View Full Version : Acoustic Research AR-14 Good? Bad?


djcslice
10-09-2005, 11:27 AM
title says it all

hifi_nut
10-09-2005, 11:32 AM
What title?
Jorge

Toasted Almond
10-09-2005, 03:46 PM
Worth owning.

mhardy6647
10-09-2005, 04:12 PM
I like mine. Nothing wrong with the Teledyne-area AR's (10 through 18).
They're almost exactly the same size as the AR-3's... no coincidence, I suspect.

EDIT: You know about the "Classic Speaker Pages", yes? If not, you should peruse it, esp. the AR section(s):
http://www.classicspeakerpages.net/ar/ar.htm

soundk3
10-09-2005, 04:19 PM
AR 14's used the peerless KO-10DT tweeter, altho AR had to reject close to 50% of initial tweeters. One of the better AR speakers of the time, and probably still ok.

EVBoy
10-09-2005, 04:22 PM
They are good speakers. I like the ones I have. Foam grills are probably long gone but you may be able to buy new ones.

Toasted Almond
10-09-2005, 04:24 PM
One post and I already like the hell out of soundk3.

mhardy6647
10-09-2005, 04:29 PM
AR 14's used the peerless KO-10DT tweeter, altho AR had to reject close to 50% of initial tweeters.

Hmmm, this is interesting! The AR-14's tweeter sure doesn't look like the stock KO10DT... although Teledyne/AR I am sure had enough clout to have a custom mounting plate (i.e., OEM version).

Gonna snap a few piccies of my AR-14's and Polk 7's tweeters, and see what develops (so to speak)!

Grayhouse
10-09-2005, 04:44 PM
The AR-14 was produced from 1977 to 1980 retailed for $180.00 Here are the specs.

I know if I could pick up a pair on the cheap I wouldn't hesitate....Afterall they're AR :yes:

http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/7509/ar14brochurefront7ya.jpg
http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/9008/ar14brochurerear9lj.jpg

mhardy6647
10-09-2005, 04:45 PM
Matt Polk's implementation of the venerable KO10DT (ca. 1977) in a Polk Audio Monitor 7A. Polk polked :-) little holes in the center of 'em, for some reason.

djcslice
10-09-2005, 04:46 PM
25 for the pair but one may be both need a new woofer diaphram

mhardy6647
10-09-2005, 04:47 PM
'n here's the tweeter from an AR-14.

mhardy6647
10-09-2005, 04:50 PM
one may be both need a new woofer diaphram

Maybe just need new foam surrounds? Not a big deal... and even if they really need reconing, it'd be worth it IMNSHO.

Grayhouse
10-09-2005, 04:52 PM
25 for the pair but one may be both need a new woofer diaphram
If they need new foam that's still a fair price, djcslice. What condition are the cabs in and are all the drivers original and working?

djcslice
10-09-2005, 04:56 PM
its a craigslist find and they say that cab is in good condition. But one woofer needs a new diaphram

Toasted Almond
10-09-2005, 05:03 PM
Buy them, especially if it's a local pick-up and you don't have to add anything onto the $25 for shipping.

tentoze
10-09-2005, 05:09 PM
Buy them, especially if it's a local pick-up and you don't have to add anything onto the $25 for shipping.

What he said. You could drop $25 on a lot worse and end up with a lot less. Stop typing and do it.

Grayhouse
10-09-2005, 05:37 PM
I'm willing to bet what he means is surround, and not diaphram. Still for 25 bucks I'd be willing to take that chance espeacially if they're a local pick-up and you can check them out first hand. Like tentoze, said. You can do so much worse :yes:

mhardy6647
10-09-2005, 06:22 PM
OK, not like I am obsessing about this or anything, but...
The ad posted by Grayhouse got me thinking. The ones in G's ad scan are earlier than 1977, as you can tell by their brass colored "AR-14" labels. You can see the 1977 and later "AR" tags in the brochure ZIPped at the Classic Speaker Pages.

As luck (?) would have it, I have ONE of the earlier AR's like the ones in G's scan: Just went downstairs, pulled it out from under the bench, and snapped a photo of ITS tweeter. This one looks much more Peerless-esque, although (interestingly) the mounting plate is rounded off (similar to the older AR-14's I showed above), not rectangular. Hmmm....

Now, in terms of the original thread: were it me, I'd certainly grab a pair of AR-14's for $25!

Toasted Almond
10-09-2005, 06:30 PM
Any chance it isn't a plain vanilla AR-14, but maybe a 14b, bx, or bxi? The more letters after the number the less it excites me.

savv
10-09-2005, 06:31 PM
I own AR14 speakers which I terribly miss (they are still in the Philippines). They were my first vintage speakers. I noticed that they hardly turn up in Ebay at all.

Grayhouse
10-09-2005, 06:49 PM
mrh, the first pic you posted is a 1977 version of the AR-14 (matches the one found in the truth in listening brochuer, dated 1977) The second pic and most recent dates from 1976...I think. I blew up the pic from the spec sheet I posted and they too apear rounded just like yours. So you may have the earliest version of the AR-14 and a deffinate keeper, but since the spec sheet I posted isn't dated I couldn't say for sure. Now you just gotta get those woofs refoamed :yes:

Kencat
10-09-2005, 07:47 PM
'n here's the tweeter from an AR-14.

mrh, where did this pic come from ? This tweeter looks identical to the ones in my AR48s's. But there is a difference (screw patterns) to the one in your actual speaker. It looks like AR may have moved to this "newer" style tweeter at some point in the AR14's life. Wonder if the new style is still a Peerless ?

Interesting for me, in that I can maybe get a spare set of tweets from a set of 14's.

AR48s tweeter below.

Kencat
10-09-2005, 07:55 PM
mrh, the first pic you posted is a 1977 version of the AR-14 (matches the one found in the truth in listening brochuer, dated 1977) The second pic and most recent dates from 1976...I think. I blew up the pic from the spec sheet I posted and they too apear rounded just like yours. So you may have the earliest version of the AR-14 and a deffinate keeper, but since the spec sheet I posted isn't dated I couldn't say for sure. Now you just gotta get those woofs refoamed :yes:

Actually, I think the tweets in the bochure are like mrh's . Here is a "brightened" up pic from the brochure. The inner "4 screw" pattern is there. The newer one has the same shape, but an inner "3 screw" pattern.

mhardy6647
10-09-2005, 08:15 PM
mrh, where did this pic come from ? This tweeter looks identical to the ones in my AR48s's. But there is a difference (screw patterns) to the one in your actual speaker...

The photo of the newer AR-14 I posted is one of the pair in my basement; the older AR-14 is the single 1 have in the basement. The latter one does indeed need a re-foam :-)

I really don't think the newer tweeter is a Peerless, but it's a fine sounding tweeter in its own right. Note that it says "made in USA" on it, FWIW. It does indeed look just like the AR48s tweeter, Kencat.

http://audiokarma.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=41012

Kencat
10-09-2005, 08:30 PM
mrh,

Do the "newer" tweeters actually still work? I have not been able to come across any of these to replace my two dead ones, and I read that they do have a longevity problem. I think most of them in existence have died :cry:

The older style may be the better ones for sure.

mhardy6647
10-09-2005, 08:44 PM
yup, they're working fine. I have the AR-14's on my Magnavox EL84pp stereo console amp (sitting atop my AR-3's as a matter of fact).

ARguy
10-09-2005, 08:46 PM
Just last week there was a pair of the second generation AR14 tweeters on eBay. I tried to pick them up to have an extra pair on hand for repairs but they slipped through my fingers. Don't remember what the winning bid turned out to be. I bought my last pair of 14s for $25 from a local collector who didn't want to refoam the woofers. Cabinets are in VG condition and everything else is in working order. Can't have enough of the old ARs!

mhardy6647
10-09-2005, 09:00 PM
TA may cringe, but all three o'mine were dump finds.

Grayhouse
10-09-2005, 09:06 PM
TA may cringe, but all three o'mine were dump finds.
AR's at the dump :sigh: I don't know about TA, but that sure makes me cringe :gigglemad:

Toasted Almond
10-09-2005, 09:10 PM
I'm not cringing man. They need to get found wherever they are, and they need to go to good, APPRECIATIVE homes like yours.

For awhile I was hiting it pretty good with the Dynaco stuff cause I live around "Dynaco/Hafler" Central. I expect you to come up with a lot of good dump, and end of driveway finds at your location, AR Central.

mhardy6647
10-09-2005, 09:28 PM
So far I've befriended three homeless AR-14's, two AR-3's, and two AR-2ax's. All in good working order but all more or less cosmetically challenged. Also an AR-XA. Well, I think it's an AR-XA... I don't have the various incarnations of that tt straight.

All freebies from the swap pile at the dump. One of the best things about living in New England. Certainly better than the baseball!

savv
10-09-2005, 10:09 PM
FWIW, my AR14's tweeters were mirror imaged. I recall that they had very sweet highs and excellent at imaging.

Toasted Almond
10-09-2005, 10:24 PM
XA was as manual a turntable as it gets Mark. It was the one with no cueing lift thing, and no hinges on the dust cover. The XB had an arm lifter. If either came with the Shure M91ED cartridge installed, they were XA-91 and XB-91.

Kencat
10-09-2005, 10:27 PM
yup, they're working fine. I have the AR-14's on my Magnavox EL84pp stereo console amp (sitting atop my AR-3's as a matter of fact).

You are a lucky man ! If you come across any of these tweets at your dump gold mine, keep me in mind. I am resisting the temptation to butcher my 48s's to throw in a tweeter of some kind, but I keep hoping I'll find some originals somewhere...sometime. I KNOW they will be a sweet sounding speaker...they just look it.

Grayhouse
10-10-2005, 01:10 AM
mrh, if you check the part number of your tweeter you can determine if it's the early (76), or later (77 to 80) AR-14. The old (or early tweeter) part number is 200020-0 The new (or later tweeter) part number is 200024-1

Here also is a lightened blown-up shot from the AR-14 flyer I posted earlier. It is a dead match of your orphan 14.

http://img406.imageshack.us/img406/5903/ar14brochurerear19fr.jpg

Kencat
10-10-2005, 03:59 PM
mrh, if you check the part number of your tweeter you can determine if it's the early (76), or later (77 to 80) AR-14. The old (or early tweeter) part number is 200020-0 The new (or later tweeter) part number is 200024-1



Thanks Grayhouse. You never know where useful info will come from on this forum :) The 200024-1 tweeter is exactly what is in the 48s. If the older style is a Peerless, then AR had a similar type made (probably cheaper) by a local manufacturer and switched to them. The 200020-0 may give me another option to use, especially if the plate and mounting hole dimensions were carried over, and hopefully the performance specs as well.

mrh, look for a PM asking for some help comparing dimensions of old and new tweeters.

Grayhouse
10-10-2005, 04:55 PM
Thanks Grayhouse. You never know where useful info will come from on this forum :) The 200024-1 tweeter is exactly what is in the 48s. If the older style is a Peerless, then AR had a similar type made (probably cheaper) by a local manufacturer and switched to them. The 200020-0 may give me another option to use, especially if the plate and mounting hole dimensions were carried over, and hopefully the performance specs as well.
Glad to be of service Ken. Here is some further info that might help. The new style tweeter was also used in the AR-15 and the old style tweeter was also used in the AR-16.

djcslice
10-11-2005, 12:28 AM
well i am picking them up for 15, how much do you think it would cost to refoam one of the woofers?

Toasted Almond
10-11-2005, 01:06 AM
Half as much as it would cost to re-foam both, which is what you really should do. If one surround has gone south, the other isn't far behind. If you do it yourself, about $20 for a pair of surrounds. Maybe a couple bucks more. Professionally done it shouldn't cost more than $50 the pair. If you're quoted a higher price for pro work, the guy is a freakin' thief.

Grayhouse
10-11-2005, 01:26 AM
TA is right. You should always refoam both speakers at the same time espeacialy if both surrounds were original. I would also suggest that you do the work yourself. It's not that difficult and there are plenty of tutorials available here in the forums to show how to do it. Also you will get a far greater sence of acomplishment as well as apreciation knowing that you did the work yourself.

djcslice
10-11-2005, 09:03 AM
who sells re-foaming kits? parts express?

mhardy6647
10-11-2005, 09:12 AM
you can indeed buy the kits from PartsExpress, or buy surrounds alone (much cheaper) from RSSounds or MAT Electronics. The PE kits are good for beginners. Steve Deckert has a photo tutorial on refoaming at his website: www.decware.com There's also one here at AK, somewhere. Techniques vary, but it really isnt' too difficult. Heck, I can do it!

djcslice
10-11-2005, 03:27 PM
i was told by the seller that the actual diaphragm needs to be replaced. I assume then it becomes a lot more expensive venture. I would also assume that both woofers should be reconed. How much should i expect to pay for reconing of two woofers?

djcslice
10-11-2005, 03:45 PM
???

MarkAnderson
10-11-2005, 03:52 PM
Based on a recent conversation with GordonW, I'd say your'e looking at $50-60 per woofer for a recone. I have to wonder, though, is the seller qualified to make this determination? Is the cone trashed? Voice coil open? Details, man! Details! - Mark

djcslice
10-11-2005, 04:24 PM
he said it was torn around the circumference. i would think that was the foam surround, but maybe not.

Grayhouse
10-11-2005, 05:12 PM
Dollar for doughnuts it's the surround and not the cone, or VC diaphram, djcslice. Replacing cones becomes a much more expensive endevor than replacing foam surrounds. Maybe you can get him to send you a pic of the woofer in question.

Here's a crossection of a comon driver so you'll know what we are talking about.

http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/1741/img25of.jpg

djcslice
10-11-2005, 07:38 PM
from the picture he sent me, i can only conclude it is the surround. I am looking in to a refoaming kit. Does anyone recomend a certain kit for these speakers? By the way what is the size of these woofers?

djcslice
10-11-2005, 08:34 PM
????

Grayhouse
10-11-2005, 08:43 PM
????
Sorry about that djcslice. From the lit they are 10" woofers, but AR had a strange way of measureing there drivers, but since these are from the 70's maybe AR had had broken themselves of that nasty habit buy then. I would advice that you wait untill you can actually measure the drivers to determine the size surrounds you will need. Once you get the speakers I can tell you where to take the measurements from.

djcslice
10-11-2005, 08:48 PM
i have the speakers now

djcslice
10-11-2005, 08:51 PM
P.S. Grayhouse and other members, I really appretiate all of your help in figuring this out.

djcslice
10-11-2005, 10:05 PM
????

djcslice
10-11-2005, 10:19 PM
double post

Grayhouse
10-11-2005, 11:15 PM
i have the speakers now
Great :thmbsp: Do you have some pics you can post and we will need some good pics of the woofer as well to make it a little easier.

djcslice
10-11-2005, 11:17 PM
i will post them when i get back into town on the 20th

Grayhouse
10-11-2005, 11:34 PM
No problem, djcslice. These are the 3 most crucial deminsions you have to worry about when you go to measure.

A). Frame dia.
B). Foam outside dia.
C). Inside roll/cone dia.

As well you will need to determaine if it is an angle mount or flat mount.

Here are a few online surround suppliers.

http://www.simplyspeakers.com/2doityourself.htm
http://www.speakerworks.net/kits.html
http://www.decware.com/newsite/foams.htm
http://www.speakerparts.com/kits.asp

http://img415.imageshack.us/img415/1205/untitled39vc.jpg

Grayhouse
10-12-2005, 04:01 PM
djcslice, here is an exact surround replacement for the AR-14

http://cgi.ebay.com/ACOUSTIC-RESEARCH-AR-10-IN-WOOFER-SURROUND-KIT_W0QQitemZ5817630014QQcategoryZ14993QQssPageNam eZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

djcslice
10-12-2005, 06:34 PM
thanks for that link. you dont know by chance who makes that kit do you?

Grayhouse
10-12-2005, 07:05 PM
Sorry djcslice, I don't know where he gets his foam surrounds from, but I'm almost certain that he assembles the kits himself. Though I have never had any dealings with him myself, I have heard from a few people here that he is very trustworthy and that his products are always high quality at a fair price. I wish I knew about him when I refoamed my AR-3a's

djcslice
10-13-2005, 09:13 AM
i just found out that the seller replaced the other woofer a while ago. I would assume that he put in a something that isnt AR. Is it easy to get a hold of an old AR woofer or am i better off replacing the old one, or replacing both???

djcslice
10-13-2005, 09:32 AM
????

MarkAnderson
10-13-2005, 11:14 AM
I'd be inclined to seek out an original woofer. I would imagine they come up on eBay occasionally, although I don't recall having seen one lately. You might also try posting a want-ad here in the classifieds. I didn't really help, did I? :sigh: - Mark

djcslice
10-13-2005, 11:20 AM
thanks for the suggestions

Grayhouse
10-13-2005, 01:32 PM
i just found out that the seller replaced the other woofer a while ago. I would assume that he put in a something that isnt AR. Is it easy to get a hold of an old AR woofer or am i better off replacing the old one, or replacing both???
What makes you think that it has been replaced with a non AR unit? Does it look different than the other woofer? The part# for tha AR-14 woofer should be 200004-2. I would suggest that you pull both woofers and examine and compare the two. How much surround is left on the woofer that needs refoaming?

djcslice
10-13-2005, 02:02 PM
i cannot see it right now but i was told it looks a lot newer. My brother is going to pull both of them tonight and check if they are different. I would assume they are. But hopefully they are the same

guiller
05-29-2008, 03:26 PM
Hi,

A local seller is tempting me with a pair of AR-15G's (what does theG stand for?) . I've never heard these speakers, although I'm now restoring a pair of vintage AR-3s. One of the AR-15's has a tweeter issue, but I'll find what is it on Sunday when I get a chance to listen to them. Are there any common issues I should be looking for? Is the tweeter some exotic type that cannot be easily repared?

I'd greatly appreciate any inputs!

All the best