CD's...will they stick around?

[Bob]

volume, profits, and death are three independent random variables. Until production
stops (like the EI tube factory that was dismantled and sold for scrap), and the
equipment is not sent elsewhere for re-assembly and continued production
(like German Zeiss optics/camera dismantled by the Soviet army and moved east)
then its not dead.

it's eventual demise may not be from lack of sales but from a competing media that
is cheaper and better. so production volume is no indication of an eventual death.

and with amazon giving you a download of the "custom" CD they cut just for you,
and the BILLIONs of computers and laptops with DVD/CD players able to cut
"custom" CDs, I think it's death is like Mark Twains' definition of "premature".

Read the recent article by Naxos' President on CDs.

however, if there's an unstated premise that leads the charge then TALLY HO
and I'll be (at a very safe distance) behind it.

 

[N8Nagel]

it's eventual demise may not be from lack of sales but from a competing media that
is cheaper and better. so production volume is no indication of an eventual death.

This is my point The only competing media still on the market is the even older LP, and hi-res digital downloads which most people don't know about. RTR is dead along with all other tape based formats. MD and DAT never caught on. There really is nothing else.

there really is no viable competitor to the CD.

Someday it'll be dead and we'll be listening to FLAC rips at Redbook resolution or better but there doesn't seem to be any widespread marketing of same at this point in time.

 

[eljr]

But what is its replacement?

Steaming. Music ownership is as we knew it is over.

There IS NO VIABLE REPLACEMENT on the market today save for hi-res digital downloads, which are a niche market and unknown to most people.

MP3's, Flac, .Wav... downloads are not replacement for the CD?

 

[N8Nagel]

Steaming. Music ownership is as we knew it is over.

Other than Pono and Tidal, where can I stream music at the quality to which I've become accustomed? The former is on life support if not dead now, the latter... well we'll see.

MP3's, Flac, .Wav... downloads are not replacement for the CD?

MP3 is most definitely not a replacement for CD. Where is there mass marketing of FLAC or WAV downloads?

Pretty sure I've only purchased one download and that was the latest Radiohead album. And I'm here, which means that I have more interest in music and high quality reproduction than the vast majority of the public.

We really did have it good with CDs. I'm afraid we're going into dark days like the 8-track and cassette era where the general public's standards of music reproduction slip backwards until the Next Great Thing (CD) appeared on the scene.

I guess I'll just be that weird troll guy who keeps all this "obsolete" gear around because I can't afford the new boutique stuff like Line Magnetic amps or DeVore speakers. At least I know you all are with me on this one.

The only silver lining in this is the massive amount of CDs in the dollar bins at the thrift store, although sadly, within the past few months the three thrift stores that I frequent the most have severely reduced the size of their CD displays. So maybe even that great era is ending, although thrift store hoovering by necessity means that I'm at the mercy of what someone else saw fit to purchase.

I do agree that streaming is the future, and I love Spotify. But I can tell the difference in SQ and advances can't come soon enough where I have access to Spotify's library and algorithms for "your daily mix" etc. but at actual Redbook quality or better. I can dream can't I...

 

[Bob]

actually not for a different reason. you have streaming for listening, sometimes random
and sometimes directed. and for most, the ease of mobile audio and maybe close to
what you want to hear. like wanting a hamburger and getting a argula salad 'cause it's KEWL.

LPs and CDs, ownership thereof, means you get the EXACT music you want to listen to.
convert it to MPcrap, lossless trash, better FLAC and DSD512 if you can.

I listen to a lot of music from around the world that is difficult to find and almost never played
OTA radio, TV (upper channels on cable), and Internet.

examples,
mezzo-soprano versions of American female pop (example lower register versions of Whitney)
Japanese jazz (I no longer listen to Kinda Blue more than once every 5 years or so)
Chinese female singers who can sing in 6 different languages (Teresa Teng for example)
southern blues from before WW2
and Rachmaninoff playing Rachmaninoff

and just about every LP that didn't make it to CD, and every CD that doesn't make it to streaming
or MPcrap.

two predictions
Cd plants will not go offline or be shutdown in my lifetime (I have another 30 years predicted)
I will continue to buy CDs, SACDs, and LPs, both new and old, and sometimes abused.

and to the predicted death of CDs - I refer you to 1983 with the advent of the CD
and the 1999 advent of the SACD, and knowing that LPs are still being pressed
and new plants opening up as we speak (google/bing is your friend) and they've
been around for over 90 years.

so let's wait til the CD is 45 YO before declaring death and revisit this in 2028
again in 2073 when it's 90 YO.

 

[Modlin]

I have all media..ie sacd, cd, lps, flac, wav, hd tracks...and use them all, but...
Holding LP, CD case pamphlet and reading descriptions, reviewing included pictures, tech data etc is part of the whole experience, and because of this I prefer that format
Now, depends what I do - listen or read or work on something and the music is just a background...yes I put on flac files
It all depends on own preferences...if you submit to pushed on us new ways of experiencing things, then by all means, dont read real books - use ebooks, or better just pop in an audio book, which is going to be read for you
dont go to live concerts, dont go to museums - you can find famous paintings on line, dont travel - you can walk streets of any place you want via known portal's street view....and dont talk to people - text them...

 

[eljr]

MP3 is most definitely not a replacement for CD

Not to you and me but it is to 99+% of America.

Where is there mass marketing of FLAC or WAV downloads?

Every site I frequent except for Amazon so as a result I don't source downloads there.

I've only purchased one download and that was the latest Radiohead album.

I probably purchased less than 200 myself.

I'm here, which means that I have more interest in music and high quality reproduction than the vast majority of the public.

Exactly!

 

[zebra03]

Silly Hyperbole . It is still the number 1 physical media . Good grief . If it is dead , why are they still making CD players ? Honestly this argument is dumb . I think I'm done here .

 

[zebra03]

 

[Alobar]

Streaming cannot seem to make a profit except as an add on to bolster some other platform such as Apple AM or perhaps Amazon, both of which only offers mp3 resolution. If what @eljr says is true (and I suspect it's close) that for 99% of America mp3 is a replacement for CD's, why would they ever want to pay double or triple for hi rez?

The CD however is VERY cheap to make, and sold for a profit. Players for them are everywhere and will always be manufactured so long as there is demand, at least as optical drives for computers. Once the hi rez streaming fuss is over and the investors see it as it is, a sinking ship then it will likely either be truly dead, or perhaps marketed as a high end source that you pay upwards of $50 a month for. It must eventually be profitable, and in that niche it still has to compete with hundreds of billions of CD's out there.

If 99% of music listeners are fine with mp3, I suspect of the last 1% who are not, 90% of those are happy with CD quality. And that percentage nis where the market for CD's will likely be. Not dead at all, just not dominant. Leave dominance for mediocrity!

 

[restorer-john]

CD lifted the bar so far above what preceded it, that 35 years later, people still can't agree on whether we need anything better.

If people like downloads or streaming, whatever. To me, streaming is a hollow, non-commital pastime, and shows no respect to the artists and the music. It commoditises creativity to the point it has zero value.

In 50 years the Sony CDP-101 will still be on display in museums around the world and probably still be functional. It started a revolution.

 

[onwardjames]

I have gone on a tear buying up TOTL cd players from the late 80's and early 90's.

I've been told more than once that this is silly (By Ak'ers, no less) but I absolutely MUST have a physical format. I mean, what's the point if a hard drive failure wipes out your investment?

I find using the various cd players a true pleasure. I probably have 15 or so now, most of them very good in their day.

 

[restorer-john]

...I have gone on a tear buying up TOTL cd players from the late 80's and early 90's...

I did the same 20 years ago when they were really cheap because people mistakenly believe new meant better.

...I find using the various cd players a true pleasure. I probably have 15 or so now, most of them very good in their day...

There's nothing like the big flagship machines. Enjoy.

 

[eljr]

I had given you the benefit of the doubt when you started but clearly your intent cannot be stifled.

 

[eljr]

Silly Hyperbole . It is still the number 1 physical media . Good grief . If it is dead , why are they still making CD players ? Honestly this argument is dumb . I think I'm done here .

From a year ago (car CD players): https://www.forbes.com/sites/hughmc...-cd-player-in-new-american-cars/#61b286e42e88

From 09, reading the writing on the wall (home CD players) . http://www.completemusicupdate.com/article/linn-discontinue-cd-players/

Do I need post a link about portable CD players? (Discman)

------------------------------

I was pretty surprised at you first response to me in this thread. So much so I assumed you misread my post .Again you replied snidely.

I am not sure why you take the CD's demise so personal but don't screw with me.

Thanks!

 

[eljr]

I mean, what's the point if a hard drive failure wipes out your investment?
.

Just back up your hard drive.

Personally, I keep everything backed up but also retain a hard copy on CD.

I am not willing to give up my CD collection although I know it was a time and place and time is passing it/me by.

Heck, folks collect all kinds of things and the collections makes them happy. Why not CD's?

If I never listen to another CD I will still hold on to my collection and continue to expand it.

 

[Modlin]

hey...lets move on to something else....
how about: your opinions based on personal experience about record labels...which ones were consistently producing the best sounding cds, which ones to avoid ??...what do you think ?

 

[eljr]

To me, streaming is a hollow, non-commital pastime, and shows no respect to the artists and the music.

Can you expand on this, please? I am not sure what you mean.
Thanks

 

[eljr]

Another thought, is the album dying too?

Well, it is not my thought, I came across this info as I was looking for facts on the CD's demise, it is what seems to be occurring in the music world.

Personally I love the album. It's all I have owned, musically, for nearly 50 years. But it seems that the availability of streaming services has had an effect.

People no longer want to hear "filler." People are listening to "hits" and not much more. Sort of like how it was pre album rock which is what really set the "album" formate as the dominate music distribution vehicle.

I do recall as a kid having tons of "singles" but as albums were always around I never realized that singles actually dominated.

Well, it goes to show, time is change and things go in cycles.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/bobbyo...lbum-is-dying-and-good-riddance/#4c634dd4dbd2

 

[Bob]

actually not. albums are exactly what drives millennials to acquire the LPs for their
cover art, their liner notes, and the manual handling experience (just like the
wine ritual with first pours and cork sniffing, and the cigar with cognac - not brandy -
heated over a flame) and the music.

I've sold/given away many turntables and LPs and all were millennials. they loved
having the LPs their fathers had that got dumped over the years. and Rock from
the golden age. and watching the TT work its magic. and the KOOL factor.

In the bay area, the several remaining record/LP stores are chock full of millennials
looking for LPs, not downloads, not music players, or even CDs (all better served by
online). it's the thousands of LPs they can spend hours looking through.

In China, the new millionaires/billionaires are buying what? - how about LPs. CDs can
be RIP'd so that's not it. container fulls. My friend in HK says anytime I want to offload
my LP collection, he'll take it and he already has a warehouse space for it.
(there was a recent set of articles on super large LP collections in China)

I met a guy in SF, who stock trades for a living and has thousands of LPs, and has decided
to move to china. He solves the language problem with his wife and says he can make a
great living selling LPs in china. to the newly minted rich - cash loosely held in either hand.

and look at the CL for the major/wealthy cities, there are literally thousands of LPs offered
all the time, maybe 10 cents each. with selling old beer-soaked LPs at $5-8 each, you
can do the math and decide if the LP is dead. I see ads in every CL (use the nationwide tools)
offering to buy collections.

getting Audio advice from Forbes?
maybe I'll get inverse ETF options trading advice from an audio magazine, or the
Daily News.