"Bliss" Stylii??

lini said:
Ray: If you'd like a bit of an upgrade for your AT92E(CD) for not that much money, Ebay vendor "wolfsbigbadgarage" still appears to offer the AT450 for ca. 60 bucks, which basically is a renamed AT316EP (while the AT92E(CD) is practically the same as an AT311EP), featuring a nice, rectangular-shanked nudie with medium-sharp elliptical tip.

For which turntable model exactly would you intend the upgrade?

Greetings from Munich!

Manfred / lini
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I have the AT450, acquired from aforementioned seller, paid a little less than $60 but even at $60 it is great deal because it is very nice sounding cartridge.
 
I found the email stream I had with Kyle at TTN. It's back in December 2017 ... so probably worth updating at this point. At that time the Shure m91, m95 and VN35 were 'Bliss' versions with tie-wires. Kyle confirmed they were made in Japan ... not by JICO. All the Hyperellipticals and Shibata styli did not have tie-wires at that time ... again confirmed in writing from Kyle. I suspect those remained JICO-sourced. But they are 'EVG-class' product. I have a 'JICO' hyperelliptical m97 styli from TTN - no tie-wire and I highly suspect the rest is exactly the same as a JICO-sourced EVG stylus.

I don't doubt JICO continues to supply to LPGear / LPTunes since LPGear is the official supplier of JICO in North / Central America (https://lptunes.com/blogs/news/the-new-home-for-jico-in-north-central-america) So their product is 'true' JICO. I suspect products like the Vividline are JICO-made 'EVG-class' product.

I'm not too sure on Tonar other than they have a direct relationship with Nagaoka but also sell JICO-supplied product. Or at least did. That JICO product would be again 'EVG-class' product. A number of Tonar styli I've had over the years are dead-ringers for EVG styli.

I haven't researched Thakker in any great detail. I know they sell the JICO SAS product .... but even those and their other products are just listed as 'Thakker Japan' for manufacturer. I've seen a post from late 2017 that identifies (through contact with Thakker) that the others are JICO made. Guessing those all would be 'EVG-class' product.
 
Van_Isle said:
I'm not too sure on Tonar other than they have a direct relationship with Nagaoka but also sell JICO-supplied product. Or at least did. That JICO product would be again 'EVG-class' product. A number of Tonar styli I've had over the years are dead-ringers for EVG styli..
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I'll confirm that TONAR sources the large majority of their styli from JICO. And you are correct on the Nagaoka front.

I believe the EVG tie-in is that they used to as well source styli from Jico, the same as provided to Tonar likely.....but as mentioned in this thread EVG was cut off from Jico.
 
Funny this has come up.

I'm currently weighing up between these three styli for my AT3600L

LP Gear ATN3600DLXVL Vivid Line at $79.95.
Turntable Needles BLISS 211-DHE Hyperelliptical at $85.
Turntable Needles BLISS 211-DSH Shibata at $160.

I've got the LP Gear CFN6500LE stylus (a Spectra Elliptical, a shape that I can't find any real info about) on it at the moment, and very much like how it sounds.

However, I don't know much about the Bliss styli and their quality, and the TN website doesn't list radii or cantilever material, or even if they are nude or bonded... As best as I can tell, Vivid Line and Hyperelliptical are both slightly different line contact profiles, and the Shibata is well, a Shibata.

The lack of detailed specs on the Turntable Needles site makes me a bit wary of what I might actually get if I buy these. I would assume that being higher end shapes, they would be nude, but then, they are also quite cheap. At least LP Gear provides the radius and cantilever material in their specs list.

Does anyone have any experience with these?
 
Kyle told me that all HE and Elipticals are Jico made! So is he talking out both sides of his mouth or what? The safe bet here is to buy Genuine Jico from Jico or LP Gear. This will stop all the confusion and bickering back and forth he said she said. And we will also get that lovely tie wire for our Shure carts.
 
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Sounds like almost everything in aftermarket is Jico, Jico EVG, or possible Jico with another name (Tonar, Bliss).

Nagaoka name come up but what proof is there?

The best aftermarkets that I have are Jico direct from Jico, and one Pfanstiehl (Swiss) for the 681eee.

I have one VividLine and it is impressive, all I know is that it was made in Japan.

I have two EGVs that say Japan on the case and both were cheap $20 ish. One sounds ok, the other does not.

Total crapshoot so I rely on AK experience when possible.
 
ms_enj said:
However, I don't know much about the Bliss styli and their quality, and the TN website doesn't list radii or cantilever material, or even if they are nude or bonded... As best as I can tell, Vivid Line and Hyperelliptical are both slightly different line contact profiles, and the Shibata is well, a Shibata.

The lack of detailed specs on the Turntable Needles site makes me a bit wary of what I might actually get if I buy these. I would assume that being higher end shapes, they would be nude, but then, they are also quite cheap. At least LP Gear provides the radius and cantilever material in their specs list.

Does anyone have any experience with these?
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Based on what I just wrote in my post above.....they are bonded and not nude.

The vividline I’m not sure on though.
 
Excellent info in this thread. I will list everything that I know and it does not conflict with anything in this thread. I will just try to list all that I know.

Major aftermarket complete styli assembly manufacturers:

JICO: Probably all Japanese styli except for Nagaoka for Nagaoka cartridges and A/T for A/T cartridges. ***Nagaoka may be making some aftermarket needles for Kyowas, Thakker, and MrStylus. There is another Japanese manufacturer of aftermarket needles other than JICO is seems. But the model list is not as extensive.

Swiss: (probably HUCO) sold by EVG, Pfanstiehl and others such as Tonar(where there is not a corresponding JICO sourced model such as the Seeburg stereo stylus) and Thakker which often offers a choice of Japanese sourced or Swiss sourced).
***HUCO is no longer. I still do not know the name of the Swiss company that does the final assembly.

Normarh: (South American. Sell under their name and T.E.I.)

Pfanstiehl: Styli for ceramic cartridges and the GE RPX and VR II.

Edit - I am surprised that I can edit this almost two years after the original posting date. I will mark corrections with three '*'. I.E. '***"
 
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johnjhazel My tech uses the T.E.I. for the Shure M91ED stylus if the original one is toast are they any good? My tech says he likes the bass response from them. What are the specs on these as well? Thanxs
 
Cylontymany said:
johnjhazel My tech uses the T.E.I. for the Shure M91ED stylus if the original one is toast are they any good? My tech says he likes the bass response from them. What are the specs on these as well? Thanxs
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I have never tried any Normarh or T.E.I.
Kent T and Needlestein would be the gurus on these.
 
As per my suggestion in my post, I've contacted Kyle to ask for an update on the Bliss vs Jico vs ? situation, specifically for those models that were identified to me previously as non-JICO and that had the tension wire construction. We'll see what he says.
 
Van_Isle said:
As per my suggestion in my post, I've contacted Kyle to ask for an update on the Bliss vs Jico vs ? situation, specifically for those models that were identified to me previously as non-JICO and that had the tension wire construction. We'll see what he says.
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I am interested. Thank you !!
 
Basically as I said previously. The Shure elliptical (m91, m95, VN35 and m97 Era IV ... those are the ones I asked about) are non-Jico Japan made with tension wires. Only info provided by Kyle on other Bliss styli is 'Japan made'. Hyperelliptical and Shibata are Jico as well as SAS of course. I'm guessing here and basing on what I have received in the past but I would expect the HE and Shibata to be identical to the EVG products ... no tension wires et al.
 
Van_Isle said:
Basically as I said previously. The Shure elliptical (m91, m95, VN35 and m97 Era IV ... those are the ones I asked about) are non-Jico Japan made with tension wires. Only info provided by Kyle on other Bliss styli is 'Japan made'. Hyperelliptical and Shibata are Jico as well as SAS of course. I'm guessing here and basing on what I have received in the past but I would expect the HE and Shibata to be identical to the EVG products ... no tension wires et al.
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What I am so curious about is who is the non-JICO Japanese manufacturer ? Nagaoka stated they do not produce VN35E in an email to me. EVG is now all Swiss produced with only conicals and ellipticals available. Same product now as Pfanstiehl.
 
I bought an EVG Swiss n95ed and VM Audio spec said it was .35x.7 mil, .75-2 grams tracking. I assumed a different source than Phanstiehl. Very sibilant until broken in. Needs 2 grams still. I dont use it much. $10 one from Rivertone is much better and probably conical (I cant stop buying cheap needles.)
 
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