Tubes-n-Horns

[MikE]

PART 1:Have any of you tube guys (preferably SET) listened to any horn or single drivers speakers with tubes? Much like the talk surrounding SET, I've read too many posts about the so-called "magic" between SET+Horns that I'm inclined to explore that avenue, no matter how happy I may be with my SET+Dynamic combo.

PART 2: There is a post on another forum about power and how that relates to sound quality. The thinking that the LOWER the output the BETTER the sound. Any comments on this. This pretains to tube amps ONLY. I'm still relatively new to the low-power game, yet based on my limited experience there appears something to it, then again the output tube has a big effect on the sound as well. What have you tube guys noticed as being paramount in sound quality or amp performance; tube type (power, rectifier or input) & or tube brand or vintage, amp topology or parts quality.

MikE

[Rob]

Mike,

I listened to P-P 6CA7's in ultralinear on Altec 802-8D drivers 18dB/octave HP filtered into 511B horns for 27 years and loved the clarity, efficiency and throw. With a new room and need to have speakers that fit wih my HT screen setup I took the opportunity to explore full range horns and since building them a few weeks ago have been having fun with speakers that sound way different than what I was used to, yet also very good. The bass seems much less labored and so clear and immediate. These horns have given me the opportunity for the first time to listen to my 6CA7 amp below 500 Hz, full range now. It is fantastic, but I am now in a position to try out some SET designs as I like you am also curious.

I think that just because a tube amp soft clips producing predominantly second order harmonics and not harsh odd orders, and therefore gives sonic forgiveness when overdriven marginally I do believe that headroom is just as important in a tube /speaker combo as it is in SS/speaker setups. Although I could listen to piano and classical guitar on my very efficient horns with a 2 watt SET amp I wouldn't get the commanding bass from other types of music that I especially enjoy at higher SPLs. My average listening power might be 500 milliwatts or less, but I'm sure I'm hitting 20+ watts in the LF peaks at times when I've got it turned up. Remarkably, I've never turned it up to clipping yet. I built this amp to deliver 20 watts RMS/channel. The output tubes Mullards, have lasted almost 30 years in my amp and they were used pulls from an Ampex VR-1000 VTR head drive servo amp when I got 'em. Talk about a conservative, reliable design!

I'm in the process of building a SET amp based on the 805 transmitting triode because it will give 30 watts RMS, a small headroom increase over what I have now (I believe in headroom), yet give me an example of SET sound to evaluate. At the same time I wish someone would bring over a small SET amp to try on my horns, something like your 45 Moth for example or a 300B SE so I can hear what all the fuss is about. :) I'll buy the beer. And possibly better than a SET, if Dave Berning will bring over his ZH270 I'll buy champagne, hint hint. ;)

Rob

[WildWest]

You know Rob. I would be very interested in seeing the plans for the SET amp you are building. Be interesting to know what brand of caps you prefer and why. Also if you don't mind, I would be curious to know of your overall investment in parts and tubes when you are done. Thanks!

[MikE]

I'm relatively inexperienced with both SET and horns and was curious of your opinion, having lived with horns, on certain aspects of their signature and presentation. I've heard people define horns as forward and shouty and as also having an ease or fluidity that is not found with other speaker types. These two charactheristics appear polar opposities. Can you explain? I realize not all horns - like any speaker type - sound identical or even similiar. I prefer a more laid-back presentation, one that is more ambient or atmospheric with wonderful detail but natural or organic way, not contrived. Ease of presentation is a signature I associate with SET and find it massively appealing. I want to relax and forget I'm listening through the blk boxes, that I'm only hearing the music, reducing the distance between technology and listener. Which quality do your horns display; a cohesive naturalness, or are they more forward? Do you find yourself drawn into the music or admiring the delivery source? I understand that horns are not the best at "disappearing" or imaging and that by nature you will notice them more than other speaker types. TIA

MikE

[Thatch_Ear]

I built a bass horn loosely designed from a Jensen Imperial. I am using a Jensen PL15LL in it with a re-capped Bogen DB20 PP 6L6 (coke bottle RCAs) to drive it as the lower end of my center channel for HT. Not that it matters, the mid/high is from a pair of JansZen ES with a Fisher 400 (7868 PP) driving them. As to the horn I find it very touchy and often have to adjust 2 or 3 times to get it right. When it is dialed in it does a great job. As for mid range and tweeter horns I find them to be harsh and shrill with the exception of the EV 35 tweets. I had a pair of 511Bs with 808B drivers and even with the phenolic domes could not listen to them. And I damped the horns so it wasn't horn ring. I bought a pair of Altec 804s and hate them. University Cobreflex with the small drivers are ok but still bright even used as a mid. I guess I just don't like compression drivers. Full range horns can be nice but only with full range speakers, or 2 ways that are tuned to go down to only 70 Hz or so. Actually listened to some hooked up to 2A3s a couple of weeks ago. Very nice. Very hard to build. I am going to go the Tranmission Line route myself.

[gonefishin]

Hey MikE...

part one: Are you going to the next Lima? (speaking of...how's the little one?) You really can only get part of an idea of what any system sounds like when going to shows...some rooms are better than others...but most are far less than ideal.
When (if :tongue: ) I get done with my speakers...your more than welcome to come over and have a listen. As you know...they'll have a midrange horn...a high effiency sealed woofer and a H.E. tweeter for the highs.

Part two:The thinking that the LOWER the output the BETTER the sound. No...I haven't found this to be an absolute. You can definatly over power some of the older compression drivers. A 45 amp does sound great! and 99.9% of the time the power will be enough (of course depending on the music) But on some complicated passages you can hear them start to distort. This is when being played perhaps louder than it should be...actually...the music is a bit under loud...it's those darn peeks that just have an enormous range on horns...from th most delicate hit of a triangle or brush work to a trombone blaring at close to real levels...all without touching the volume.
But, I would say matching of components is more important than any hard and fast rule...as lower power is better. Amps do sound different...heck, tubes sound different...in the same amp(but you know that) If all a person does is listen to a specific amp once (with one set of tubes) and then makes an absolute judgment on either that amp or that tube type is not giving the tube, the amp or themselves a fair chance.

take care>>>>>>>

[Thatch_Ear]

GF,
Well put. I just have found over the years that my ears tend to be overlly sensetive to shrill highs. Thus my preference for tubes and my non preference for compression drivers. There are a lot of horns I have not heard but for the most part the horns that I have heard and enjoyed used coned drivers and not compression drivers. I have a good friend that thinks the 811/802 is the best thing since sliced bread. Wish I could hear his set up with the active cross and the tubes for mid/highs and SS for the lows. But even if I don't care for it he loves it. And that is all that counts.
Thatch

[Rob]

Originally posted by Thatch_Ear
GF,...I have a good friend that thinks the 811/802 is the best thing since sliced bread. Wish I could hear his set up with the active cross and the tubes for mid/highs and SS for the lows. But even if I don't care for it he loves it. And that is all that counts.
Thatch

Thatch,

My old home made system used 511B's driven by 802-8D's and actively crossed at 18dB/octave slope at 500 Hz. SS bottom end, my homemade 6CA7 ultra Linear P-P for the HF horns. I used to love this system. The Kamameister has these speakers now. The clear sound from those horns used to give me goosebumps. Here is a photo of the way I had it set up in one house. The four 15" drivers were on a Marantz 240 PA. The 18" subs were driven L+R mono summing LP filter 18db/octave below 100Hz and the big Rotel receiver used as a PA for it at 225 watts/woofer.

I'm still using that old 20W/ch 6CA7 amp on my new horns now full range and it is totally boss.

Rob

[Thatch_Ear]

That system looks like a lot of fun. I was really excited about the 511/808s when I found them in the backroom of a pro music dealer in an indoor flea market. I tried all kinds of things including using them only for about 1 K Hz in the midsection but just didn't like them. I made a bit of money when I sold them but it was one of those seldom one across deals and I will probably never have a pair of horns like them again. I am on the prowl for a pair of Heils now. I need to get started on my speakers for the October event of DIY speaker builders. The Heils seem like just what I need for a tube friendly 2 way.

[Jobman]

MikE:

Well, for the last 2 years I have been getting into tube equipment and it seems constantly changing either amps or speakers or both.
I currently have Wright Sound 2A3 monoblocks with the Wright WPL-20 preamp. The 2A3 tubes are RCA's from 1945 and are wonderful.
I have paired them primarily with Klipsch speakers, from Heresys to K-Horns. (I loved the K-horns, but did not have the appropriate corners for them, so to Ebay they went!) Right now, I am alternating between Cornwalls and Chorus II's. They are different, and I am still sorting the pros and cons.

I have auditioned Audio Notes, Paradigm and Silverlines. (I almost snagged a great price on a Pair of Sonata II's a month ago, but someone beat me to them!) I do like the Silverlines, but I was concerned about the efficency with a 3.5wpc amp.

I would also like to try a pair of singel drive horns!

Anyway, just my .02

Jobman

[MikE]

First off, WELCOME! That out of the way. We have much in common, equipment ownershipwise. Where to begin... first what exactly do you mean you're "constantly changing either amps or speakers, or both."? Is it that you've gradually found better and better components or are you just that picky or both? And is it that the components you have had just didn't do it for you or weren't they good enough, or both? The Wrights are supposed to be damn fine sounding amps, similar to mine but even so some people have graduated from them. Do the Wrights in particular give you cause for suspicion?

Ok about those Klipsch, I understand why the Khorns got ditched, how is the combination of Cornwall+Wrights? There is another guy runing that combo that swears it is the bomb and the Cornwalls are "magical" in conveying the "soul of the performance". What are the pros and cons with the combo and with the Klipsch?

About the Silverlines, which did you audition and what were the conditions, IYS or in a showroom? How did you perceive the strenghts of the Silverlines vs the Klipsch? Apples-n-oranges? I keep hearing about an "ease" and "continuity" with horns that seems exactly what I'm looking for, yet I find the Sonatinas+Moth+45 globe tubes to deliver about everything *I* could wish for in replay. Then again, if I were'nt interested in further exploration I wouldn't be asking all these questions. Did you read my "Moth Arrives" thread? Have you heard 45 output tubes? If so, do you still favor the RCA 2a3? TIA

MikE

[Chris Garrett]

I've logged a lot of hours in front of Avantgarde Duo v.1s and Cary 2A3 SEs, Manley Retro 300B parallels, Supratek Merlot parallel 6C33Cs.

In another system, I've logged many hours in front of another pair of Merlots (both gain stages running) and Medallion II/Lowther DX-4 single driver horns. Very lovely.

I have my Wright Mono 8 300Bs hooked up to some '74 Klipsch Cornwalls w/vertical horns. Very fast, clean and dynamic.

Don't get me wrong, I do dynamic box/PP in the main rig, but I'm happy with this SET/Horn system too.

1.5w-2.5w or 3-5w will only go so far with a dynamic box. Start looking around.

Take care, Chris

[Billfort]

I used to use a 300B SET amp in a small (11x12) room with bookshelf cone speakers that where sort of SET friendly (smooth 8ohm load, 91db eff.). Sounded very nice with a sweet midrange and great imaging - all the hi-fi stuff.

Then I got a pair of Altec 604's - 100db eff., horn loaded from 1500hz up. Now this was in a whole different league - effortless dynamics, fast open sound, an amazingly real soundstage. These took my system from hi-fi to music. Even though I don't think the 300B's played anywhere near their output ceiling with the bookshelf's, it just seems the Altecs let the "magic" happen with this amp. The Altecs do seem to have a slightly forward midrange but after playing around with speaker wire, positioning and adding a bunch of room treatment (it is an 11x12 room!) this tendency seems to have gone away - at least I don't notice it anymore.

I've listened to a bunch of high dollar, high power, low efficiency systems since first hearing SET based rigs and can honestly say there is no going back for me. The magic happens with low power SET's.

Billf

[Thatch_Ear]

Bill,
What type of 604s do you have? I have a pair of 604-8Gs and they are some that should have been factory rejects. I have heard 604s in other places and mine are instant listening fatigue intead of disapearing like a good Altecs should. I think there was a lot of bad ones being made when mine were (around 74) or so I have heard. I don't know whether to get rid of them or to send them to Bill H in OK City and have him rebuild them. They are the single largest investment I ever made in Stereo and I can't listen to them. The cabinets are huge too! Have them parked in a corner of my dining room.
Thatch

[gonefishin]

Thatch_Ear, If ya decide ta get rid of'em...give me a yell ;)

But first...what are you powering them with?

[MikE]

Tapping into your wealth of experience resources you seem to indicate that all the systems you mentioned were nice or had positive attributes. Having lived with the Moth 45+Sonatina combo for four months I find I'm listening to lower levels (55-75db) than with my pp VAC. And no, it's not because of the limited headroom with the Moth. I've realized 93db peaks (with the 45s). It's just that I'm getting more, MUCH MORE, into the music and less into watching the system at higher levels. When I do catch myself listening to the system it usually revolves around an aspect of delicacy, naturalness and a greater variety in tonal shadings. With the ST 45s I was more drawn to the musical bassline, with globe 45s I do not find that as evident, yet prefer the globes overall.

My question, seeing that I'm listening to lower levels coupled with my subtle replay preferences do you think I would be happy with a horn-based system? Aren't they better at louder levels and don't they have a more aggressive personality? The Sonatinas are somewhat aggressive themselves but have been tamed with the 45 Moth. I know I'll have to listen first-hand, but I'm just curious what you think, if I REALLY would be happier with another type of speaker. If there is something better out there (I'm sure), I'll gladly "suffer" till that moment of understanding.

MikE

[akshobhyavajra]

When I first got my Zen SE84C from Steve Deckert in ILL I was using several types of Klipsch Speakers, including Klipsch Reference RP3 speakers (95 db @ 1watt/meter) and Klipsch KSF 8.5 (94 db), but felt both were selling the ZEN amp a bit short. I ended up going to a pair of Reference 3A MM Master Series II (92 db - minimal x-over). These speakers image better and seem to compliment the SETs warmth and detail.

Here is a bit more info on this system:

http://cgi.audioasylum.com/systems/3134.html

Hope this helps a bit,

~Michael~

[MikE]

I see another Inmate registered on AK - cool! Thanks for sharing your experience with the Klipsch. I heard the p3's with some Cary 2a3 monoblocks... OK... but I was expecting more. Are you satisfied with the ZEN's output? Headroom or compression not a problem??? Suggestion: Have you thought about aceing those MIT's? I've had luck with DIY 24awg solid silver "cables" - cheap & very good.

MikE

[Thatch_Ear]

Mike,
It is too bad you don't live around here as there is a horn designer about 30 mi from me that has some absolutely great horns for 80 Hz and up. With 10" full ranges and some $100/pair ribbons I was getting goosebumps. This guy is into less is better except where size is concered. He uses a single 6db high pass for the full range horns and has an active cross for dividing the signal and sending the 80Hz and up to his 2A3s and the 80Hz and down to a Crown mono block for bass. Also a horn, which you can see at <www.bassmaxx.com>
I gave him some Raytheon black plate 12AU7s for his preamp and dragged him around the metroplex a bit to the hole in the wall transformer/cap/tube/wire places and he is really getting into rolling tubes a lot. His designs were right on, just needed the right tubes to get them to really sing.
Really the best horns I have ever listened to bar none. I would like to hear Rob's given the chance.
Thatch

[akshobhyavajra]

Originally posted by MikE
Are you satisfied with the ZEN's output? Headroom or compression not a problem??? Suggestion: Have you thought about aceing those MIT's? I've had luck with DIY 24awg solid silver "cables" - cheap & very good.

MikE

MikE,

I use the Zen in a relatively small room (15 x 10 x 8) when I want to listen to Coltrane, Davis, Bruebeck, et al... i.e. classic Jazz. I think the Zen is fine as long as passages are not too complex. What it does it does well, i.e. detail, image and midrange. It is a lovely piece.

I have a couple of other systems set up - a push-pull tube system with an old Dual TT (I like vintage stuff - guess because I am slowly turning vintage myself ;) )and a SS Parasound setup for alternative, metal and A/V .... that way I don't have to depend on the Zen for that (not it's intended purpose anyway).

As far as the MIT go - I like their sonic signature with the Zen, the Monolithic phono and the DAC. Transparent Music Link was too dark, Kimber PBJ was less detailed and too bright, Wireworld and Monster compressed soundstage. The MIT seems a good match for this particular setup. YMMW on other systems - I suspect.

Finally - a very interesting piece is the ASL MG SI 15 DT - which is a single-ended design with triode/pentode switch - allowing it to get beefed up from 5W to 15W. The piece got a lot of positive press a while back during an audio show in Canada...

http://shows.soundstagelive.com/shows/avtour2000/mtl_stand_reference3a.html

I have not heard the integrated set, but own some ASL pieces - and they seem a good value. If I would have known about the 15s before I purchased the Zen... I may have bought them instead. I do like the Zen - but the 15s seem more versitile.

Glad to be on board....

~Michael~

[dderat]

Hi Thatch,

I suspect I am that friend who likes the 811/802 combo. I do...more than anything I have had. (A friend in college always did say I was easily amused.) :)

While I say that I don't see how anything could be better, I am quick to acknowledge that I said that before each improvement I made, only to find that they could be, and did become, better; and I'll be the first to admit that these are not the "ne plus ultra" of speakerdom.

Sadly, I am not awash in a sea of people with equipment that can bring my education, experience and appreciation along. My contemporaries out here think the "good stuff" is a Bose Wave Radio or some under $100 complete surround system. :(

You are a good friend. I do hope we will meet out here someday so you can have a listen. I will welcome your input and then we will have some lobster, steamers and chowdah. And then someday in TX for some Texas Beef, chile and hot peppers.

[Thatch_Ear]

Derat,
You certainly were the friend I was refering to. And I wrote that never thinking you might read it, but am glad you did.
I am lucky in that I have a friend close by to share with and the fact that he designs and builds his own horns is a big plus in my book. Hopefully one day soon Johan the horn master will join our group of music addicts.
We all talk about the gear that gets us there but the place we go to is the same. The realm of music. The fact that we don't all take the same path is the great thing. Every one has an approach or special way of doing things and is willing to share it with others. How cool is that?

[Brett]

Hi Mike,
I've just seen this thread, so I might make a couple of posts along the way.
Originally posted by MikE
PART 1:Have any of you tube guys (preferably SET) listened to any horn or single drivers speakers with tubes? Much like the talk surrounding SET, I've read too many posts about the so-called "magic" between SET+Horns that I'm inclined to explore that avenue, no matter how happy I may be with my SET+Dynamic combo.
Tubes and horns, two of my three fave audio subjects. Vinyl is the third.
There is definitely a synergy between tubes and horns, and the lower power tube amps should really only be used with high eff speakers like horns. Definitely explore the tubes/horn thing. After two decades of looking, going through lots of cones'n'domes, 'stats and Tannoys, horns are it for me. A-bloody-mazing. The first time I heard my Khorns was a bit of a life changing experience. I won't go back.

However, I'm not a fan of SETs. I've never heard one that didn't sound muddy to me, especially when the going gets tough, like a full orchestra or choir. No NFB PP amps, done properly can equal or better SETs IMO, especially if you're driving your speakers full range with them.

PART 2: There is a post on another forum about power and how that relates to sound quality. The thinking that the LOWER the output the BETTER the sound. Any comments on this. This pretains to tube amps ONLY. I'm still relatively new to the low-power game, yet based on my limited experience there appears something to it, then again the output tube has a big effect on the sound as well. What have you tube guys noticed as being paramount in sound quality or amp performance; tube type (power, rectifier or input) & or tube brand or vintage, amp topology or parts quality.
I hear this a bit, but haven't experienced it myself. The lowest power amps I do are 2.5W EL84 PPs, but some anecdotal evidence I have from some experienced builders, is running an 845 at low voltage/high current sounds extraordinary for 4-5W. Looking at the curves for an 845, at these sort of op points, you can almost take a ruler to the page they're so straight. I think for these tubes and some of the really small antiques, the use of thoriated tungsten might be the secret to the sound.

When people rave about the quality of a really low powered amp, I always look at what they're running it with, and try to find out what levels they listen at. I've read some reports on the net, where people are obviously running well into the non-linear regions of their tubes on peaks if they run them at any sort of reasonable level. My experience is in any system you need just enough gain, and lots of headroom, which means on even high eff speaks, you'll still need a couple of watts.

Imperative for good performance in my book is
*Linearity. Both in tubes chosen and circuit topology. Without it you're making a big tone control and dynamic range compressor
*Immunity from power supply. Whether that means a WE type connection or PP or good regulation, always shunt. Power supply impedance and wideband noise level must be low.
*Low noise and hum. Low level noise and hum mask the fine deatils present, and just add dirt to the listening window.
*No NFB. Creates as many sonic problems as it solves, and NFB really only works well if the open loop linearity is good anyway.
*Differential circuits. Done properly, always sound better to my ears than single ended.
*Circuit parameters stable under the real world varying conditions of reactive speaker loads and grid current for output tubes near clipping.
*Lots of dynamic headroom, and just enough gain for the circuit.

Get some horns and try them. Awesome.

Cheers

[Tom Brennan]

I think it's a mistake to be dogmatic about this tube-horn thing. I've been using horns for over 30 years and heard them sound good with both SS and tube amps.

This SET thing doesn't do much for me, recently the Korneff 45 amp and AudioNote 300B monoblocks left me seriously underwhelmed (well the Korneff was good but no better than my ASL integrated), in fact I thought the AudioNotes were downright bad, the worst amps I ever heard. I heard both Korneff and AudioNotes over my Altec 605As. The AudioNotes made it sound like there was a blanket over the speakers, all mush. And if these amps don't work with 605s I can't imagine what they would work with.

On the other hand other tube amps like old Fisher SA-100s, 80AZs, a modified ST-70 and a couple of ASL models sounded very good on my 605s or driving the compression drivers on my big VOT system. But a friend's DIY TriPath digital amp sounds just as good as any tubes. And one of the best horn rigs I've heard is Mike Baker's with JBL CS3115s driven by (gasp) QSC prosound amps. My opinions ya understand.

www.chicagohornspeakerclub.org

[mhardy6647]

I have a pair of Klipsch Cornwalls (OK not all horn-loaded, but on the right track) that came with a McIntosh MC2100 ss poweramp and C28 preamp. That combination sounded absolutely dreadful: bright and harsh... I slowly realized that the "Heritage" Klipsch speakers were designed for (and with) tube amps. Cut to the chase: I use the Cornwalls now with Doc Bottlehead's entry-level "Paramour" 2A3 parallel-feed, no NFB power amps (and an EICO HF85 preamp as old as me) for all serious listening... and I doubt if I'd ever go back.

There's a lot of hoopla (and, I suspect, hype) out there about this topic: I'd say this, there's a lot to be said for efficient speakers and extremely simple, low power amplifiers. The lack of NFB and low damping factor of SET amps like mine probably mean that there really "is" a synergy between certain amps and speakers (i.e., a complex, reactive will certainly affect the "sound" of an amp of this sort).

For the record, I use home-made CAT5 speaker cables and I/C's made from RadioShack's fine 30-ga magnet wire!

[Thatch_Ear]

How did you manage to braid that 30 AWG RS magnet wire? I have tried 3 times and have always gotten a severe enough kink that I started over. What kind of braid do you use and how many strands? Wire is not a safe subject in a lot of places and I don't want to start any thing. How about we start a thread in DIY ? This certainly falls into that catagory.

[Rob]

Originally posted by Thatch_Ear
Mike,
It is too bad you don't live around here as there is a horn designer about 30 mi from me that has some absolutely great horns for 80 Hz and up......
Really the best horns I have ever listened to bar none. I would like to hear Rob's given the chance.
Thatch

Thatch,

Well come on over and give my big 50Hz babies a listen! I'll buy the coffee. Too bad you are so far away.

BTW, I'm developing a pair of much smaller rear loaded folded horns right now with the intent of possibly marketing them once totally developed. My prototypes are showing great promise. It is a proprietary design which might be patentable and makes incredible smooth bass to 35 Hz that can be heard in the next building with just two 3.5 inch full-range drivers (the total cone area of a single 5" driver). I'm having lots of fun with this design! They might be just the ticket for low power SET. I'll be getting my first chance to listen to them with my 20w/ch 6CA7 PP ultralinear amp this weekend.

Rob

[greg]

I am currently running McIntosh C2200 Tube Pre Amp/MC2102 Amp/ MCD 205 CD Transport into a pair of Klipsch LaScala's...nothing in the world is better!!!!!!!!
I have run a McIntosh 2205/C32/MR78/ Thorens into 4 Klipsch Belle Klipsch Speakers and it was pretty good but the tubes and horns work best.
Just a current observation.
By the way I listen to alot of Jazz/ 60's rock it all sounds really good.

Greg

[ProAc_Fan]

I am a total newbie when it comes to horns and low powered tube amps but it's been so far so good. I'm running an old Electrohome amp ( from a console) modified to a single ended pentode design using 6BQ5 output tube. IIRC it makes a whopping 1.5 watts and mated to a pair of Altec A7's it sounds fantastic.

Mike

[MikE]

Cool. Sounds like fun. I've had a few samplings myself and it does have it's charms. Certainly, something I'd like to explore further.

currently running McIntosh C2200 Tube Pre Amp/MC2102 Amp/ MCD 205 CD Transport into a pair of Klipsch LaScala's...nothing in the world is better!!!!!!!!... I listen to alot of Jazz/ 60's rock it all sounds really good. Great! MikE

[jt1stcav]

Like ProAc_Fan, I'm also a tube-nube. I've had great results with SS driving my '79 Klipsch Cornwalls (McIntosh MC7200, MC2100, and my favorite, the MC250), but I'm excited about driving 'em soon with my Model T3B 300B SET from BEZ (waiting for it's arrival from Hong Kong).

In the meantime, I'm using my brother's eBay find...a $125 2WPC 1962 Magnavox 6BQ5 SE pentode console amp, and I am truely impressed with the dynamics this 42 year old amplifier produces through my horns...WOW is an understatement! Imaging and soundstage are truely life-like, with that warm, smooth single-ended "magic" that's often refered to with this design. My horns no longer rupture my ears like the MC7200 often had a tendancy to do, and even though I can't play my music to over 110dB levels anymore, bass content is remarkably deep and tight with the dual 15" woofers...who says there's no punch with tubes? I ditched my subwoofer a long time ago and still don't miss it!

"The shrill is gone..."

[jpchleapas]

I am still learning and experimenting with tubes and horns. I have a set up in my apartment with a pair of JBL L300 horn midrange speakers. I used to use a Dynaco ST-70 modified with the Kennedy mods. It sounded really good. I am now using a vintage Magnevox 6v6 pp amp of about 11 to 12 watts a channel in my apartment. The sound is great, a tad less bass but great midrange. My Dad's stereo that I cobbled together is more of the higher end. He has gamungus JBL 2360A 31" x 31" biradial horns. We are using TAD TD-4001 2" compression drivers. The bass bins are JBL 4648A-8 with twin 15" JBL woofers. The sound was very good with a CJ 100 wpc tube amp using 8 Mullard EL34 tubes. These are the best sounding speakers I have heard to date. Of course there are better sounding speakers, but at what cost? I am now listening to his 2-way speakers with a pair Welborne monoblock 300b DRD ultimate amplifiers. These have the SS rectification. The sound is quite good to my ears. The next goal is to conect the Marchand XM-126 2-way crossover. I will be using the 100 wpc CJ to power the bass bins, and the small 8 wpc Welborne 300b amps for the horns. Should be hooked up by next weekend. I need to lose the balanced inputs on the Marchand crossover and install rca plugs so I can simply plug in both amps to the crossover. I will suggest to all who play with tubes to spend the $12 to $15 a tube cost and run out and buy some of the good Herbie audio labs tube dampers. I now use them on my preamplifier, and power amplifier tubes. They are a bargain! Have fun with your tubes and horns experimentation. I have learned that good sound is more than just plugging in any new amplifier. The speakers are the most critical part of my two stereos to me. I like the sound of my CJ PV-11 preamplier where no electrolytics are used, even in the main power supply input filter. I use powervar conditioners to filter out the noise in the ac lines. There is a bit of thought in matching your amps, preamps together with good thought. To me vintage is fun and a good way to get higher end equipment without breaking the bank. Remember always that all audio is very subjective at best. The best sound is live. Everything else is a compromise of some sort and coloration of the sounds we hear in our home listening. We are all chasing that sound with our home stereos, period. Go with what sounds good to your own ears and have fun along the way.

[TriodeMike]

One of the best sounding setups in a theatre I have ever heard was a small theatre with A7 Altec Voice of the Theatre and a WE91 amplifiers. This was really sweet.
A friend owns the Altec 604 duplex and it sounds great with a 300B "Flesh and Blood" copy.