I found a fair HK Citation I locally. This is my first HK piece! I've been looking at HK and had a little lust going but there really hadn't been much locally until this. I'm thinking about mating it with a pair of 20 watt monoblocks. But of course, first I have to get it functioning properly. Looking thru the archives here, I found a schematic, owner's manual and a couple of locations for parts (Jim McShane & Sheldon Stokes).

Does anyone have any experience with rebuilding a Citation I? I'd like to hear what you thought about it and did.

Are there any other good HK sites which I missed?

And does anyone have a service manual to share or know where there's one on the web for download?

Sams 599-5 - I'd make you a copy if I had it... try Michelle at http://www.michelletroutman.com/manulist.htm
or Walt at http://infotronix.us/

I have a couple of them. They sound better than I thought they would! The tone controls are truly bypassable, and the power supply is BIG for a preamp. The soundstage is large. Great old find.

It will take you a long time to replace caps, though, if you want to be complete...

Personally, I'd just retrofit the power supply with new caps and any other stuff that looks wonky there, and see what it can do, before diving into something as severe as replacing the approximately 1 million caps in one of those. IME, they sound pretty darn good, by just replacing all the electrolytics, and leaving the film caps alone...

Regards,
Gordon.

I keep looking for one of those to re-work. I've had a great time with the Citation II I re-did with Jim McShane's suggestions and parts. It really is right in there with any vintage Mac gear - and I've got them too.

I'm sure there are *lots* of caps due to the number of equalization curves it supported when new. Back then, there were plenty of options between NAB tape heads and various LP company playback curves, given the number of LP speeds. Not standards as we have it today. For most of those caps, you're never going to use anyway - unless you're into 78s.

I'd also suggest Gordon's approach: make the power supply safe and then deal with interstage coupling caps. I'd also suspect some clean RCA connectors may be in order, too.

Excellent find.

Cheers,

David

I am amazed at how many caps there are in this preamp...not to mention resistors, inductors, etc., It doesn't look like there's much space for working. I think that it will be a challenge keeping the soldering iron where it should be instead of touching three other things at the same time!
Gordon, I have to say that I kind of like your idea of limiting the replacements to obvious problems and electrolytics. I've read differing opinions about replacing the power supply caps. Some think that they need a chance to reform and then replace only if they show a ripple on an Oscope. I don't have enough experience to form my own opinion yet on that.
Tubino, it's nice hear that they sound good after the effort is put in. Did you completely replace all of the caps in yours? That was a BIG job if you did! Is there anything else that needs to be done besides replace with like? For example, I know that with the Fisher500 there's a couple of changes like getting rid of the selenium rectifier, putting resistors on the output tube cathodes, and putting in resistors to change the FM de-emphasis, etc.,..other than just cap replacements. This will be my first preamp rebuild when I do it.
Tom, I'll check out those links. Thanks.

DS...and I'd like to find a Citation II as well. :D :D I've heard that those are great amps which provide very realistic (uncolored) sound. So I take it that you were happy with the service that Jim provided? Sounds like you are another person who believes that the power supply caps ought to be replaced. I'll probably do that on the better-safe-than-sorry line of thought. I wonder if that means I'll need to learn how to stuff those d*mn multi cap cans?

I just got one from Bow Tie and after taking the top and bottom off was just amazed at the number of Black Beauties there are in that thing. I don't have any immediate plans for it and probably won't get into the thing for a couple of months.
I plan on replacing the 6 diodes and taking about 3 days on the variac to warm it up after hitting all the pots and multi switches with DeOxit. No humms and that will be that. Humms and I will tackle the electrolytic cans (4) but replacing what looks to be around 100 Black Beauties is something I don't even want to think about.
Somebody stole the Sam's from the library so I might have to ask Julia to print off a large schematic that I found on line. That PDF file is so large it froze my puter up but since she works at an architectual firm I can get a really large print of the thing.
I will say that with all those Black Beauties in there, the craftmanship, etc it sure did remind me of McIntosh.

DS...and I'd like to find a Citation II as well. :D :D I've heard that those are great amps which provide very realistic (uncolored) sound. So I take it that you were happy with the service that Jim provided? Sounds like you are another person who believes that the power supply caps ought to be replaced. I'll probably do that on the better-safe-than-sorry line of thought. I wonder if that means I'll need to learn how to stuff those d*mn multi cap cans?
Comments for you:

* I did all the upgrades myself on my Citation II - I'm an old bench tech from the 70s so not a problem - fun, actually. Jim's guidance on the items to address were his real value. I purchased parts from him because 1) he's done the work and I wanted to support him and 2) he is a highly reputable supplier of parts he knows work well. I would trust his guidance on the Citation I pre in this same way.

* Yes, the Citation II is now right in there with any Mac tube amp, IMHO, and built like them too. In particurlar, Jim's star-grounding approach was especially spectacular when I implemented it. BTW, I did listening tests on each stage of his upgrades and they're all effeective.

* Yes, I am a proponent of the better-safe-first approach. Yes, this may lower an amp's value in the eyes of a collector. I'm not a collector. I run my Citation II about 12 hours per day when I'm working from my home office and about 5 hours when not. I want gear that's not going to fail on me or worse, take out irreplacable parts like output or power transformers. I've also experienced a major house fire 10 years ago. IMHO, there's no amount of safety you can take to avoid having this happen to you.

* On the restuffing of multi-section cans, I've used Zack Engineering in Oregon to supply me with replacements to my spec. They're usually about $25/can. They have the forming equipment to close off the can so it looks right when completed.

Cheers,

David

Thatch, I wish you good luck on just replacing the diodes. With all those electrolytics in there after all these years...someone has to get lucky though.
What caps do you think would be a good match for replacing black beauties?

DS, I've heard of Zack. It seems like several people have used his services. At this point, I'm not sure what I'll do but it's always good to collect info on potential resources.

The trick is going to be finding out which caps will be used (tape in won't but tape out will) and finding out the values of the caps. I think WIMAs would be a good choice, but hopefully a long slow warm up will keep everything happy and I am more worried about the electrolitic filter caps than the Black Beauties. I don't think there is anything wrong whith Black Beauties per say but they are OLD and some will be gone.
If I do indeed need to recap the thing it will be in stages. The diodes are all easy to get to and that shouldn't be a problem at all.

i second the motion to find a Citation II. i had one that i sold to finance an upgrade, but can safely say that it competes strongly against new more expensive amps. weighs a ton, around 80lbs! had NOS Valves replace electrolytics, and it sounded great. usually can be had under 1K before upgrades. add another couple hundred for new caps and tubes and you have a true classic that sounds great!

Styler, don't you realize that you are feeding my audio illness? ....now all I need is the $1K... :D

hanging out here is feeding your illness. i tried to give AK a break for a couple weeks to cool off my constant desire for more audio... it worked a little, but i'm back. sorry for enabling your addicition. however, it beats crack and heroin. that HK Citation II is a really great amp, and it can be had cheaper, but if you come across one that requires shipping, they will need to pack super super well. grumpy had the sweetest HK Citation II i've seen, with complete stock of HK branded tubes... keep your eyes out, you might find one under the radar and get lucky! hell of an amp! :thmbsp:

Styler, if you were able to stay away for a couple of weeks then you were doing much better than me. I'm on here a few times a day getting my fix.Thank God, this doesn't involve needles :yes: So I guess you kinda' relapsed, eh? Well, at least we can all keep each other company :thmbsp: