?Yamaha rxv 757 or Onkyo tx-sr703

[Cuseman]

Input Appreciated. I'm in the process of upgrading my vintage stereo system to a/v surround but still want the best music reproduction I can get for the price, as I listen to music much more than I watch movies. I will be hooking up a TT, cassette deck, vcr, cd player and dvd player. As I am new to the a/v surround world I'd appreciate your thoughts on which a/v reciever would be better for me: the Yamaha rxv 757 or the Onkyo tx-sr703? I'm looking in the $400 -$600 range

Both are 100w/ and both have phono inputs and similar features, Which do you think will be better for music listening? I'm presuming they both will do fine in surround mode.

Thanks in advance for any help or suggestions.

[Vinyl Rules!]

Input Appreciated. I'm in the process of upgrading my vintage stereo system to a/v surround but still want the best music reproduction I can get for the price, as I listen to music much more than I watch movies. I will be hooking up a TT, cassette deck, vcr, cd player and dvd player. As I am new to the a/v surround world I'd appreciate your thoughts on which a/v reciever would be better for me: the Yamaha rxv 757 or the Onkyo tx-sr703? I'm looking in the $400 -$600 range

Both are 100w/ and both have phono inputs and similar features, Which do you think will be better for music listening? I'm presuming they both will do fine in surround mode.

Thanks in advance for any help or suggestions.
The Perfect Vision AND The Absolute Sound reviewed the RX-V657 and proclaimed it the best moderately priced A/V they'd ever heard on music - The even compared it to an unidentified but well-regarded (their words) stereo amp and the Yamaha trounced it in the reproduction of music (go to http://tinyurl.com/qbyqm and click on the RX-V657 reviews). The RX-V659 has replaced both the RX-V657 AND the RX-V757 and it is the identical unit to the RX-V757 with the addition of the 5.1 XM Radio output and an iPod adapter. And both of these Yamaha receivers have received rave reviews in the British Hi Fi press as well.

I use an RX-V657 soley as an A/V preamp in my system - The auto calibration has a parametric room equalizer built-in and I'm not certain if the Onkyo's calibration is as precise and as accurate as the Yamaha's: Yamaha has had much more experience developing and building this kind of parametric room equalization.

My RX-V657 replaced an Onkyo TS-DX696 (kind of a 5.1 version of the TX-SR703 and I found the Yamaha to have a much better tuner in it and its preamp section sounded much better than the Onkyo's. I considered the newer Onkyo as an alternative to the RX-V657 but ruled it out because the Yamaha offered much more for much less IMHO.

And as for the 100 wpc output, with all channels driven you'll be lucky to get an honest 35 wpc to 40 wpc with all 7 channels running flat out. But, I've seen test reports on the Yamaha that puts it at about 135 wpc at 8 ohms in stereo and over 200 wpc at 4 ohms. Howver, there are only a mere handful of receivers that actually will output their rated power with all channels driven and these units generally cost over $4,000 or $5,000. Anyway, I would not use either of these receivers in a system with inefficient speakers - This is why I use mine as an A/V pre-amp and it works a treat in this use.

I know you said music reproduction was your top priority and the RX-V657 impressed the reviewers at TPV and TAS in spades with its ability to accurately reproduce music, but it also gives you the capability to add two additional "presence" speakers to the front channels for a truly stunning cinematic experience when viewing a movie: The Onkyo does not have this capability.

And Yamaha is large enough that they build their own logic chips - Onkyo is a much smaller company and they have to purchase their chips.

I don't think the Onkyo is a bad unit, I just think the Yamaha is a better buy. and now the RX-V757 has being replaced with a newer, almost identical unit that will decode 5.1 XM Radio broadcasts and has an input for an iPod docking station. I use neither so this is irrelevant to me. :cool:

[Cuseman]

Thanks for the feedback. Just read it today. However, I did pick up a Yamaha rx-v757 a few days ago for $300 (used, but barely so). Yamaha is no longer making them so they are very hard to find new now with the 759 out. This was about half of what the 703 would have cost, and like you, I have no need for XM radio and ipod capability. You say you use it only as a pre-amp. How's that work? With the 757, would I be able to hook up my old stereo receiver to run the b speakers or zone 2 and use the 757 as the pre-amp?

[Vinyl Rules!]

Thanks for the feedback. Just read it today. However, I did pick up a Yamaha rx-v757 a few days ago for $300 (used, but barely so). Yamaha is no longer making them so they are very hard to find new now with the 759 out. This was about half of what the 703 would have cost, and like you, I have no need for XM radio and ipod capability. You say you use it only as a pre-amp. How's that work? With the 757, would I be able to hook up my old stereo receiver to run the b speakers or zone 2 and use the 757 as the pre-amp?
Here are my thoughts on your questions:

1. The 757 has 2-channel stereo XM capability built-in, the 759 has the new 5.1 channel codec XM radio has developed, but only a few XM channels are actually broadcasting 5.1 XM radio - Most are still just 2.0 stereo. I read the general technical specs (they didn't get too technical though) somewhere (can't remember the URL and didn't save it) for the 5.1 codec and it calls for a "smart" decoder chip to be utilized in an XM tuner to automatically switch from 2.0 sterero XM to 5.1 XM when it detects a 5.1 XM signal and vice versa, and the specs for this chip have been made available to chip manufactuers.

Trouble is, no one has yet built a tuner with this specific chip, so you have to manually change to 5.1 when you tune to an XM 5.1 station and you have to manually change back to 2.0 when you tune to an XM 2.0 stereo channel. The one report I've read is that if you leave the tuner in the 5.1 mode and tune to a 2.0 stereo channel, the bit rate for the 2.0 channels is severely reduced and the 2.0 stereo signal sounds like real dog poo :pawprint: until you change the tuner setting to 2.0 stereo. This sounds to me like the codec for 5.1 XM has a fixed number of bits and data to work with and the actual number of bits for each channel get reduced in the 5.1 mode and they stay reduced for the front left and rear channels when you tune to a 2.0 stereo XM station until you reset the tuner to 2.0. :drool:

I think this is a lot of trouble to go to for a radio signal that at its best, is significantly lower in quality than a good public radio station. But, as always, YMMV.

2. Yamaha actually rates the 759 as having a bit more power than the 757, and they added the docking port for an iPod, and they added a phono preamp, and they kept the same retail price. What troubles me is that the 759 is a pound or two lighter than the 757 when you open the product manual and look at the specs page. IMHO, it's never a good thing for A/V receiver to get lighter, as this implies cheaper construction and a lighter transformer and less ability to put out higher peak power. So one could hypothesize the 759 is maybe a teensy bit lower quality A/V receiver than the 757, but we're splitting hairs here.

3. You can use your 757 in a 7.1 mode AND use the Zone 2 speaker clips to drive Zone 2 speaker OR drive 2 additional front effects speakers, but you can't do both. Your choice on the 757 (as well as on the 759) is 7.1 + stereo Zone 2 speakers OR 7.1 + Front Effects speakers (giving you a total of 5 speakers in the front). I've never tried using Front Effects speakers in my system and I don't need the Zone 2 capability, so I turn off Zone 2 when my 757 is in use. If you want to use your old stereo receiver to drive addional speakers, take the output signal from the "Tape Out" jacks on the back of the 757 and run them into an "Aux" input on your stereo receiver and hook up your extra stereo speakers to the old stereo receiver.

4. As for use as a preamp, I'm surprised more people don't consider using any good 7.1 A/V receiver with 7.1 pre-amp outputs as an A/V pre-amp. The A/V pre-amp functionality on the 757 and the ability to individually tweak all of the parameters of each different effects setting simply isn't available until you get into the mid 4-figure price range of the Lexicon and other A/V preamps, and most of them (except for the Lexicon) don't have the extra effects sound fields offered on the 757.

I have found the 757 to make an absolutely superb A/V preamp and it's a great stereo preamp for high level signals. And you can significantly improve the effects settings if you are willing to spend several hours with each different setting tweaking it for your particular listening tastes. Virtually no other receiver, except for the more expensive Yamaha's offer this level of adjustment and flexibility. You can spend hours deep in the menu system of the 757 tweaking all the different parameters for each of the effects settings offered. And no other receiver manufacturer, nor anyone else, for that matter, offers the option of adding two additional effects speakers to the front channels for even more dramatic effects on cinema and musical sources. :cool:

[Cuseman]

Thanks again. Not sure I understand the pre-amp weaking thing. So, is your 757 hooked up to another amplifier? My other concern is this - I've bought a 2nd hand set of Boston micro surrounds to use for home theatre, but also have a vintage set of Infinity 3-way floor speakers I want to keep in the same room for music listening. Would I be better off a) hooking them up directly to the 757 B terminals, perhaps running them through my receiver hooked up to the 757 through zone 2 or just not use the 757 at all? I still listen to a lot of vinyl, tape and CDs. I'm new to this whole home theatre thing and haven't set anything up yet so thanks in advance for any more advice.

[Vinyl Rules!]

Thanks again. Not sure I understand the pre-amp weaking thing. So, is your 757 hooked up to another amplifier? My other concern is this - I've bought a 2nd hand set of Boston micro surrounds to use for home theatre, but also have a vintage set of Infinity 3-way floor speakers I want to keep in the same room for music listening. Would I be better off a) hooking them up directly to the 757 B terminals, perhaps running them through my receiver hooked up to the 757 through zone 2 or just not use the 757 at all? I still listen to a lot of vinyl, tape and CDs. I'm new to this whole home theatre thing and haven't set anything up yet so thanks in advance for any more advice.
The RX-V757 has 10 pre-amp output jacks on its back panel. You can see them on Yamaha's RX-V757 website.

1. Left Front
2. Center Front
3. Right Front
4. Left Side Surround
5. Right Side Surround
6. Left Rear Surround
7. Right Rear Surround
8. Subwoofer
9. Zone A Right
10. Zone B Left

This is not the precise words for the labeling on the back, but it's an accurate description of the outputs.

Numbers 1 - 7 are pre-amp outputs and can be plugged directly into the input of any power amp, large or small, tube or solid state. You can use up to 7 individual mono power amps, or you can purchase a 5 channel power amp or you can purchase a 7 channel power amp. You probably won't need to do this unless your speakers need a lot of power and you listen at headbanging levels or your speakers are difficult to drive and have low impedences (some Infinity speakers exhibit this behaviour) or you have a very large room. If you decided to do this, you would not be using any of the power amps built into the RX-V757 - In this configuration, your speakers would be hooked up to the respective separate power amps so you would be using the 757 solely as a pre-amp and possibly a tuner if you decide to hook up an antenna and listen to FM and AM. The FM tuner in this unit is very good for a receiver tuner.

I would recommend simply beginning with using the built-in power amps in the 757 and just attach your speakers to the speaker terminals on the back. AND READ THE ENTIRE MANUAL FROM FRONT TO BACK IF YOU HAVE NOT ALREADY DONE SO - YOU WILL LEARN MUCH. :rockon:

Number 8, the subwoofer output, goes to your separate subwoofer if you have a powered subwoofer. In the set up menu you can vary the cross-over frequency for the subwoofer from 40Hz to up to 160Hz or 180Hz. READ THE MANUAL TO LEARN HOW TO DO THIS. :rockon: If you don't have a powered subwoofer, you can use a passive subwoofer driven by a separate external power amp and run the sub out from the 757 into the power amp driving the subwoofer.

Number 9 and 10 can be used as pre-amp outputs to your extra receiver and this gives you the flexibility to hook up any pair of speakers you want to your extra receiver. However, if all you want to do is have an extra set of stereo speakers playing in another room, you can run speaker wire from the speakers to the push speaker terminals on the back of the 757 for the Zone A speakers.

OR you can use either the pre-amp outputs or the push speaker terminals for driving a single pair of front effects speakers. READ THE MANUAL TO UNDERSTAND WHAT THIS MEANS. :rockon: . If the front effects speakers are similar in tone and sound to your front 3 speakers, you can achieve some spectacular sounds in the various movie and music modes built into the 757.

I know I sound like a broken record, but you really need to sit down and read the manual front to back several times and all will become clear.

You cannot hook a turntable up to the 757 as it does not have a phono input. If your old stereo receiver has a phono pre-amp in it, you can hook your turntable up to the old stereo receiver and run a cable from the tape out jacks on the back of the old receiver into one of the inputs on the 757 and listen to your records this way. If you do this, make certain the speakers on the old receiver are turned off unless you also want to listen to them as well.

To answer your other question, yes, I only use my 757 as a pre-amp: No speakers are hooked up to any of the speaker terminals. :cool:

[Cuseman]

Hey, thanks again for for taking the time to give me all this info. Although I've bought this unit have not picked it up yet (this Monday), but as soon as I do that I will definitely read the manual through several times, before trying to set it up. By the way, the 757 does have a phono input, or I would never have bought it. Hopefully, all will go well. Thanks again.

[Vinyl Rules!]

Hey, thanks again for for taking the time to give me all this info. Although I've bought this unit have not picked it up yet (this Monday), but as soon as I do that I will definitely read the manual through several times, before trying to set it up. By the way, the 757 does have a phono input, or I would never have bought it. Hopefully, all will go well. Thanks again.
You are correct.

I was confusing the 757 with the 657: They are actually identical (same weight) except the 757 does have a phono pre-amp whilst the 657 does not. Enjoy the 757. :cool:

[mguy]

To answer your other question, yes, I only use my 757 as a pre-amp: No speakers are hooked up to any of the speaker terminals. :cool:

Hi, in regards to using the 757 as a pre-amp: are you using it for home theater ? How many speakers are you using with your system.

Thanks

[Vinyl Rules!]

Hi, in regards to using the 757 as a pre-amp: are you using it for home theater ? How many speakers are you using with your system.

Thanks
I made a typo: I have a 657 rather than a 757, but they are virtually identical except the 757 has a phono input that is not on the 657.

To answer your question, yes, I use the 657 as an A/V pre-amp and I use a 5.1 speaker system. I've tried side surrounds in the 7.1 configuration but in my particular room it made not one whit of difference on movie soundtracks, so I went back to the 5.1 configuration. And the side surround speakers and their amp were identical to the rear surround speakers and their amp, so this was not a problem.

I've not heard much difference between well-set up 5.1 and 7.1 systems and IMHO, I don't think the cost/benefit ratio is there for most people in a 7.1 system unless they have a really huge listening/viewing room. :cool:

[mguy]

Vlnly Rules : When using the 657 as a AV Pre amp ; If I connected my vintage 2 channel stereo to the 657, to watch movies, would the 2 channels from vintage stereo be active or would I get the 5.1 or 7.1 through the 657 ?

I'm sorry, I didnt want to make this post so confusing. I've just be debating on keeping my 2 channels for music on or adding on to it for surround sound.

Thanks