2ch Integration: Can AVR pre-outs and speaker outs be mixed and matched?

elcoholic

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I attempted using external amps for the mains via a 2ch preamp (no tone controls) with HT bypass and using the AVR's internal amps for the center and rears. My Yamaha RX-V475 doesn't have 5 ch preouts and the one audio out doesn't have any signal with HDMI sources. Do to limited cabinet space I'd like to stick with an AVR rather than get a processor and a 3 ch amp for the center and rears. So would an AVR with preouts likely do what I want or would it be all or nothing? Would the auto room correction/setup likely still work as well? Caveats?
 
It doesn't look like the RX-V475 has preamp outputs. While the 475 does have AV Outs and Audio Outs, I'm not sure if they're fixed or variable outputs? If fixed, there's no easy way to add an external amp. Accessories4Less has very good prices on receivers with preouts. Any of these would work, though I'm partial to Yamaha as well.

Oh, and I use my Yamaha RX-A3030 with an external amp, depending on the front speakers, without issue. The Yamaha powers the rest of the set up.
 
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I took a peek at the 475 manual - it would seem that "HDMI Control" need to be set to off for the audio outputs to be active.

Not sure if that means you can't have an HDMI device connected to the 475 with a picture active or not, while using the audio outputs to the 2chl preamp.

I'm guessing no, so that would be no-go for the OPs intent.
 
I took a peek at the 475 manual - it would seem that "HDMI Control" need to be set to off for the audio outputs to be active.

Not sure if that means you can't have an HDMI device connected to the 475 with a picture active or not, while using the audio outputs to the 2chl preamp.

I'm guessing no, so that would be no-go for the OPs intent.
Sorry if I wasn't clear, I'm positive the RX-V475 won't do what I'm after. I keep the HDMI control off in any event. ARC is more trouble than it's worth unless every device has it, it's constantly pirating control. The audio out on the 475 only passes the signal from the analog inputs which is weird since there's a summed feed from the digital HDMI inputs for the analog head phone jack.
 
It doesn't look like the RX-V475 has preamp outputs. While the 475 does have AV Outs and Audio Outs, I'm not sure if they're fixed or variable outputs? If fixed, there's no easy way to add an external amp. Accessories4Less has very good prices on receivers with preouts. Any of these would work, though I'm partial to Yamaha as well.

Oh, and I use my Yamaha RX-A3030 with an external amp, depending on the front speakers, without issue. The Yamaha powers the rest of the set up.
Good to know, thanks.
 
Yes, you can use an external amp to power the mains via pre-outs and run the other channels via the internal amps of the AVR. You will need to step up to the RX-V7xx series (or similar) to get the pre-outs on all channels (and maybe other goodies like powered zone 2). The room correction stuff will work the same assuming the external amp is being used during set-up. I use the 12v trigger on my RX-A2010 to trip a 120V relay to power up the amps that I use for the mains so 1 button does it all which keeps it simple for the wife.
 
I had a Yamaha RX-V2095 - Worked just great using front preamp outs to feed external amps,
and using internal amp channels for center, sides, and rear channels -
but the manual was massive reading to figure how to get it all sorted out!

Like others have said - it really depends on the level of the AVR - some won't.
 
Sorry if I wasn't clear, I'm positive the RX-V475 won't do what I'm after. I keep the HDMI control off in any event. ARC is more trouble than it's worth unless every device has it, it's constantly pirating control. The audio out on the 475 only passes the signal from the analog inputs which is weird since there's a summed feed from the digital HDMI inputs for the analog head phone jack.

Sounds like the unit treats the audio outs sorta like Zone 2. Many units will not pass signals from digital inputs to Zone 2.

Oh, just FYI, the reference to ARC should have been Consumer Electronics Control (CEC). CEC is the control of other device linked by HDMI. ARC is Audio Return Channel.

But, to the question, yes it was and maybe still is fairly common to use pre outs and separate amp for the fronts (and sometimes center) while using the internal amps for the rest. Works fine.
 
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Sounds like the unit treats the audio outs sorta like Zone 2. Many units will not pass signals from digital inputs to Zone 2.

Oh, just FYI, the reference to ARC should have been Consumer Electronics Control (CEC). CEC is the control of other device linked by HDMI. ARC is Audio Return Channel.

But, to the question, yes it was and maybe still is fairly common to use pre outs and separate amp for the fronts (and sometimes center) while using the internal amps for the rest. Works fine.

Yes I got CEC and ARC confused. Probably because my Samsung (not so) Smart TV and the Yamaha AVR got them confused and fought for control as well. At one point I tried to use the TV as the streaming source using ARC to get the sound to the remote AVR via HDMI. When using the BDP or DVR the TV would override the AVR sound source setting back to the TV so there would be no sound. I would then have to manually switch it back after the TV hi-jacked the audio. This completely nullified the 1 button/1 remote control I had so painstakingly programmed into the Harmony One to make the system family friendly. No manner of settings could remedy this debacle. My solution was to use the TV as a monitor, get a Roku and leave all control to the AVR thereby restoring peace and "harmony" to all the land. The silver lining is that the Roku GUI is light years ahead of Samsung's GUI. The bad news is that it takes two remotes since the Roku remote is not IR. Thankfully the fam is OK living with that.
 
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Yes, you can use an external amp to power the mains via pre-outs and run the other channels via the internal amps of the AVR. You will need to step up to the RX-V7xx series (or similar) to get the pre-outs on all channels (and maybe other goodies like powered zone 2). The room correction stuff will work the same assuming the external amp is being used during set-up. I use the 12v trigger on my RX-A2010 to trip a 120V relay to power up the amps that I use for the mains so 1 button does it all which keeps it simple for the wife.

If I use my Emo mono blocks for the mains they have the 12V triggering. I'll just have to use some of the wiring in the walls and ceiling between the cabinet and the front of the room for the trigger circuit. The 2ch preamp w/ HT bypass will go in the cabinet so it can use the remaining port on the Niles IR repeater and be controlled by the Harmony One. That will keep it simple for the family. I'm planning to use the remaining 2 spare runs of high quality component video concealed cabling for the 2ch pre-out feed to the amps. The cable length is 35 ft and I'm using the 3rd leg for the sub already and have no SQ issues. Should I expect the same with the front main pre-out channels?

I had a Yamaha RX-V2095 - Worked just great using front preamp outs to feed external amps,
and using internal amp channels for center, sides, and rear channels -
but the manual was massive reading to figure how to get it all sorted out!

Like others have said - it really depends on the level of the AVR - some won't.

I know what you mean about the manual, IIRC mine's 125 pages. I'm not married to Yamaha, but that learning curve has been climbed already. For what its worth the big old beastly Denon (pre DVI/HDMI) the Yamaha replaced sounded better. That won't be an issue driving just the effects speakers, but if things change down the road I want to be somewhat future proof SQ-wise should I need it to drive the mains. What other mainstream brands of AVR's should I consider? Is Denon still good?
 
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