So I've been looking all over the web for some info on a best match between an early SME 3012 and a modern (moderately Priced, i.e.$200 cart)...

I've read A LOT about mass and compliance but no reference to a seemingly simple question (or two)..., which is:

is you're the proud owner of an SME 3012 arm, what cart do you have on it???

and similarly, if you own the SME 3009 arm, what cart would you put on THAT???


any help from any of you vinyl affictionados would be greatly appreciated :D

THANKS!!!

on my 3009 I put a shure V15II and also a Empire 100zex. You can pick just about any cartridge you want for your 3012. Pik one in your preice range, there's lotta gooduns out there. Hard to go wrong.
Others will be more specific I'm sure.

on my 3009 I put a shure V15II and also a Empire 100zex. You can pick just about any cartridge you want for your 3012. Pik one in your preice range, there's lotta gooduns out there. Hard to go wrong.
Others will be more specific I'm sure.

Thanks!

I'm thinking of trying the Shure M97xE. So far the reviews I read are pretty decent and so is the price

I have an SME 3009 Type III and use a Grado Reference Sonata with it.

I have a 3009 s2 imp and I use a v15 III. The M97xe should work out on your 3012. Do you know which model of 3012 you have? MKI, MKII, or R.

Forgive the dust..... is this also a SME tone arm?

I've been wondering for some time.......

It does have some similarities, but the base of the tonearm just doesn't look like an SME. Hopefully someone will chime in that recognizes it.

I have a 3009 s2 imp and I use a v15 III. The M97xe should work out on your 3012. Do you know which model of 3012 you have? MKI, MKII, or R.

I believe the version of 3012 that I have is the early one. It looks just like this

http://www.analogue-classics.com/assets/images/sme3012c_Kopie.jpg

The other issue I notice is that the cart wants to be pretty heavy, because the counterweight seems to be quite heavy on both of the 3012 and 3009.

I hung a Grado Gold on the 3009 (haven't gotten it connected yet, it's being installed to a Thorens TD 125 MK II) and I have to screw the counterweight all the way in AND put additional weight on the head shell (it the perforated head shell) just to get it balanced.

thanks for the help and feedback so far...:banana:

Oh, the sheer science of getting it to work - it's a good thing that I have my Dual 1219 all working to get me through the setup of the other tables (the 3012 is going onto a Thorens 124 MK II)

I'm not an expert in this by ANY means, but I had good luck with my old Audio-Technics Series 7, until my ex-wife destroyed the needle, and I could not get a replacement. Nowadays, I have a Stanton 681EEE, and I'm waiting for the D6800EE-2-S stylus (I think that's the part number) from LPGear for an "upgrade" (if it is indeed an upgrade), at which point my stock stylus will become the backup. I like the sound of it, although I will say it took what appears to be a pretty close to perfect alignment to get rid of the ssssibilance. Adjusting the angle of the tonearm on a 3009 is not the easiest, but I'd imagine it's not the most difficult, either. It would've been nice if they could've had a micrometer-style adjustment, but you can't have everything, especially considering I got the TD125 MKII with the 3009 S2 Improved for $75 in good working order.

rooster.

Your 3012 is a high mass arm and will not work well with a medium to high compliance cart (like any Shure other than the early bricks like the M3, M7 etc)or Grado, or AT or any of the medium to high compliance carts out there (yes they will play, but they won't get the true dynamics that arm has to offer). The early 3009-II (with the seperate way-rod holder like your 3012) is also a high mass arm. The second genertion 3009 (with the fixed wayrod/counterweight) is a medium mass arm and works...well (a compromise between high and low) with almost anything. The 3009-II improved is a low mass arm and will ONLY work with high compliance carts like the Shure V-15 II and above (it will only track as high as 1.5 grams).

So...with all that said, the 3012 is not an arm you can slap a budget cart on as most are meduim compliance. You need low compliance which means you move into the realm of MC carts. The obvious bargain MC cart that would be a perfect match to that arm would be the Denon DL-103 (or 103R for $150 more) which is in your price point, but then you would need a step-up transformer which can get into real money. The supreme match to your 3012 is the Ortofon SPU-GTE...a match made in heaven for 5 times what you want to spend.

To answer your original question, my 3009-II (second version) is wearing a Sumiko Blue Point #2 currently and it is a match made in heaven.

The 3012 is a highly coveted and great performing arm as long as the right cart is mated to it. I hate to sound snobby, but putting a $200 cart on that arm is akin to putting recylced motor oil in a Ferrari.
James R.

I had great sucess with the following on my SME 3012.

Ortofon Rondo Blue MC
Ortofon Salsa MC
Shelter 301 II

I have to admit that I got rid of my 3009 years ago after auditioning it up against more modern straight arms.

They also tend to be easier to match a cartridge with.

"dolph"

:banana:Your 3012 is a high mass arm and will not work well with a medium to high compliance cart (like any Shure other than the early bricks like the M3, M7 etc)or Grado, or AT or any of the medium to high compliance carts out there (yes they will play, but they won't get the true dynamics that arm has to offer). The early 3009-II (with the seperate way-rod holder like your 3012) is also a high mass arm. The second genertion 3009 (with the fixed wayrod/counterweight) is a medium mass arm and works...well (a compromise between high and low) with almost anything. The 3009-II improved is a low mass arm and will ONLY work with high compliance carts like the Shure V-15 II and above (it will only track as high as 1.5 grams).

So...with all that said, the 3012 is not an arm you can slap a budget cart on as most are meduim compliance. You need low compliance which means you move into the realm of MC carts. The obvious bargain MC cart that would be a perfect match to that arm would be the Denon DL-103 (or 103R for $150 more) which is in your price point, but then you would need a step-up transformer which can get into real money. The supreme match to your 3012 is the Ortofon SPU-GTE...a match made in heaven for 5 times what you want to spend.

To answer your original question, my 3009-II (second version) is wearing a Sumiko Blue Point #2 currently and it is a match made in heaven.

The 3012 is a highly coveted and great performing arm as long as the right cart is mated to it. I hate to sound snobby, but putting a $200 cart on that arm is akin to putting recycled motor oil in a Ferrari.
James R.

Thank you!!!!, that s EXACTLY the info I was looking for. I wasn't too comfortable with hanging a $200 cart on an arm that can cost as much as $1,200 on fleapay (it just doesn't seem the right match). So I agree with your comment.

I'm hoping that with some useful feedback and info I can narrow down my search. I

t is one thing to get a thousand bucks cart to match with a thousand bucks arm, it's a whole another game to be getting a half a dozen thousand bucks carts just to try them out, to see which one sounds better.

So thanks again for the info...

SME 3009 and 3012 cartridges of the original series (non improved) are suited for something like an Ortofon SPU. Improved models best used with lower mass cartridges a la Shure V 15 Type III, IV, V, Stanton 681 EEE-S II and III, Audio-Technica 440MLa and AT 150 MLX. Most of these arms are Improved models.

Forgive the dust..... is this also a SME tone arm?

I've been wondering for some time.......

Sorry, no it isn't.


As for the 3012 - if it were me I would try to find the shorter (and lighter) counter weight from the 3009II. That counter wieght in the picture is very heavy and as noted is needed to balance the very heavy Ortofon SPU cartridges. There's usually a guy in the UK selling SME 3009 parts on that auction site - might cost $50 or so to get a counter weight. With that, you should be able to balance a Denon DL-103 which I think would be a good match for the 3012 and not cost a fortune to get. If you're short on cash, a counter weight from another arm might fit even if it's just to give you an idea of what weight you need to balance the arm.

If you have a 3012 mounted on a td-125 you have a pretty special TT there - we need to see some pics! :thmbsp:

A friend was running a Grado Gold and an AT 440MLa on his table.

I now own two tables with the SME 3009 II improved arm and also own those carts, so that's what I'll be running.

If you have a 3012 mounted on a td-125 you have a pretty special TT there - we need to see some pics! :thmbsp:

Thanks for the info about the counterweight..., I actually did not think to use a CW from one arm on another, but there is no good reason why not!!!

I'm actually mounting a 3009 on the 125 MK II and a 3012 on the 124 MK II

I'll post photos as soon as I'm done setting it all up (the 3012 is getting a nice high gloss black arm board with the 124 TT sitting on a solid cherry plinth :banana:)

I run a Ortofon VMS 20E Mk2 on my SME 3009 and it sounds great! Last replaced about 2 years back and set me back about 80 pounds so not cheap but not too expensive.