Zilch's AK Design Collaborative - Econowave Speaker
- Thread starter Zilch
- Start date
skywave-rider
Slumming in Akihabara
Go for the 8" square PT.
But don't use a 210 with it. 220 gives much flatter response on this waveguide.
(Confirmed last night.)
Pics of my newly ported EconoWave speakers
With grillls
Thanks to everyone who has help me with this porject so far. :thmbsp:
With grillls
Thanks to everyone who has help me with this porject so far. :thmbsp:
Nope...no tube as per the Zilchsters instruction. Just holes where the 3" dome tweeter used to live.
I am going to experiment with the 3.5" tube he spoke of but this is a noticable improvement and is tuned to 40hz.
Baffles may be in the future. I am considering just building something to hold the horns, x-over and L-pad so I can easily use them with other boxes in the future.
Your are welcome, of course. It's fun for all of us working on E'Waves, and "Collaborative" remains fully operative.
Them are pretty snazzy sculptured grilles you've got on there, too! :yes:
Search this thread for "Piano," posted by Zilch....
jackgiff
Well-Known Member
I just got a new Kodak camera to replace the old Nikon I have been using for years. The Nikon needed a tripod to avoid blurry pictures, but the Kodak looks like it's image stabilization will work pretty fine for me.
Here is a picture of one of the two rear cabinets for my HT project that are coming along. This will show the bracing inside. All the corner braces are cut from mesquite, as is the cabinet sides and back. And no tripod was necessary. Coool!
Here is a picture of one of the two rear cabinets for my HT project that are coming along. This will show the bracing inside. All the corner braces are cut from mesquite, as is the cabinet sides and back. And no tripod was necessary. Coool!
Attachments
Spectrum77
Super Member
Just a thought- Dynaco A25 and E/W. Some info gleaned from Madisound-
The F3 is about 60Hz and the F6 is about 50Hz. It has a very nice roll off on the top end and could be used without a crossover!
Fs 26Hz
Sensitivity 89dB
Power 70W
Re 5.8 ohm
Nominal Impedance 8 ohm
Vas 175 liters
Qms 3.8
Qes 0.39
Qts 0.35
VC diameter 39mm
X-max peak 4mm
Sd 350 cm2
Ms 33g
Cms 1.6 Ns/m
It will be interesting to hear how the Keg designed X/O intended for HPM-100 woofer (schematic below), with seperate HF and LF will play. An easy test to connect LF to woofer, anyway. Thoughts?
The F3 is about 60Hz and the F6 is about 50Hz. It has a very nice roll off on the top end and could be used without a crossover!
Fs 26Hz
Sensitivity 89dB
Power 70W
Re 5.8 ohm
Nominal Impedance 8 ohm
Vas 175 liters
Qms 3.8
Qes 0.39
Qts 0.35
VC diameter 39mm
X-max peak 4mm
Sd 350 cm2
Ms 33g
Cms 1.6 Ns/m
It will be interesting to hear how the Keg designed X/O intended for HPM-100 woofer (schematic below), with seperate HF and LF will play. An easy test to connect LF to woofer, anyway. Thoughts?
Attachments
skywave-rider
Slumming in Akihabara
That's JBL, from the same line of PT waveguides used here.
http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showpost.php?p=2117278&postcount=17
A couple:
1) You've provided T/S parameters for some particular woofer at Madisound, but not told us what it is. How about a model number or a link over there, please.
2) We've got a woofer with an Fs of 26 Hz installed in an alignment yielding F6 = 50 Hz? I've heard and measured Dynaco A25s, and I recall them having better bass extension than that.
O.K., several, then:
3) Nice high end rolloff at what frequency?
4) All of the E'Wave crossovers have separate LF and HF, and the PC boards allow operating the two sections independently for biamping, if desired....
just a heads up...these modelling programs while very useful in the bass region are not valid for predicting frequency response much above 200hz. most drivers will model as having a significant rolloff through the mid range when in reality they will be flat to rising. :thmbsp:
Spectrum77
Super Member
A25 replacement woofer- here are the details-
SEAS Prestige 25F-EW (H0085) 10" Paper Cone (Dynaco A25 Replacement)
http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=817
'... very nice roll off on the top end...'- part of quote from Madisound.
Yes, superfluous information- 'seperate' implying that the experiment will be dead easy, as I already have the X/O in two sections (as if for biamping)
Have 8.2 uF, 12uF and 15uF to try in the zobel.
EDIT- Looks as though I was a bit hasty in posting the Madisound info.
From classic speaker pages: http://www.classicspeakerpages.net/IP.Board/index.php?showtopic=3901Pete B suggests that the Madisound replacement is a differently constructed, more efficient version from the early A25, which may explain the difference in bass response you measured.
Measured T&S parameters (from above link, post #3- pete b)
SEAS 25 TV-EW UNIT SAMPLE: PLB#1 1/12/06
UNIT DATE: 25 week of 1971
Rubber surround part number: SR 231/1
Effective cone diameter = 21 cm measured
Effective cone area = 285 cm^2 old SEAS spec, 350 cm^2 new
(25F-EW)
seems the old spec of 285 cm^2 was an error and might explain
the difference in moving mass below:
Measured SEAS
Delta M 15.75 Spec
Fshift -16%
Fs 23.6 20-25
Vas 205
Re 5.7
Qe .48
Qm 4.2
Mms 37.5 30
no .36
SPLref 87.6 88
Bl 6.6 .8
Qts .43
Cms .
I thought it would be interesting to hear what effect the implementation of E/W has on the imaging that the A25 is known for. Unfortunately, no facilities to MEASURE yet, just arbitrary opinions
SEAS Prestige 25F-EW (H0085) 10" Paper Cone (Dynaco A25 Replacement)
http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=817
'... very nice roll off on the top end...'- part of quote from Madisound.
Yes, superfluous information- 'seperate' implying that the experiment will be dead easy, as I already have the X/O in two sections (as if for biamping)
Have 8.2 uF, 12uF and 15uF to try in the zobel.
EDIT- Looks as though I was a bit hasty in posting the Madisound info.
From classic speaker pages: http://www.classicspeakerpages.net/IP.Board/index.php?showtopic=3901Pete B suggests that the Madisound replacement is a differently constructed, more efficient version from the early A25, which may explain the difference in bass response you measured.
Measured T&S parameters (from above link, post #3- pete b)
SEAS 25 TV-EW UNIT SAMPLE: PLB#1 1/12/06
UNIT DATE: 25 week of 1971
Rubber surround part number: SR 231/1
Effective cone diameter = 21 cm measured
Effective cone area = 285 cm^2 old SEAS spec, 350 cm^2 new
(25F-EW)
seems the old spec of 285 cm^2 was an error and might explain
the difference in moving mass below:
Measured SEAS
Delta M 15.75 Spec
Fshift -16%
Fs 23.6 20-25
Vas 205
Re 5.7
Qe .48
Qm 4.2
Mms 37.5 30
no .36
SPLref 87.6 88
Bl 6.6 .8
Qts .43
Cms .
I thought it would be interesting to hear what effect the implementation of E/W has on the imaging that the A25 is known for. Unfortunately, no facilities to MEASURE yet, just arbitrary opinions
jackgiff
Well-Known Member
Image stabilization is a good cigar.
Nice-looking cabs, too. Will the baffles or back panels be removable?
Some wise old man once said, "A woman is just a woman, but a good cigar's a smoke!"
The front baffle is glued into routed channels in each side, plus supported by braces on each side. The back will be fit into the routed sides, each side braced just like the front baffle, and then all internal seams will be epoxy filled. These babies won't have air leaks.
The stands are still to be cut and assembled. And then my woodworking with mesquite will end. That stuff is hard.
Richard C.
Active Member
I've wondered about that...
This would explain how they can reach 2 kHz!
The Altec Model 14 and 9842 woofers are driven full range, so I guess I need to do some precise measuring.
Richard C.
This would explain how they can reach 2 kHz!
The Altec Model 14 and 9842 woofers are driven full range, so I guess I need to do some precise measuring.
Richard C.
dnewma04
The Healer
They don't do much good lower than 200hz either, other than giving a general idea of how the woofer will behave. The graphs are useful for visually seeing patterns or showing mechanical power handling, insufficient port size, etc.
BB6P does some nice stuff with giving you basic box geometry for cutting, as well.
OK....I gotta say Holy Crap! 
I've been listening to these things for a while now and it just get's better and better.
I just hooked them up to my little 6AQ5 VOM integrated I recapped last fall. I threw in Coltrane's "Giant Steps" and I'm completely blown away.
Already considering another pair. The Valencia's and Chorus II's may be heading out the door.
Thanks for helping this junkie with his latest "fix" of audio addiction:thmbsp:
I've been listening to these things for a while now and it just get's better and better.
I just hooked them up to my little 6AQ5 VOM integrated I recapped last fall. I threw in Coltrane's "Giant Steps" and I'm completely blown away.
Already considering another pair. The Valencia's and Chorus II's may be heading out the door.
Thanks for helping this junkie with his latest "fix" of audio addiction:thmbsp:
Paratima
E'Wavin'
I tried working with mesquite once. That was enough! Reminds me of hickory. I.E. totally unworkable, at least by me.If EconoWave gives medals for woodworking courage, you should get one!
http://www.madisound.com/catalog/PDF/25F-EW.pdf
They're in the database, and after correcting Mms in expert mode, BB6P confirms the stated performance in a small closed box, but suggests they'll play HUGELY better bass in 3.12 cuft vented tuned to 28.12 Hz, with F3 = 38.11 Hz and F6 = 29.62 Hz, one 3" duct, 5" long.
That says build towers and listen. They should be good to E'Wave's nominal 1.6 kHz crossover frequency, at least. Good find, Spectrum.... :yes:
Heh, heh.OK....I gotta say Holy Crap!
Already considering another pair. The Valencia's and Chorus II's may be heading out the door.
Almost stupid good, huh? :thmbsp:
