View Full Version : AR 9 LS Score ????


Army
08-18-2004, 01:04 PM
Hi Everybody

Been a while since I have posted anything. Found a pair of Acoustic Research AR 9LS for a very reasonable price. These things are huge 100 lbs each. Pretty well used needing many hours to restore. Need to be refoamed and some minor cab work.
Question is are these worth the effort ? And what do y'all think of them. Anybody own a pair ? Opinions welcome ....

I'll post some photo's later !

Thanks Guys !
Army

Punker X
08-18-2004, 01:30 PM
YES YES... Great score.... Might need some big amps to power them though.

X

Fuzzy Lumpkins
08-18-2004, 01:46 PM
Nice score!

I'd rework them.

I think I read that you have a 22K. I think those together would be great.

Congrats again!

Army
08-18-2004, 02:11 PM
Originally posted by Fuzzy Lumpkins
Nice score!

I'd rework them.

I think I read that you have a 22K. I think those together would be great.

Congrats again!





Thanks Guys I was hopeing they were a good score !

Yup I've got the G-22k and a G-801 ready to give'em a go :D

Might need a truck just get them home. They're 4.5' tall won't fit in my car !

The guy sent me a photo... Which doesn't really convey just how damn big these are !

Regards
Army

bolly
08-18-2004, 02:13 PM
Teledyne AR 9's, never heard 'em, Love to score a pair!

AR SPK, AR- 9 4-WAY/DUAL 12" WOOFER
Description:
Manufacture Years: 1972 - 1978
Additional Information:
Retail
MSRP: $1,800.00
USED: $800.00

bolly
08-18-2004, 02:15 PM
AR SPK, AR- 9LS
Description:
Manufacture Years: 1982 - 1985
Additional Information
Retail
MSRP: $1,800.00
USED: $1,000.00

Army
08-18-2004, 04:24 PM
Originally posted by bolly
AR SPK, AR- 9LS
Description:
Manufacture Years: 1982 - 1985
Additional Information
Retail
MSRP: $1,800.00
USED: $1,000.00

I would have never guessed in a million years they were worth that much ! They look like a quality build, heavy duty everything.

Can't wait to pick em up now ! They're pretty ugly but with a little elbow grease they should clean up nicely :p:

Thanks Greg for the price quote !

Cheers
Army

Army
08-18-2004, 09:24 PM
Hi Guys an Gals

I've never heard sound like this from one pair of speakers !

Let me explain a little. I like great bass and these are just WOW And everything in between and more, much more.
these sound like what I've been looking for and more. I thought I found a pair of big heavy speaks that looked like a good build. Rough but all the tell tale things were there. And I've read a few peoples posts about AR's and how they love them etc... That and I heard a pair of speaks last weekend that to me sounded like the ultimate sound reproduction. I'm betting these give them a run for their money ( EW you need to hear these) definitely !
Now the rest of the story ....
Old by todays standards but shit I've been putting a couple of watts thru them and I'm just loving the sound. I can't push them much at all since the surrounds are toast. But they sound just, sorry I can't even put it into words.
I now know why they are worth a grand used ! Can't wait to refoam them and see what they sound like with a little more power or maybe cranked to Thor's levels :D
Well I'm getting tired and I've bragged enough ! Almost ...

You all can eat yer heart out cuz this is my ultimate score for the decade these only set me back $25

I was truly smiled on by the Audio gods today :D

Cheers :beerchug:
Army

bsam8
08-18-2004, 09:35 PM
great score Army, with the G- 22000 to power it up-that's nirvana!!!:D :D :D

Army
08-18-2004, 09:56 PM
Originally posted by bsam8
great score Army, with the G- 22000 to power it up-that's nirvana!!!:D :D :D

Yup bsam8 you are right !
But I've been giving it a little DC power thru my G-801 that I just got back from Echowars and If you read the earlier posts about the power required to make these sing I'm just not getting it :dunno: I'm putting maybe a couple of watts thru these and they just jam ! I couldn't be happier :D But maybe it's just that the Sansui's just Rock as do these speaks ;) IMHO No flames please ! :p:

I'm gonna stay up waaaayyy toooo late tonight for a listen :eek:
Can't help myself :cool:
Army

gonzothegreat
08-19-2004, 12:38 AM
Jeez, twenty five pazoozas. Lucky sod! Drool, drool, drool.

Um...what was the question? Oh, yeah - now I remember.

Is this the AR-9 that used the acoustic blanket to minimize cabinet diffraction? Ever since that Stereophile cabinet diffraction article, I've been on a quest to find a pair of ARs with said feature. The closest I've gotten is a pair of bookshelf AR TSW 100s that need the woofers refoamed.

There was a pair of AR-9s on ebay but it was in New England and no shipping. :(

Army
08-19-2004, 06:32 AM
Originally posted by gonzothegreat


Is this the AR-9 that used the acoustic blanket to minimize cabinet diffraction?



Hi Gonzo
I'm gonna guess that they are. I took one of the woofers out last night to get a look at how to remove the internal down firing woofer. And there is a big thick blanket in there !?
I almost dropped the damn woofer when it came out. I've never seen a woofer with that large of magnet. But it does explain why they sound so good :p:

Regards
Army

PS I have been pretty lucky lately ! Hope it holds for a while :cool:

B3Nut
08-19-2004, 08:07 AM
Put the G22K on those things. IIRC the 9's were 4 ohms, the 22K is good for 300/ch into 4. That'll be pleny o' headroom for those puppies. Though I'd bet an 801/G8000 would get close to 200 into a 4 ohm load on the bench, especially seeing as Echo worked his mojo on it. Still I think the G-22K is the best match out of your arsenal.

TP

Army
08-19-2004, 09:25 AM
Originally posted by B3Nut
Put the G22K on those things. IIRC the 9's were 4 ohms, the 22K is good for 300/ch into 4. That'll be pleny o' headroom for those puppies. Though I'd bet an 801/G8000 would get close to 200 into a 4 ohm load on the bench, especially seeing as Echo worked his mojo on it. Still I think the G-22K is the best match out of your arsenal.

TP

Hi B3Nut
So far the G-801 is giving them a little light work out. The foam surrounds are just about ready to blow chunks. Each speaker has a 12"woofer with small holes in the foam. And I just want to get a taste of them, before I tear em down for a refoam. They do have amazing bass even with the small holes in them. I can feel the bass from the down fireing 10" woofers even at low volume.
I polished up the cabinets last night with a little oil and they shined up quite nicely. But the grills are another story. The clothe is attached with some kind of plastic molding, that I haven't figured out yet how to get it off. Grills need new clothe. Looks like kitty was using these for a climbing wall:eek:

When I do get these back into shape. I will definitely be putting the G-22k with them. :cool: I'm guessing they'll be a perfect match !
I need to stop buying anything more. SO is just about ready to kill me :rolleyes: That and I have way too many projects in various stagings of disrepair that need a ton of time. Like that sweet G-801, man EW did a fantastic job on it. But it needs a little vinyl work etc... Before I take and show the before and after shots here.

Take care !
Army

gonzothegreat
08-19-2004, 11:31 PM
The acoustic blanket IIRC was a layer of fabric mounted on the front baffle around the assorted drivers (not the foam or batting that is mounted inside the cabinet). If I correctly understood the Stereophile article, this prevented the soundwaves from the drivers that traveled along the surface of the baffle from re-radiating and distorting when the wavefront reaches a sharp corner.

If the surface wave was absorbed by the blanket, the remaining output from the drivers would not appear to come from both the drivers and the cabinet edges. Kinda tech heavy but it supposedly results in near holographic imaging. I have a budget speaker from Jamo that used a related technique for minimizing cabinet diffraction and I'd love to hear a similar speaker with a more "American" sound and some THOR-like bass.

Toasted Almond
08-20-2004, 05:22 AM
I have the AR-9 and yes it has the acoustic blanket on the front baffle.

The AR-9LS came out after the 9.

Fantastic speakers the LS, that should be driven with an amp, not a receiver.

TA

Army
08-20-2004, 10:08 AM
Originally posted by Toasted Almond

Fantastic speakers the LS, that should be driven with an amp, not a receiver.

TA

Hi TA

Ok so what big difference would that make ? :dunno:

Not really having any problem driving them with the Sansui G-801 which Echowars bench tested at 155 wpc ( not bad for a receiver factory rated at 120 watts) That and when I get these refoamed I was planning on pairing them with the G-22k which is rated at 220 wpc which has it's own seperate amp section. So what is your reasoning ? Just curious !?

Anybody got the spec.s on the AR 9LS ?

Cheers
Army

B3Nut
08-20-2004, 01:33 PM
The G-22000 amplifier section *is* a separate power amplifier, and a rather good one at that. Even has separate power transformers for the left and right channels. Sansui wasn't playing around with this one. You'll spend a fair chunk of change bettering its power amplifier unit.

Of course you don't want to run inefficient power-hungry speaks like these with a midpower receiver or integrated except for low-volume testing to verify driver operation when you first drag 'em in the door. For real-life listening you indeed need a stout amplifier. But the G-22K ain't no middleweight. 220wpc strikes me as being more than plenty for these, and if 9's are 4 ohm you're looking at 300wpc out of the G-22K. He'll be fine.

TP

Toasted Almond
08-20-2004, 03:02 PM
I'm driving the woofers on my 9's with a 200wpc Onk power amp. I'm driving the lower mids, upper mids, and tweets with a 250wpc Carver power amp. It is pretty clear that I could easily double the Onk's power output, and it still wouldn't be enough to harm, OR properly drive these woofers. I could easily substitute a more powerful Carver instead of the 250wpc M-500t and it would hardly faze the upper section.

A 220wpc receiver just may make that speaker sound fantastic. Better than anything you've heard before maybe. Even enough to satisfy a lot of people's requirements.

They can still be made to perform better. As long as they can, and I have the means to do it, it doesn't make any sense for me not to. If you ever get the urge and the means to drive them with more than a 220wpc receiver, you should experiment with it.

Have fun with your new speakers, they are among the finest ever made.

TA

TroyD
08-20-2004, 03:41 PM
Nice score!

AR-9's are also on my short list of things I lust over. If TA weren't such a swell guy and as proficient with a Louisville Slugger as he is, I would have thought about a smash and grab at his house.

What are the differences in the AR-9 and the AR-9LS?? Just out of curiousity...

BDT

Toasted Almond
08-20-2004, 04:33 PM
Instead of side-firing woofers like the 9's, the LS fires one forward and one down at the floor. The cabinet on the LS is slightly smaller, I think they made them a little more efficient than the 9, and the LS has no "Acoustic Blanket" on the front baffle.

TA

TroyD
08-20-2004, 05:07 PM
I was curious about the acoustic blanket as I noticed that Army's LS's didn't have it.

I'd be interested in how the two compare.

BDT

Toasted Almond
08-20-2004, 06:30 PM
I'm all over the blanket man. These things image like all get out. Pretty good for a speaker with a wide front baffle. I've read about this tweak, but never applied to the whole front baffle. The only thing addressed by the tweakers was the area immediately around any dome mids or tweets.

Anybody that hasn't tried it and thinks they would like to improve the presentation from their present speakers, might want to give it a shot. Cheap, effective, and totally harmless and reversible if you end up thinking I'm full of shit or my ears suck.

TA

Army
08-20-2004, 11:37 PM
Ok I'm a total idiot !

After reading your posts about wondering why my AR-9LS didn't have a blanket. I got to wondering...

That and the mention by Bolly earlier sent me back to looking more closely. And down in the right hand corner in small print they said Teledyne Acoustic Research. Looked even closer and in even smaller print on the plastic housing around the tweeters it says the same. :(

So what the heck is the story here ? What is the difference ? Was there a company split ? Like Altec Lansing or what ? Or whatever...
Feeling like an Over Zealous Dipshit here !

Sorry guys !
Army

Toasted Almond
08-21-2004, 06:34 AM
You can feel like an idiot if you want, but that doesn't change the fact that you have picked up some awesome sound.

Teledyne bought AR and became Teledyne Acoustic Research. It took quite a while for the company to water down, and your loudspeakers were designed and offered at the tail end of the good period. My 9's are also Teledyne Acoustic Research. The original AR company went from around 1954 to the sale to Teledyne in the 70's.

There's not much being produced by AR today.

TA

Army
08-21-2004, 09:13 AM
Originally posted by Toasted Almond
You can feel like an idiot if you want, but that doesn't change the fact that you have picked up some awesome sound.

TA

Hey TA

Thanks for the info !

I wasn't sure what I had after the blanket discussion !? I was really excited about these speakers. Then reality jumped in there and I was afraid I was singing the praises of the wrong speakers entirely. And gonna get a big helping of you dumb ass those aren't what you think they are.
I did a very quick google search the day I got them and found the AR home site and there wasn't much info to go on.

I need to kick my kids and SO off the computer long enough to do a little more googling. My time has been really limited to jumping on and off AK lately. Even less since I now have to watch my internet usage at work. Been a big crack down on personal use lately. Don't want to loose a good job.
So thanks again for any and all info it's much appreciated ;)
Regards
Army

Grumpy
08-21-2004, 09:40 AM
Not positive but I think the main difference between the original AR9 and the LS was the non LS used a 12 inch and the LS used 10's. Either way I think you got lucky enough to warrant dropping a few buck on Lotto tickets. Maybe lighting can strike twice ;)

Army
08-21-2004, 11:01 AM
Originally posted by grumpy
Not positive but I think the main difference between the original AR9 and the LS was the non LS used a 12 inch and the LS used 10's. Either way I think you got lucky enough to warrant dropping a few buck on Lotto tickets. Maybe lighting can strike twice ;)

Hi Grumpy

Not sure what the differences are. So just for kicks I'll list what it says on the front of the speakers. Then maybe TA can tell us what the differences are if he'd be so kind.;)

AR 200048
Dual Dome Mid/High Range Driver
3/4" and 1 1/2" hemispheric Domes
Range: 1,100hz-25000hz
Crossover at 5,500hz

AR 200045
8" Lower Midrange, 1 1/2" voice coil
Seperate Sub enclosure
Range: 200hz-1,100hz

AR 200003
12" Long Throw, 2"voice coil,
inert cone acoustic supension woofer
Range: to 200hz, 3db down at 28hz

AR 200033
10" Long Throw, acoustic supension woofer,
1 1/2" voice coil loaded by bass contour chamber
Range: to 200hz, 3db down at 28hz

I'll throw some photo's up later of the woofers when I get a chance to take them out. I do know that the 12" woofer has a HUGE square magnet. Curious to see what the rest look like.

Take Care !
Army

Toasted Almond
08-21-2004, 11:02 AM
I think Grumpy may be right about one of the woofers being a ten inch in the LS, instead of two twelves on a 9. The downward firing woofer is the ten. The forward firing woofer is the same 12" AR used on just about everything. The flattened frame gives it away. I believe it was the AR-3 or 3a cabinet that wouldn't accept the fully rounded 12 inch woofer, so they flattened it on the sides and created a winner. Same woofers are used in the 9's, LST's, 10's, 11's.

Aside from the woofers, the same 8" cone/lower mid is on the 9, as well as the 1 1/2" domed/upper mid, and 3/4" domed tweet.

TA

Army
08-21-2004, 01:00 PM
Hi Guys

My sweet deal just hit a snag. One of the 8"midranges is not AR it's got an Advent replacement instead. It didn't sound too bad. But I'd like to restore these back to as close to original condition as possible.

Do you think this would be a good replacement. I'm betting a working original mid would be hard to find ?!

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=5716436914&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT

Please let me know what ya think !
Thanks
Army

Toasted Almond
08-21-2004, 03:04 PM
You need to get in touch with AB Tech, or Layne Audio for a good shot at exact replacements. That 8" was used as a woofer in a lot of AR speakers down through the years also. You'll find one.



Here's a shitty shot of my AR-9's. I don't know what the ghostly activity is around the dome upper mid. I didn't move when I took the shot. The acoustic blanket is some kind of wool/felt stuff more than 1/2" thick.

Toasted Almond
08-21-2004, 03:09 PM
Here is the 200wpc M-5090 that I drive the 4 x 12" acoustic suspension woofers with. Next in line to the M-510, it's the Son of Onkzilla.

Toasted Almond
08-21-2004, 03:11 PM
The 250wpc Carver M-500t that I use to drive everything but the woofers.

Toasted Almond
08-21-2004, 03:18 PM
APT "Holman" preamp and Carver TX-11a tuner round out my magnificent, half-ass, home theater system. No other speakers other than the AR-9's. They image so well, and go down so freakin' deep, no other speakers are required.

To my ears, these are bested in both categories by the Carver Platinum Amazings in my other He-Man rig in the other room. Nothing else that was available right off the shelf, can either image or go down as deep as the Amazings. The AR-9's are a close second in the low end. I realize a lot of DIYers probably have some amazing creations of their own, that outperform the Carvers.

TroyD
08-21-2004, 03:34 PM
And that, friends, is just his HT rig........

BDT

Army
08-21-2004, 03:39 PM
Wow I'm in AWE !

Beautiful gear there TA !

Bi Amping the 9's bet that sounds amazing. :yes:

I wrote the guy a long e-mail and got an auto response they're out till Monday. Doesn't sound like he knows much from his ad.

My drivers that are AR say made in USA his say Taiwan :confused:

Guess I better put this obession on the back burner till I find the right replacement. Gonna get an estimate from Andyman on refoaming the rest. I want to get these done by a pro. I hated to tear them down especially since the surrounds went south as soon as I took them out. Just that fragile damn it.

Cheers
Army

gyusher
08-21-2004, 05:03 PM
By golly some else does have a Apt-Holman Preamp. . . I have a near mint one from a trade with a fellow AKer. . . Works perfect. That stereo knob is very interesting. . . . Love the little delicate toggle switches, great little preamp. . . .

Toasted Almond
08-21-2004, 07:08 PM
Yup. Nice preamp.

Hey Troy,

How's that on location relative humidity?

TA

TroyD
08-22-2004, 10:08 AM
Not good.....REALLY high humidity at times.

TELL me that you folks aren't getting tagged for this lovely location....

BDT

Toasted Almond
08-22-2004, 11:32 AM
No. Just making fun of your situation. Hey, you signed on the dotted line, not me.

For moi it's Christmas in another locale, but at least a nation that celebrates Christmas.

TA

TroyD
08-22-2004, 12:58 PM
Yeah, yeah, yeah.........I think I need another travel agent.

I think I'm down to 26 and a wakeup.....

BDT

Rockmonton
08-22-2004, 01:27 PM
hey lets see what that 4x12" woofer cab looks like! if you wouldnt mind

(curious minds)

bolly
01-14-2005, 05:19 AM
hey Army, We need a sit-rep. :D Lookin' at your pic TA, your 9's seem to have curved front cabinet corners?

Toasted Almond
01-14-2005, 06:45 AM
Nope. It's your eyeballs that are curved.

bolly
01-14-2005, 07:00 AM
Thanks TA, I just realized I was lookin' at the stand on the left! :D