I just bought a Digital Cable Package with High Def, from Cox.

My amp/reciver is a Kenwood KRF-V5550D(older only has the 1st Pro Logic) Dolby 5.1 130wpc. It has a DSP Mode, a Dolby Digital 5.1 mode, a DTS, and various other modes like Arena, Theater, etc.

When ever I go to watch my favorite show CSI: Miami it will say (broadcasted in 5.1) my Kenwood knows its there and shows which speakers are being used, but nothing except the L and R speakers work, and I know my 5.1 is working properly because On the Food Network 5.1 sounds great and everything is decoded properly, and it shows my rear speakers are being used, as well as other channels, so my question is whats the deal here? Do I have to enable the Pro Logic to get the Surround, on my favorite shows?

Thanks

Not all Dolby Digital is 5.1. Some is Dolby Digital is 2.0.

Just because the station says 5.1 doesn't necessarily mean the cable provider passes the full 5.1 on channels so indicated.

You may need to overlay, if possible, Dolby Pro Logic on that station to get all the speakers producing sound.

CSI Miami is definately broadcast in 5.1 on either Cable or Satellite feeds (or OTA for that matter).

Be sure you have set your cable box to OUTPUT DOLBY DIGITAL and NOT PCM. This may be causing this error. As far as Food Network goes, sounds like the receiver is taking the 2-channel and mixing it to PL/PLII/PLIIX, as most FN shows are NOT typically DD5.1 (typically 2-ch which your reciever will mix to a PL/PLII/PLIIX).

It may depend on whether the OP is watching CSI on an analog channel or a digital or a high def channel. Each could, and likely does, have its own specifics of which audio format it carried on the channel.

I pay for the HDTV over Digital Cable, and was sure I was using the HDTV channel for CSI, I use Digital Cozx for deocding

And see thats to weird thing, most wouldnt think The Food Network is in 5.1 but my Kenwood shows when certin channels are being used and tells me when full 5.1 is engauged, and im certin Food Netw. was in 5.1 bacuse I could tell the ambiance/effects, and I have to manully turn on Pro Logic Decoder, and I can even chose Dolby 5.1 unless the Kenwood "Sees" it.

I'll see what happens on my end at Noon today. We get CSI Miami on A&EHD channel...

Which digital cable box did Cox provide you? Scientific Atlanta?Model number?

Since your receiver is auto detecting DD from your cable box, then it would be assumed that you do have that option selected from the cable box.It doesn't hurt to go back through the set up menu and check. Maybe the station that shows CSI is shipping it in 2.0 only(don't know why).. other than the Food Network, have you tried other HD channels to compare results? Give that a shot and see if you can receive 5.1 elsewhere.

I also have Cox's digital cable with HD and do not have any problems with DD that I know of.

One has to check the on-screen guide carefully...some will say DD meaning Dolby Digital (this generally means 2.0, but not necessarily).

Programs that have full Dolby Digital usually will show DD5.1 on the on-screen guide, but that's not a guarantee either if Cox doesn't pass it.


EDIT: CSI Miami on A&EHD Channel in our town is only DD2.0. My processor allows monitoring the number of incoming and playback channels. It shows incoming as only L and R, with the display indictating Dolby Digital.

Hence, it is coming in as DD2.0 (at 384kbps bitrate, btw).

So, my opinion is that you are set up properly, but if you want surround sound, you'll have to try to engage Dolby Pro Logic, et al, on top of the DD2.0 to fill the other speaker channels.

THANKS!!!! I knew I wasnt crazy, Im watching too right now and mine show exactlly what you said, so I guess I can just use, PL, or Theater DSP.

Well now Im really confused.........

When watching A&E HD, shows were in DD2.0, when I switched on the Pro Logic, my Kenwood only showed L+R BUT my surrounds were working.

So it seems like, it only Decodes on TRUE DD5.1 therefor showing all speakers as it was ment to be...

Pro logic is different than DD 5.1 in that it can take just a stereo signal and through the matrix process, can output to the center and rears. If you played a stereo LP or CD and used set your receiver to DPL, you would get a surround effect.DD is discreet.PL is not 5.1 even though it will output to all of the channels.

Each channel has dedicated information in DD 5.1. You'll have information going to 5 channels plus the LFE (.1) sub channel.If it's only DD 2.0,the info will only be set to the front L and R channels.

If you want to want more detailed information about the 2 Dolby decoding systems, you could do a search or go to Dolby labs.

Well now Im really confused.........

When watching A&E HD, shows were in DD2.0, when I switched on the Pro Logic, my Kenwood only showed L+R BUT my surrounds were working.

So it seems like, it only Decodes on TRUE DD5.1 therefor showing all speakers as it was ment to be...

No reason to be confused. It's working exactly as it should.

When the signal comes in as DD2.0, you have the option to apply DPL or not to apply DPL. If you do not apply DPL, then all you get is the 2-ch sound you initially heard.

When you overlay/engage DPL on the DD2.0 signal, the DPL matrix algorithm/logic creates, from the DD2.0 signal, the center and surround information you are now hearing.

Thanks for the help, I read up/researched a little bit about Dolby, and theres quite a bit of new stuff out there, just hope I wont have to upgrade my Rcvr anytime soon.

No reason to be confused. It's working exactly as it should.

When the signal comes in as DD2.0, you have the option to apply DPL or not to apply DPL. If you do not apply DPL, then all you get is the 2-ch sound you initially heard.

When you overlay/engage DPL on the DD2.0 signal, the DPL matrix algorithm/logic creates, from the DD2.0 signal, the center and surround information you are now hearing.

I should correct myself then after reading your post. I am not sure about A&E HD, as our CSI's come here on CBS (which broadcast 1080i/24 & DD5.1).

Yes, you have to upgrade your receiver sometime soon if you ever want to attempt to take advantage of BD (especially if you do not have external inputs).

And DD2.0 should typically be left in stereo. Yes you can apply the matrix, but 5.1 is still 5.1, and always sounds better than that of a 2.0 matrix mix.

Yes, you have to upgrade your receiver sometime soon if you ever want to attempt to take advantage of BD (especially if you do not have external inputs).

BD is that Blu-Ray Disk? If so why would I need a new one? dont most players have digital out or analog L+R?

You don't need to upgrade your receiver for Blu-Ray as long as you don't want/need the HD lossless audio formats to be decoded by your receiver.

OTOH, if your receiver has multichannel analog inputs, getting a Blu-Ray player with onboard decoding and mulitchannel analog outputs will get you HD lossless playback.

...And DD2.0 should typically be left in stereo. Yes you can apply the matrix, but 5.1 is still 5.1, and always sounds better than that of a 2.0 matrix mix.

I'd agree that the original Dolby Pro Logic isn't that great. But, the newer DPLII(x) is much better and quite tolerable to produce multichannel from a 2-ch source. IMO, of course.

And, I'd agree that descrete DD or DTS encoding is better than most any matrix mode.

BD is that Blu-Ray Disk? If so why would I need a new one? dont most players have digital out or analog L+R?

Yes,BD is Blu-Ray. Do you have a BD player? They output the same information over the analog and digital outputs as does a standard DVD player. You do not have to upgrade your receiver for the standard DD,DTS or PL.

What Vesuv1us is talking about is the higher bitrate audio formats that have surfaced with the HD players. You would have the have either an HMDI input (receiver/pre-pro or TV) or 6 analog multichannel inputs on the receiver,etc. and a BD player that has the internal decoding for those formats.People who can output these newer,lossless formats claim major improvement over the lower bitrate,compressed formats for DVD.

Ok, If I got a Blu Ray Player with HDMI output and my LCD TV had HDMI input, and a optical output, and then connect the optical to my rcvr would that get the lossless audio? or would would it be conerted to standard DD or DTS by the TV?

Thanks for all this help guys, I never was into surround that much till I got my Kenwood, and Im hesatant to get a new one because mine is still brand new, bought it for $50 still in the box at a pawnshop, about 5months ago.

I do plan on getting a Blu Ray, but I might wait a while to see if they come down in price at all, and/or more movies come out.

Ok, If I got a Blu Ray Player with HDMI output and my LCD TV had HDMI input, and a optical output, and then connect the optical to my rcvr would that get the lossless audio? or would would it be conerted to standard DD or DTS by the TV?

Most likely neither.

Most TVs convert any external input to 2-ch signal before sending it out the TV's digital output. The only thing that comes out as DD from the TV's digital jack is what you receive via the TV's internal tuner.

This is a very confusing thread!
The bottom line is if your getting 5.1 from some channels and not others, it's not you, it's the broadcast!
As has already been mentioned, your receiver may have modes that will "make" 5.1 out of a 2 channel source, sometimes with good results, sometimes not.

Ok, If I got a Blu Ray Player with HDMI output and my LCD TV had HDMI input, and a optical output, and then connect the optical to my rcvr would that get the lossless audio? or would would it be conerted to standard DD or DTS by the TV?

Thanks for all this help guys, I never was into surround that much till I got my Kenwood, and Im hesatant to get a new one because mine is still brand new, bought it for $50 still in the box at a pawnshop, about 5months ago.

I do plan on getting a Blu Ray, but I might wait a while to see if they come down in price at all, and/or more movies come out.

I have an older surround receiver and it doesn't have HDMI ins but it does have optical. What I do it hook up my HDTV with the HDMI and optical outs to my receiver (direct) and assign the ins/outs appropriately and get 5.1 surround. I have digital satalite TV and we get CSI in both DD2 and 5.1 - i have a choice in which format to watch, and with my DVR I choose the 5.1 and it the sound is mighty fine. The older shows are not 5.1 but my provider gives it to me in some type of surround but the newer shows are 5.1 and when it does provide that, I get a "5.1" on the screen. You may be watching reruns that were not 5.1 encoded. The new shows should be 5.1 the older reruns I don't think are (but I'm getting them from my provider that way). Probably they are converted from 2.0. The new shows sound pretty good to me in 5.1. So your issue may be that the shows you expect to hear 5.1 are in fact the older shows that are not 5.1. I my receiver will switch to the best surround option automatically so I really don't care or notice unless its only 2.0 and my receiver didn't change over to DTS or the best option for the output. I have a HK AVR 430 (I think). It's all pretty much automatic for me and I don't really have to mess with the outputs or which surround system gets used. The receiver automatically switches to the best it thinks I would like. Once in a while I have to manually over ride the setting. It sounds to me like you have that situation with your cable provider and CSI-Miami broadcast.

$50 for a surround receiver?? .... well that ain't bad. A little tweek here and there for that price I wouldn't worry too much about the manual labor on the tweek, and you're getting a lesson ta boot. Nice... next you will be asking how to get some BIG sound outta the surround sound.

Yeah-u-right

Cheers,
Bob