.....and in the process, I have used up two AT92E Stylii. Both are victims to bad used vinyl:tears:. My wife is getting into the older albums (got her some Peter, Paul and Mary today) and I want to continue that trend:thmbsp:. So, I have a P-mount adapter and want to know more about the "universal" nature of this mount - will only AT stylii fit? If not, what are some suggestions for other brands that will fit?

I'm assuming you actually mean AT cartridges and not AT styli.

If the adapter is truly a P mount adapter, any P mount cartridge should be able to be mounted into it and work correctly.

In other words, if the AT P mount cartridge is good in it, any P mount should be.

Doug

Ok, so my terminology should be:

P-mount adapter (stays screwed to the headshell)
Removeable cartridge (slips on and off of the adapter)
Stylus (built into the cartridge)

I think I got it now.

Why change cartridges, just get some spare styli and change them when they get trashed :)

Why change cartridges, just get some spare styli and change them when they get trashed :)

That sounds promising - 'splain it to me, Lucy?

What Broc means is that the stylus is removeable from the cartridge body.

I'm not really familiar with this model AT but I believe if you grasp the light colored part of the plastic housing (this is actually the stylus housing) by the little ridges and pull down, the stylus will come out.

You then just buy a like stylus assembly and plug it into the cartridge body where the old one was.

This is by far the most often used moving magnet cartridge scheme - cartridge body stays attached to adapter/headshell and new stylus plugs into body.

Doug

http://www.micksmothers.net/gallery2/d/26782-1/TT+cartridge+installation+060508_jpg+007.jpg

Now I am confused. This is the picture of my headshell that screws onto the tonearm. So far so good?

The P-mount is the universal adapter that screws onto the headshell and includes the wire connections?

Finally, the cartridge is the removeable white plastic piece that snaps onto the P-mount? The cartridge holds the stylus, which is made up of the cantilever and the tip?

Only thing is that in this case you can get the entire cart for less than the cost of the stylus alone. The cart (search under AT-92ECD) can be purchased on ebay for $25 shipped. The advantage is 1) less chance of damaging the stylus when trying to insert it--it's already in the new cartridge, and 2) you get extra p-mount adapter, mounting hardware, screwdriver, and brush--good to have if you ever get another tt or decide to use a different cart in another headshell.

Now I am confused. This is the picture of my headshell that screws onto the tonearm. So far so good?

The P-mount is the universal adapter that screws onto the headshell and includes the wire connections?

Finally, the cartridge is the removeable white plastic piece that snaps onto the P-mount? The cartridge holds the stylus, which is made up of the cantilever and the tip?
All correct, but what you might not realize is that part of the white piece that contains the cantilever and tip separates away from the rest of the cartridge. You can see the ridges on the sides and locate the line where the stylus assembly is separate from the cartridge.

Thanks for the reply, hakaplan. I have removed that part from the assembly prior to this. I tried out a conical tip to hear the difference.

I did find a replacement stylus at Amazon for less that the whole assembly:

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00007E7C9?smid=A3LJ5WMKNRFKQS&tag=yahoo-ce-20&linkCode=asn

I referenced this part from here:

http://www.garage-a-records.com/atsty.html

Does all of this look right to you?

A word of advise from someone who got his wife to enjoy spinning vinyl...don't ever get into the particulars of stylus wear, alignment, swapping carts or styli, record cleaning, carbon fiber brushes, tracking weight, VTA..etc. All my wife wants to do is "play a record". If it becomes cumbersome or a "process" then the enthusiasm for them playing vinyl wears quickly and she goes back to the CD player.

I have a specific table set-up for her use. It has a .08mil vintage Shure conical stylus (sounds great with ratty vinyl and cheap enough to replace the stylus every other week if I had to) , is has auto return ('cause she liked to walk away during play and forgets about it...and coming home to see my $400 stylus slamming into the label makes me a little sick), and is set for play and go performance. All she has to do is put on the record and play. I'll even catch her using the CF brush that I left next to the table from time-to-time, but her technique is totally wrong...I know better than to say anything.

James R.

A word of advise from someone who got his wife to enjoy spinning vinyl......I know better than to say anything.

(shortened for brevity)

Smart! I have a decent Denon waiting in the wings. I need to take it apart and clean up the interior a little - it needs assistance when moving the tonearm to the outer edge of the LP. Once I get that taken care of, I'll A-B the Denon against my Kenwood. Then, I believe that I will take your advice and set up the "lesser" TT with a cheap conical stylus for the wife and kids.

.....and in the process, I have used up two AT92E Stylii. Both are victims to bad used vinyl:tears:.

If you burned up 2 stylii on used vinyl in a short amount of time, then you must be using vinyl that would be better left at the thrift. I have never had an album ruin a needle.

Once you get your hardware situation taken care of, I would start being a bit more picky as to what you spin on your table.

If you burned up 2 stylii on used vinyl in a short amount of time, then you must be using vinyl that would be better left at the thrift. I have never had an album ruin a needle.

Once you get your hardware situation taken care of, I would start being a bit more picky as to what you spin on your table.

I have to second what Vern is saying here. I've never used up a stylus on "bad" vinyl. Frankly all of my vinyl is used garage sale or thrift store records and no damage as yet that I'm aware of.

I have to second what Vern is saying here. I've never used up a stylus on "bad" vinyl. Frankly all of my vinyl is used garage sale or thrift store records and no damage as yet that I'm aware of.

Ok,

I am cleaning the records carefully with Dawn and hot water and a sponge, then I clean again with Isopropyl Alcohol, water and Dawn and an Audio Technica brush. So, I will check the stylus tip closely with a magnefying glass. Maybe the tip needs to be cleaned? When I flip the LP, I use a brush on the stylus to remove any lint, dust or dirt that may accumulate.

I will need to check the alignment again when I install the new cartridges. That may be part of the problem. I am a novice, that's for sure, so all of your experience is very valuable to me. Thanks for the comments; I certainly don't want to waste cartridges or replace them prematurely.

Only thing is that in this case you can get the entire cart for less than the cost of the stylus alone. The cart (search under AT-92ECD) can be purchased on ebay for $25 shipped. The advantage is 1) less chance of damaging the stylus when trying to insert it--it's already in the new cartridge, and 2) you get extra p-mount adapter, mounting hardware, screwdriver, and brush--good to have if you ever get another tt or decide to use a different cart in another headshell.

Dang guys that do the research. :D:D:D

Just one little thing that tensleep may still be confused about.

The cartridge is actually the whole thing that is screwed to the headshell
(in the case of 1/2" mount cartridges) or P-mount adapter (as in your case). This includes the cartridge body and the stylus assembly.

Usually, when we say stylus on here as well as in other forums, we really mean the stylus assembly which includes the plastic housing and the stylus and cantilever. The actual stylus is really just the pointy thing that goes into the record groove and the cantilever is the tube onto which the stylus is mounted.

Of course, in ancient times with crystal or ceramic cartridges, when you bought a stylus or needle, you just got the cantilever and stylus and this was held into the cartridge with a set screw, press fit into the holder, or snapped under a spring in the cartridge body.

It was with the advent of magnetic cartridges that the stylus began to be sold with a plastic housing attached to make it easier to change the stylus. That and there is no actual physical contact between the cantilever and the rest of the cartridge anyway so there had to be something to hold the stylus/cantilever.

It sounds like you're cleaning your used vinyl well what with the Dawn and everything. Except, I hope you're not using REALLY hot water. :nono: :D

It could be just that the styli are dirty.

And James R., that was a great little story! :yes::thmbsp:

Doug

Dang guys that do the research. :D:D:D

Just one little thing that tensleep may still be confused about......It sounds like you're cleaning your used vinyl well what with the Dawn and everything. Except, I hope you're not using REALLY hot water. :nono: :D

It could be just that the styli are dirty.

And James R., that was a great little story! :yes::thmbsp:

Doug

(shortened for brevity)


Thanks for the great responses everyone. Doug, you certainly helped me to understand the anatomy of a modern assembly. I am currently listening to a known good album and I may have overreacted last night - the sound is fine. I do have the replacement stylii on the way, but that's ok. The Denon has the same AT92E setup and needs a stylus, so that gives me a spare.

As far as the water, I don't use water that I cannot put my hands in. I did notice while rinsing that the album will slightly bow if the water is as hot as I can stand, so I backed off some.

Assuming that the stylus is dirty, how does one go about cleaning it - is there a solution to soak it in? Or is the lint brush sufficient.

The 3472BE stylus that you found is a .4 x .7 elliptical. The AT92E uses the .3 x .7 elliptical--the thinner tip extracts more detail. But I agree with what others have said. You shouldn't be wearing out styli that fast. Your alignment may be off. Download the Stevenson protractor from vinylengine.com. Use the inner point. Line up the stylus tip with the point and keep the cartridge square in the headshell. You should be good to go with that.

Also you should be running these at 1.25g tracking force and anti-skate should be set there as well.

The 3472BE stylus that you found is a .4 x .7 elliptical. The AT92E uses the .3 x .7 elliptical--the thinner tip extracts more detail. But I agree with what others have said. You shouldn't be wearing out styli that fast. Your alignment may be off. Download the Stevenson protractor from vinylengine.com. Use the inner point. Line up the stylus tip with the point and keep the cartridge square in the headshell. You should be good to go with that.

Also you should be running these at 1.25g tracking force and anti-skate should be set there as well.

Well, I already have the stylii on the way, so I'll give 'em a whirl and compare to the original that came with the AT92E.

I downloaded the protractor (vinyl engine is all screwed up with the link to the pdf, BTW. I had to google to get the protractor). So how do I use this thing?

http://www.micksmothers.net/gallery2/d/29137-1/cartridge+alignment+081708+jpg+001.jpg

http://www.micksmothers.net/gallery2/d/29140-1/cartridge+alignment+081708+jpg+002.jpg

http://www.micksmothers.net/gallery2/d/29143-1/cartridge+alignment+081708+jpg+003.jpg

http://www.micksmothers.net/gallery2/d/29146-1/cartridge+alignment+081708+jpg+004.jpg




The tracking force I was using was 1.4, antiskate was .8. I adjusted those to your recommendations and fine tuned the alignment. I'll give her a listen later on, watching the Olympics right now.

A word of advise from someone who got his wife to enjoy spinning vinyl...don't ever get into the particulars of stylus wear, alignment, swapping carts or styli, record cleaning, carbon fiber brushes, tracking weight, VTA..etc. All my wife wants to do is "play a record". If it becomes cumbersome or a "process" then the enthusiasm for them playing vinyl wears quickly and she goes back to the CD player.

I have a specific table set-up for her use. It has a .08mil vintage Shure conical stylus (sounds great with ratty vinyl and cheap enough to replace the stylus every other week if I had to) , is has auto return ('cause she liked to walk away during play and forgets about it...and coming home to see my $400 stylus slamming into the label makes me a little sick), and is set for play and go performance. All she has to do is put on the record and play. I'll even catch her using the CF brush that I left next to the table from time-to-time, but her technique is totally wrong...I know better than to say anything.

James R.

You've been married a while haven't you? I know what you mean!!!

Well, I already have the stylii on the way, so I'll give 'em a whirl and compare to the original that came with the AT92E.

I downloaded the protractor (vinyl engine is all screwed up with the link to the pdf, BTW. I had to google to get the protractor). So how do I use this thing?
Now I'm confused. The earlier picture showed the cartridge mounted to a straight arm headshell. That's what I was assuming the alignment was for. These pictures are of an s-arm. What exactly are the two turntables--make and model?

On the protractor the inner point is at the intersection of the line that runs through the spindle and the long line perpendicular to it. To use the protractor the way I suggested, you set the cartridge square with the headshell, then move the arm over so that the cartridge is parallel to the long line with the tip on the line. You have to rotate the platter to achieve this. You then slide the cartridge forward or back until the tip is at the intersection.

Now I'm confused. The earlier picture showed the cartridge mounted to a straight arm headshell. That's what I was assuming the alignment was for. These pictures are of an s-arm. What exactly are the two turntables--make and model?

On the protractor the inner point is at the intersection of the line that runs through the spindle and the long line perpendicular to it. To use the protractor the way I suggested, you set the cartridge square with the headshell, then move the arm over so that the cartridge is parallel to the long line with the tip on the line. You have to rotate the platter to achieve this. You then slide the cartridge forward or back until the tip is at the intersection.

Sorry, Howard. That head in the earlier picture is for my Denon DP-45F; it had the clearest picture of the complete AT92E cartridge assembly. The tuntable in the picture with the alignment protractor is a Kenwood KD-5066.

Your description of the alignment makes sense; however, the tonearm will not move towards the spindle any further without pushing it past a detente and holding it there. I am assuming that, because of the confusion regarding the headshell, I am using the wrong protractor.

No, actually that protractor should work on both, and the Kenwood arm should definitely go farther as that inner point is well within the range of play on a record--I don't know what's with that.

But now that I know the turntables you can forget the protractor. For the Kenwood, set the cartridge square with the headshell and so that the distance from the stylus tip to the back of the rubber washer is 50.5mm. For the Denon, also set square, and it's 35mm from the stylus tip to the back of the headshell, but not including the part that plugs into the arm (so to the part that's flush with the arm).

So the new stylus arrived and they sound great. As you observed, Howard, I may have given up a little detail, but the new stylus sounds a little more full, or rounder, if you will. I definitely need to AB some more, before I settle on that conclusion.

Thanks for the measurement, too. The cart was mounted way too far forward - I have noticed an improvement in the clarity. However, I didn't quite get the cart in parallel to the headshell. Once the needle began to track the final track on an album side, I would get some horribly distorted, scratchy sound. I adjusted the alignment, and presto! all problems are gone.

:music:

Excellent! :thmbsp: But I'm still curious as to the reason the Kenwood arm wouldn't move any farther toward the spindle. :scratch2:

Yeah, I never noticed, because the tonearm has plenty of travel to complete the side and return to rest. There are a couple of rubber plugs in the top of the metal plate that may adjust the tonearm range, but I hesitate to make any adjustments, because it is playing so well right now.

A word of advise from someone who got his wife to enjoy spinning vinyl...don't ever get into the particulars of stylus wear, alignment, swapping carts or styli, record cleaning, carbon fiber brushes, tracking weight, VTA..etc. All my wife wants to do is "play a record". If it becomes cumbersome or a "process" then the enthusiasm for them playing vinyl wears quickly and she goes back to the CD player.

I have a specific table set-up for her use. It has a .08mil vintage Shure conical stylus (sounds great with ratty vinyl and cheap enough to replace the stylus every other week if I had to) , is has auto return ('cause she liked to walk away during play and forgets about it...and coming home to see my $400 stylus slamming into the label makes me a little sick), and is set for play and go performance. All she has to do is put on the record and play. I'll even catch her using the CF brush that I left next to the table from time-to-time, but her technique is totally wrong...I know better than to say anything.

James R.

You are doing it right. Keep up the good work and keep your head down :)