Philips Tape Deck

[Brian]

Well, yesterday I picked up a Philips N4506 tape deck to add to the Philips system. This is the big brother to the 4504 and has a complete preamp built-in which could drive into either a power amp or mated with the Philips MFB speakers systems. Condition is easy 9.5 out of 10 with no noticable head wear, no loss of lettering or brighwork. This with the 4504 was Philips attempt to make a reel to reel to go high-end. I pulled the connectors of the H-K 630 and used the power amp into the Smaller Advents and fed the tape in/out from the front end of the the H-K for testing.

The unit uses the DIN connectors which I got 2 sets with the maching. This was enough to get my going but I had a time getting the right combinations of cables to work with the H-K. I'll label everything so I don't have to go through it again. The maching has several pro features including cuing and forward/rewind speed controls. These with the volume, balance, bass, treble, line input, phono, thuner, aux, swithches, separate attenuators for each (yes each) input/output connection, mic., record, fade controls, DNL, AMP/TAPE, Source/Tape and quite a few other switches and controls makes for a wide and busy panel. It is a 3 speed machine. Strangely the unit is only 7 1/2" reel capable.. Also, the controls for play, rewind, FF, etc. are mechanical rather than electronic and require some effort. The meters work for the tape as well as the inputs and are a nice touch for preamp use.

It took some time to figure out the configuration for using both the preamp and for recording and monitoring - here a manual would help because of the features. Companies like Revox , Tandberg, Teac, etc. never were threathened by this machine. Yes, three motors, yes, all kinds of features but, obviously an update of early transport design especially the switching. I'd forgotten that early systems did not have automatic shutoff at end of tape - or if this 1 does, it is not working. The rotary controls are not really smooth, a function of the control being set in the chassis which is rather far in from the faceplate and which have small shafts. The knobs have to reach quite far in. The toggle swiches have thin levers and extend quite far out from the faceplate. This explains why more than a few of the units on eBay have broken knobs and switches. The unit has a plastic case that gives the unit a rather cheaper feel (this must have really been tremed CHEAP in those days of metal). Remember though that many European decks (Tandberg tube units, Revox) used plastic so it is not totally out of place.

Sound - Record/Playback - I was given a reel of unknown tape with the the maching. It appears to have been used by a recording studio and have Jazz recorded on it. Sound was open, dynamic, well ranged with detail. All in all very good. I then used the tape to record and playback some classical from the local station using the H-K tuner. I could not get the input/output signal levels to match but this may be partially b/c of the combinations of level attenuators, record levels the machine has, though I'm not convinced of it. The tape output is dull and high end down by at least 3 db. I will need to get the machine biased for a tape standard.

Using the preamp, it is very competent with very good mids and high end reproduction, somewhat brighter than the H-K hi-level preamp. The music content I listened to did not have much in the low end so I'll listen to that today, possibly through a CD. With the attenuators it offers capabilities for matching input/output levels even better than my McIntosh C28. It did nicely with the H-K 630 power amp and I may leave it hooked in even when I move the unit into the Philips system. I originally thought of using the amp on the 2nd set of preamp outputs and run the front end of the Philips through the amp to the Smaller Advents.

I purchased the unit from the reseller from whom I got the Philips amp, preamp and tuner. He also produced a GA312 late production tt with the red led rather than the green so they match into the leds of the tuner, preamp and amp. I passed on it since I have 3 tts and I'm using the Empire 598III on the system but, may decide to pick it up. I've also added a Philips CD player which is about a generation newer than the Magnivox player I have.

If I did not have the Philips componetns and an interest in matching up an all Philips system, I'd probably have passed on the tape deck opting for another Revox to replace the 1 I had for years. But, it is impressive looking and an interesting addition.

[Trawlerman]

Nice review there Brian..... Any chance of some pictures for the archives?

I found this whilst searching for information on the N4504. My local rag has one advertised that i'm tempted to get.

Hmmphh.... Damn this tape-acid fever :scratch2:

[Brian]

I am vintage even with photography. The tape decks are the same except mine has the preamp. I got it only b/c I wanted to add it to the Philips system. Make sure it works in all modes, especially end of tape shutoff. The deck is inexpensive feeling compared to a Revox, most Teacs, etc. but seems more than up to the task as a rel to reel and I like the sound from mine which seems smoother and a bit more tubelike though I need to get the unit rebiased to know what it really will sound like. If working, I'd not spend more than say 1/3rd the price of a Revox A77 on it. The Revox construction wise is better and is I think going to be mor servicable over the long run. I'm not knocking the Philips in any way but want to put it into perspective.

I will see if I have a photo in my archives.

[Lookingglass100]

This is stretching the old memory back more than thirty years but I seem to remember that DIN outputs and inputs were designed at lower voltage levels and different impedence matches than the American RCA terminals.

When I set the Sansui 5000A up in the microwave site in "Nam" we used the DIN output on the receiver with an adapter DIN to RCA cable to hook up one of the cheaper TEAC decks along with the two AKAIs and one 4010S. We never came to a definitive conclusion about whether the freq falloff was because of the record/playback characteristics of the small TEAC or impedence mismatch between the DIN and the RCAs.

I don't remember the small TEACS model number but I saw a similar deck up on EBAY a few days ago. I do remember that we recorded LPs onto as many as four tape decks at a time through that 5000A. The guys on the site had a collection that included: Akai X-355D, my X-360D, Akai X1800SD ( ? it included an 8-track record/play transport ), TEAC 4010S, the small TEAC, and a Tandberg. The Tandberg also had crossfield heads, but had a purely mechanical, clutch type, transport. For such a highly acclaimed unit, I was unimpressed.
For what it is worth, The Akai X-355D and X-360D had a much better record/playback response at 3 3/4 IPS and 7 1/2 IPS than did the TEACS. But the TEACS seemed to be much gentler tape transports. I later added a 4010S to my system to use as a playback deck in conjunction with the X-360D as the recording deck.
I seem to remember the Sansui 5000 series as the first receivers to have A and B tape monitoring capability. That Sansui 5000A is still playing in my apartment..... :thmbsp:

[axel]

Brian,

I can't locate the 4506 at the moment but here's an image from a 1977/78 Philips catalog that shows the 4504... Both were the mid-to-small ones in Philips' offerings ; the big ones were the N4422 for instance (1978, big beast) or 4520 (1979, even better).

The 4504 had a 2Tr/4Tr switchable version (N4512). I'll post one of the big ones someday on my website. The feeling is "plasticky" indeed - all Euro brands were then trying real hard at lowering the costs to try and resist the japanese "invasion"...

cheers
axel

[mhardy6647]

... I do believe that this is a photo of the 4506 tape deck/preamp discussed above. I copy photos of interesting equipment for my 'archices'. In this case, unfortunately, I am afraid I cannot give credit to the original auction/photograph :-(

I remember these from when they were new; I always thought they were pretty cool. My 20-plus year old impression was that they sounded pretty good, too.

[mhardy6647]

I'll post one of the big ones someday on my website
... where is this website of yours to which you refer? :-)

...the big ones were the N4422 for instance (1978, big beast) or 4520 (1979, even better).

Only the 4504/4506 were sold in the US AFAIK. I am unfamiliar with the bigger Philips R to R's you mention. Love to see pictures.

[axel]

mrh,

my website is here: www.thevintageknob.org.

The big Philips RtR are pretty rare, even in Europe. Akai and Tascam were the ones - I believe they still are :-)

cheers
axel

[mhardy6647]

ahh... you're the Vintage Knob !
That is such a cool website; introduced to us here at AK by none other than Wigwam Jones (IIRC)

my apologies...

[axel]

mhardy,

Thanks for your kind words! Always very much welcome!
Just to tease you, I'll bring a rare & unexpected beast online on january 1st :scratch2:

Being a newbie at AK, can you tell me who is IIRC?

cheers
axel

[Brian]

Anyone looking for a decent preamp should consider the 4506 and get a free tape deck thrown in. Philips seems to have really had some interesting ideas when it came to audio equipment. Motional feedback speakers which I think were developed by I think Frazier, those neat touch switches on the Lab Series components and turntables, the light map on the preamp, the preamp/tapedeck, the cassette and CD. We seem to remember them more as the owners of Marantz during the company's slide.

[luvvinvinyl]

mhardy,

...Being a newbie at AK, can you tell me who is IIRC?

cheers
axel

Those of us who are too lazy (like me) to type "If I Recall Correctly", substitute the internet acronym, "IIRC". In the interests of speed, chat room devotees have developed a growing argot of 'internetese', allowing the sending of whole sentences, even short paragraphs, by the adept, without typing a single word, only acronyms. The perception, by the users of such, is that only the cognoscenti are priveleged with understanding. AK, on the other hand, (OTOH), at least in my humble opinion (IMHO), is an inclusive society, and exists to share info, of all types. For what it's worth (FWIW), I had to go find a list of these acronyms, when i first got here.

Welcome to AK, and never be afraid to ask for an explanation of that which you do not know. Everyone will assist you, just as you have assisted us, even without your knowing it.

[axel]

Philips still is fairly lively, although its more recent stints failed to win (DCC, CD-I or the quick dip into D-VHS). Telefunken and Grundig were also MAJOR brands until 1980. The last Philips High End stuff was done under the Marantz brand in the early 90s (and the LHH series in Japan).
Pity those huge R&D depts now seem to only sribble new algorithms for the next MPEG log :-(

I believe Luxman registered a patent in the 60s for the equivalent of the MFB system - do I remember well?

[axel]

Thanks for the explanations!
I did scratch my head for quite a while trying to figure that one out!

thanks
axel

[radioactive]

brian ,
well it seems that your getting closer to having a complete philips system .i guess a pr of mfb speakers and perhaps the ga312 turntable and youd be all set.ill have to agree that the revox and grundigs would probally perform better and were better constructed and dont think id buy either the 4504 or 4506 for the performance aspect of them but rather the nostalgia part since i already have a teac 2300sx and ampex atr 800.

axel,
welcome to ak .im sure you'll like it here.i checked out your website and saw lots of interesting gear . :thmbsp:
chris

[gil b]

Brian:
I also have a Philips 4506, and have the manual etc. If you need a copy let me know and I will e-mail it to you.
Regards
Gil

[Brian]

A set of MFB speakers would go with the deck. I have thought about getting a GA212 and 213 and subbing the lights of the 212 (green) with the lights from the 213 (red) so it would match the tuner/amp/preamp. I do need to pick up a cassette since I have a Philips CD and a set of Philips headphones. Of course, probably should pick up a 185 tuner to match to the 4506/MFB/modified GA212 system. But then really need a modded 212 also for the separates system and need another CD for the 4506/etc. and another cassette for the system that did not get the 1st cassette and another set of headphones to make the 2nd system complete but then I still need a reel to reel for the separates system so I need a 4504 and really need a pair of Philips cartridges for the modded 212s but since I have 2 spare 312s, oh waith they can go with the receivers but then need another 212 or 213 for the remaining receiver. ---- why are these guys waking in with a funny looking white jacket for me?

[Brian]

Gil,
Now that I've ducked those guys with the custome jacket, I'd love to get a copy of the 4506 manual. Could you please email it to: brian.levy@gmail.com. Thanks in advance.

[radioactive]

I do need to pick up a cassette since I have a Philips CD and a set of Philips headphones. Of course, probably should pick up a 185 tuner to match to the 4506/MFB/modified GA212 system. But then really need a modded 212 also for the separates system and need another CD for the 4506/etc. and another cassette for the system that did not get the 1st cassette and another set of headphones to make the 2nd system complete but then I still need a reel to reel for the separates system so I need a 4504 and really need a pair of Philips cartridges for the modded 212s but since I have 2 spare 312s, oh waith they can go with the receivers but then need another 212 or 213 for the remaining receiver. ---- why are these guys waking in with a funny looking white jacket for me?
:lmao: :lmao: :lmao:
dont worry brian im in the same boat here and i beg you not to give them my name and adress.
chris
gil,
if its not to much trouble could you send me a copy also to
cfuller1@gmail.com i collect the philips gear also along with any literature and would very much like a copy of the manual too.thanks.

[mhardy6647]

Thought you all might enjoy the inner pages of a Philips brochure "Introducing Higher Fidelity" I've had from way back when. The original is in color, but I was doing some BW scans and threw this in for fun.

[mhardy6647]

Does this guy look like a Dutch engineer? :-)

[radioactive]

thanks for the scans :thmbsp is there any chance i could get you to send it to my email adress as a bigger file size so i can print it out and add to my collection.?
cfuller1@gmail.com
chris

[Brian]

Posssibly a 2nd order to go to my files, please: brian.levy@gmail.com

[mhardy6647]

will do... nice color ones when I get a few minutes (maybe yet today).

:-)

[radioactive]

thanks...whenever you get around to it will be fine.
chris

[mhardy6647]

I also have two-sided product sheets on several of the old Philips TT's (GA-406, GA-222, GA-312, and one other one IIRC) as well as a small B/W full-line brochure, if anyone's interested.

I think I posted a page of the 406 scan here somewhere when roypercy was looking for info on this table.

[Brian]

Any scans of Philips Lab Series or other US sold components from that period are appreciated. Sadly, per Philips no information remains available related to design or production notes or figures and there appear to be no "old timers" there who remember much about the line or its history.

[mhardy6647]

One other thing I have (if anyone might ever need a copy of this) is the complete service manual for the slightly later AF-877 turntable. Mine had some speed-control issues at one point, and the dealer had to get a manual to fix it... they gave me the manual when they returned the repaired table. I still have both the TT (purchased new) and the manual :-)

[radioactive]

mark,
thanks for the color scans i appreciate it.i'll also take any other scans of the philips gear brocures/service manauls that you might have.it's hard to come by these and any information is good.
chris

[alayn91]

Hello,
If you are interested in, I can provide copy of service manuals for the R2R vintage tape machines, from Philips.
Unfortunately, they are written in german.
It could be a problem for the mechanical setting.
But, it's OK for the electronic schematics.
Volts are volts in any languages. At least, I guess !
In my case, I am looking for the N4512 english service manual, or even better, in french.
As I have to verify the tension tape part.

Best regards.
Alain.