, searching, etc. *and* allow you to select which system(s) you want it to play out of, all with album art, full control, etc.

The only problem with this solution, and it *is* a problem (but hopefully not for too long, Apple!) is it's 44.1KHz sampling only and will not play the new high resolution formats.

Buy your computer savvy friend a couple of beers! :beer:

I don't know of a really easy way to set up the ultimate music server thingy.
But maybe I can give you some inspiration and ideas by telling you about how I did it?
I got myself a ultralowpower pc (Koolu, out of production now). It runs Ubuntu Linux. To that I attached 3x external USB drives, configured them in a sofware raid5 array. Installed Samba (for the NAS functionality) and the SqueezeCenter software. Tranferred my music archive (CDs ripped to FLAC) to the Raid array. Configured SqueezeCenter and started enjoying the tunes through the squeezebox! :music:
I don't know how this works with Itunes since I don't have any Apple products.

Today I would probably use some sort of itx system with one small system hdd and two large hdds in raid1 for storage and a similar software setup.

But really, the fastest, safest, and most fun way of doing it is to share a couple of beers with that computer geek friend of yours! :beer:

I'm not a genius when it comes to this stuff, but I use the following:

Drobo → USB → DroboShare → CAT5 → Apple Time Capsule → wireless streaming → Apple Airport Express → optical mini-jack → McIntosh MDA1000 → → →

The nice thing about this is I can sit on my sofa, connected wirelessly to the Apple Time Capsule, and access all of my music and play it through iTunes. It's a beautiful thing. I don't have a great solution, other than iTunes on my computer, for choosing music while sitting on the sofa, though. I need to find some type of remote or tablet for this purpose.

I think using an "N" network is key. I had a lot of pauses in the music streaming when I was on a "G" network. I still get pauses on the "N" network (e.g. when searching for files on the Drobo while also streaming music), but the pauses are tolerable and few and far between.

I love the Drobo/DroboShare, but it is the weak link in my opinion as it is loud and hot if left on all the time. Additionally, the fan speeds up at random times and is very loud, especially if sitting in your living room. Despite all that, I still love the convenience, redundancy and look of the Drobo/DroboShare. It's very well done, but they do need to work on the noise in the next version. Please note, I have the Generation 1 version; the Generation 2 version may be better.

Personally, I would replace the Drobo/DroboShare with a McIntosh component if they had a larger drive than the MS750 (say 1TB - 4TB) or if the 750GB drive could be swapped out easily. I would be even happier if McIntosh used a completely silent solid state drive (without a fan), and I would be willing to pay an untold amount for such a component. Years down the road, I imagine!

There have been several excellent answers to my initial request. Thank you one and all! :thmbsp:

After doing a fair amount of reading and research, as good as the Drobo + DroboShare looks, I think I am close to pulling the trigger on the NetGear RND2150 with two 500 GB drives listed under the “Combo” tab here: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822122020 . The Drobo units do look to be very attractive but the comments by kamehany about the noise and the heat mirror several other comments that I have read about them and that is a deal breaker for me. My main PC is in our bedroom sitting area. The Macintosh solution is outside of my budget but is still on the radar for the future. The Netgear solution, especially with the combo deal with two drives, is by far the least expensive. The 750GB X 2 unit is only slightly more expensive. I just don’t know that I need to go that large.

If I understand things correctly I can accomplish my mission of having NAS to store music and “My Documents” as well as any other data files independent of any PC. That will allow scheduled backups to the second drive (and a third for off-site storage via USB), Sharing of those files within my local network and certain selected files outside of the network. The only other piece of hardware that I will need is a DAC like the Blue Circle “Thingy” for the PC in my basement macave. Wireless capability is not necessary at this point in time but it would be convenient later as the system expands. I can add a Squeezebox Duet at a later time as the need arises. Not that I am entirely confident about how to go about configuring all that properly and securely but I will allow for some “suds” in the budget as Styx suggested – or just ask my daughter that has an associates in IT to give Ol’ Dad a hand! Now there’s some R.O.I. if I ever saw any!

I really appreciate everyone’s help and suggestions. :yes: I know that I am far from being done with this process yet. The decision is by no means set in stone so if anyone thinks my approach is bad or if there are better solutions for this Digital Audio neophyte and IT novice, please let me know. For now the Netgear RND2150 looks to me to be the closest thing to an affordable Music Server in a box as I can find.

Update: I ordered the Netgear ReadyNAS Duo 2175 with two 750GB drives and 1GB of memory. (FWIW - My research indicates that Newegg has some very attractive deals on these things through the end of October.) It arrived on Friday and I installed it this weekend. Everything went smoothly and it appears to be working fine with one minor issue that is probably not related to the NAS. I am sure that I have not configured everything as well as it can be but for an IT novice I am pretty happy with where I am so far. I am reasonably comfortable working in and around PC hardware and on the outer layers of Windows but the finer points and details of network configuration is uncharted waters for me. Overall I am very impressed with the Duo and I look forward to learning more about it's capabilities.

The issue that I mentioned earlier is that my man cave PC only sees about 3/4 of the music in my iTunes library. The remaining music is visible and plays perfectly from the NAS on my main PC where I performed the installation. I can also play all of the library music on the man cave PC if I manually navigate to the folder on the NAS and look through the listings in list view only. They never show up in album view at all even though I have the man cave PC pointed at the same iTunes library on the NAS. I did do an iTunes "Consolidate" on both the main PC and the man cave PC. That did bring in a lot of the missing (from the man cave PC) album cover art that had to be manually loaded when certain CDs were originally loaded into the library. :scratch2: I don't know what to do about that so I appreciate any suggestions.

I have not tried to install or use Squeezecenter(?) yet even though this NAS is supposed to have the necessary support software (for my lack of better terminology to describe it) for Squeezebox integration (that I do not yet own).

I think this thing is going to not only be a real safety net for my data but it will be a fun and useful tool too! :music:

I have tried several different things to fix that iTunes problem that I mentioned in the previous post without success. :dunno: Can anyone offer a suggestion about what I should look for?

I've had a similar problem in the past. It happened under three scenarios:

1) When using "Add Folder to iTunes," if the computer is interupted or powers down before the whole folder has been uploaded/synced. Make sure your computer does not automatically turn off after a certain amount of time, or else periodically move the mouse as the files are uploading/syncing.

2) Some times, if you have Games or other files already on your system, it will ask if you want to replace them (while it's updating the music files). If you click Cancel instead of Replace, I think the music folder upload/sync stops at that point.

3) I also had bad sectors/blocks on my drive at one point, and the upload of the iTunes music would always stop at that point. I used Chkdsk to verify there were bad sectors/blocks and then used that same Chkdsk to fix the problem. The next time I added the folder to iTunes it worked fine.

Other than that, I would just make sure you have the latest version of iTunes.


One question, though, which may help you figure it out. Is there any relationship to the missing files (e.g. kind, folder location, all missing songs start with the letters F-Z (see #2 above))?

Good luck!

There are no computer or HD problems that I am aware of. There is no pattern that I can see to the missing music either. I am going to work on it a bit (Ha, I made a pun!) more and if I don't get it straightened out I will uninstall iTunes from the man cave PC and reinstall it. By the way, my playlists do not show up on the man cave PC either. I did not try to Sync anything, I just ran "Consolidate" the library both on the main PC where I did the install from and on the man cave PC. I thought Sync was just for use with external devices like the iPod. Maybe I am wrong about that. Could that be all there is to the problem?

I have managed to make some good progress. Both PCs share the same Music folder on the NAS and I have found a relatively easy way to have new music that gets added via the "main' PC show up on the man cave PC. Some of the problems that I struggled with have to do with the term "library" it applies to iTunes. As I now understand the term "Library", it means the library of links to the music located in the music folder (in this case located on the NAS). I had thought that the "Library" was the music itself, not just the links to it. I am still not so sure that I have it exactly correct or that my attempt to explain it as I understand it is accurate.

The things that I did to allow the music to be shared (without duplicates) are as follows:


Delete all music from the local PCs after confirming that the Music folder on the NAS contains all of the music and does not contain unnecessary duplicates. (This step may not actually be necessary)
Un-check "search for shared libraries" in iTunes.
Edit: Do use the "Consolidate" function on iTunes after adding new music, but only on the "main" PC.
After adding a new CD from the "main" PC, on the other PCs, use the "Add folder to library" by navigating to that new file within the music folder on the NAS. If I add a new CD from the mancave PC it seems to work OK but then that PC hangs until I reset it or manually power down. That may be just a local problem that I am experiencing at this point in time.


I am sure that I am not done with this yet but for now it does seem to be working as I had hoped. Thanks everyone for your help and tips. :thmbsp:

I am having a problem that really bothers me though. Even with all three PCs on my wired network powered down and with the wireless receiver disabled in the Westel DSL modem / router / firewall, I see almost constant drive activity indicated on the router with Internet access indicated every 20 or so seconds. I also have the routers firewall configured to only see the MAC address' of the three hardwired PCs and the NAS. I don't have Bit Torrent enabled on the NAS and, as far as I know, the only files on the NAS are documents and music data files. I do have iTunes installed on two PCs and there is an iTunes folder that gets automatically installed in the "My Music" folder of the "My Documents" directory on the NAS. Other than that, I have no idea what could be causing the drive activity or the Internet access that I am seeing evidence of on the router. Is there a utility that I can get that will show me what traffic is on my network and especially what the activity is with the Internet access? Any advice here will be appreciated. I don't know how or where else to look.

I will add that I have Norton 360 installed (that I hate!) on all three PCs and I have performed scans using AdAware and Spybot Search and Destroy. None of them have indicated any problems.

There is a program called Wireshark. You need to connect your PC with a HUB (not a switch) to the network segment you want to capture packets on. Most likely what you are seeing is the NAS broadcasting UPNP announcements. You can capture these packets on wireless, or plugged into the router's switch ports (don't need a hub). As long as your hardware firewall is working properly you are OK. I'm not sure what you mean by having the firewall configured to see the 3 MAC addresses? Do you mean you have these registered in DHCP? You could do an online port scan to verify that you have no ports open.

Prior to just finding and reading your post hypertone (I don't know how I missed it, but I did.), at the suggestion of tech support at Netgear and after trying a few other things, I installed a small 5-port switch and that appears to have solved the problem of the mysterious constant drive access on the ReadyNas Duo. I also no longer hear the drive access activity for no apparent reason. I am not confidant that I am out of the woods yet but I will feel better after I get a response from Netgear tech support once they look at the logs. Nearly everything that I see in the logs is way over my head but I was able to see that the drive successfully spun down after the programmed time of no activity. Prior to installing the switch the constant drive access, apparently due to nearly constant disconnect > connect activity, did not allow time for the drive to spin down. I think that my several year old Verizon provided Westel 327W DSL modem / firewall / HW + wireless router may be the root of the problem.

I hope that this isn't too far off topic of PC Music servers but my hope is that the fine folks that read this forum are most likely to have the information that I am seeking. I am prepared to replace and upgrade the Westel 327W with a newer device or devices but I could use some suggestions as what product(s) to choose. My primary concerns, in the order of priority, are security (a good firewall is a must), reliability, ease of installation and use (considering my rather limited knowledge and experience), and wireless capability. I can (or already have) run network wires anywhere I need to in my home so wireless access is only a convenience for me. I do like to have the ability to use a laptop or my iPod touch, or who knows what may be next, wirelessly in and around my home from time to time. Security is a prime concern so being able to limit access to only those devices that I choose (MAC filtering?) is important to me. I would also like to be able to hide the wireless network from neighbors that may consider it sporting to to try to intrude. I don't have any need to allow the wireless network to be "open". Locked as tightly as possible is a good thing for me. If someone can provide suggestions for a product or products to accomplish all that for me I sure will appreciate the advice. Keep in mind though that this is a residential application with limited numbers (5~6 ?) of connected devices as opposed to a business or commercial environment.

Once again, I appreciate everyone's time and assistance. :thmbsp:

You are all amazing. I sell software to radio stations that provides scheduling and playout of audio from a hard drive. We have systems with 128 audio servers and maybe a total of 4-600 workstation under one roof. I would have never expected someone to talk about mapping drives and DHCP on a home system. Wow, this is amazing. I hope you don't scare the off the guy that did the original post with all the applications that you have added to make your systems work. Cool stuff. I appreciate all the great information.

Hi,

My first music server will be a retired BSI Simian box with AudioScience cards. Uncompressed WAV files and no DRM to deal with. Used with one system in my bedroom.