BSR 710 transcription turntable

[jmchrislip]

I had one in the 70's and really liked it. It was built like a tank. I had an Ortofon VMS20E on it. I gave it to my sister when I purchased the Philips GA-212.

To be clear:

Mine was an 810x not the 710x but I would presume the performance would be similar. They were the new generation of BSRs.

 

[danj]

Again as an *owner* of one of these I wholeheartedly disagree. The mechansim is very durable and no more difficult to work on than a Dual changer. I don't exactly find the Steuerpimpel arm lift in the Duals to be the best example of German engineering, nor easier to adjust when it doesn't work correctly (controlled by the flimsy plastic rotating cam). The 710 mechanism is all metal with less actual moving parts. I saw elsewhere on this forum where it was claimed "the camshaft alone has over 100 parts" - that is simply untrue. The reason these are describes as wonky is becuase they need *thorough* degreasing/cleaning to work properly. As for the sound, it has a heavy 7lb platter, quiet motor, and 0.1% wow and flutter (measured) with less rumble than my 1219, and balanced tonearm - it sounds great.

Their performance is on a par with a Dual or ELAC but their relative rarity means few techs have experience with them. I have a Dual 1229 which I love but I think the best changer/automatic is the ELAC 50H MKII, which is a great performer and easy to work on on the very rare occasion when it needs fixin' My 1229 has no audible rumble and, if it did, I would hear it given that my speakers are very bass capable. The single BSR 810 that I've used (had one for sale and thoroughly tested it) was a quiet machine, too, proving that an idler-driven machine can be very quiet when properly designed and maintained. The Garrard SL95B, mentioned in another member's post, is also an excellent machine.

SPECs are meaningless when comparing two similar machines unless the measuring and weighting methods are identical. The 1229 has a W/F spec of <.06% but the audible difference between that and the BSR's .1% is not audible to me. An example of spec comparison not always being valid is the AR-XA and XB, which have rumble ratings of -38dB (NAB) but which is an extremely quiet machine. The NAB standard is much more stringent than the typical WRMS or ARLL or DIN measurements.

Having a metal CAM GEAR is a major plus. Alas, Duals have a rigid plastic cam gear which can break under unusual circumstances. In all my years of fixing turntables I have only seen one broken cam gear on a Dual and that was because the owner had tried to make his 1219 into a manual turntable then changed his mind and did not reassemble it properly, causing it to bind and break.

The DUAL steurepimpel is a PITA but a good idea as it makes the tonearm jam proof.

 

[Lazerbrains]

Their performance is on a par with a Dual or ELAC.........

I completely agree with this.

The single BSR 810 that I've used (had one for sale and thoroughly tested it) was a quiet machine, too, proving that an idler-driven machine can be very quiet when properly designed and maintained......

So then I am unsure what parts exactly you meant when you said " metal parts that operate the tonearm functions are not that durable"? I have mine right in front of me. It is built to a very high standard and I wouldn't consider the parts "not durable" by any stretch.

The 1229 has a W/F spec of <.06% but the audible difference between that and the BSR's .1% is not audible to me.

Agreed. It's been proven that WF under .1% is undetectable to the human ear. It's actually a pretty impressive spec for an idler driven machine.

 

[stereofisher]

Could not say today how hard it would be to work on a 710/810. Back in 1973 when they first came out they were a night mare. Yet my friend at our local record store has an 810 with a nice base with a heavy plexiglass dustcover. Looks brand new! And it works. Never seen one with that base and cover. Would buy it but now I am up to 6 turntables. No place to put it. Just got another Dual 1219 with a German built base and cover. Needed this like a hole in the head. Mint. Bought the thing because it mint. Haven’t looked at one in 45 years but since learned how to fix Duals and Garrard. Might be a challenge. They are a rare bird. The 810 is the only one I have seen since ‘73.

 

[danj]

I completely agree with this.



So then I am unsure what parts exactly you meant when you said " metal parts that operate the tonearm functions are not that durable"? I have mine right in front of me. It is built to a very high standard and I wouldn't consider the parts "not durable" by any stretch.



Agreed. It's been proven that WF under .1% is undetectable to the human ear. It's actually a pretty impressive spec for an idler driven machine.

No argument here. It's my opinion and yours differs. Let's leave it at that.

 

[Lazerbrains]

No argument here. It's my opinion and yours differs. Let's leave it at that.

It's not opinion - either it is durable or it isn't. I've had it apart and don't see anything "not durable", and run it for many years now. I'm truly curious what you are talking about?

 

[stereofisher]

my friend at our local record store still has a working 810. Out of curiousity I may buy it. Need this like a hole in my head. Been 40 plus years since I played with an 710/810. Wonder how durable they are??? Stay tuned.

 

[danj]

my friend at our local record store still has a working 810. Out of curiousity I may buy it. Need this like a hole in my head. Been 40 plus years since I played with an 710/810. Wonder how durable they are??? Stay tuned.

As long as it's mechanically sound there is no reason not to buy it. It's a good machine and won't damage your records.

 

[danj]

It's not opinion - either it is durable or it isn't. I've had it apart and don't see anything "not durable", and run it for many years now. I'm truly curious what you are talking about?

You want to argue and I won't play.

Have a nice day.

 

[stereofisher]

I will likely buy it when I have room on my bench. The 810 is rare enough to have as a collectors item. This one is interesting. I will get pics of it. The dust cover is a heavy quarter inch plexiglass. Never seen one like this. Has a good Shure M91ED cart. A favorite of mine. Will have a Dual 1219,a Garrard Zero 100 and the BSR 810 next to each other. Don’t want much for Christmas, so this is it. The guy who owns it wants me to do some work so I may get it in trade. Will have room when I pack and sent a 1219. Should be fun!

 

[62vauxhall]

Good idea. I have a similar assortment and space to have 3 tt's ready to go. A Zero 100, an 810 and in my case, a 1009.

Four tables went elsewhere last Saturday so there is more room right now.

 

[Lazerbrains]

You want to argue and I won't play.

Have a nice day.

No, I'm asking what was not durable on yours. I'm starting to suspect you just want to bash because it is a BSR and are making stuff up. These are nicely made tables. I'm going to take some photos of the guts of mine next time I pull it and post them here. Build quality better than many Duals I have owned. Currently listening to Alan Parsons on it with an M91E and it sounds exquisite.

 

[Lazerbrains]

I will likely buy it when I have room on my bench. The 810 is rare enough to have as a collectors item. This one is interesting. I will get pics of it. The dust cover is a heavy quarter inch plexiglass. Never seen one like this. Has a good Shure M91ED cart. A favorite of mine. Will have a Dual 1219,a Garrard Zero 100 and the BSR 810 next to each other. Don’t want much for Christmas, so this is it. The guy who owns it wants me to do some work so I may get it in trade. Will have room when I pack and sent a 1219. Should be fun!

Mine came with an M91E - I think they were standard issue on these. I've tried other carts on it, but it seems to sound best with the M91E. I'm curious to see the dust cover. The one on mine is heavier than most other dustcovers, but not sure it's 1/4 inch. It is not hinged. Mine looks like this.

 

[stereofisher]

Mine came with an M91E - I think they were standard issue on these. I've tried other carts on it, but it seems to sound best with the M91E. I'm curious to see the dust cover. The one on mine is heavier than most other dustcovers, but not sure it's 1/4 inch. It is not hinged. Mine looks like this.View attachment 1347133

Yours is the way I remember the 710/810. Long time. Got to start packing the 1219. Will try to get over to the record store and tack a pic.

Eric

 

[danj]

No, I'm asking what was not durable on yours. I'm starting to suspect you just want to bash because it is a BSR and are making stuff up. These are nicely made tables. I'm going to take some photos of the guts of mine next time I pull it and post them here. Build quality better than many Duals I have owned. Currently listening to Alan Parsons on it with an M91E and it sounds exquisite.

Obviously you didn't get the part where I said "I don't want to argue." I am not a BSR basher, as you will see if you choose to stop trolling me.

Go away.

 

[MCM_Fan]

Darn it guys, I REALLY don't need another turntable, but there is an 810 for sale locally at a very reasonable price. The seller claim it works, but is missing the dust cover, needs new stylus (M91ED cart) and the RCA cables replaced. I'm a real sucker for walnut veneer and am tempted to buy it for that reason alone...

I can handle replacing the interconnects, I've done it on other tables, and I already have a couple N91 replacement styli (my Dual 1228 came with an M91ED), but I already have two Duals, two Elacs, two MCSs, two JVCs, a Technics and a Realistic. I should be consolidating, not expanding...

 

[likebike23]

@MCM_Fan: I feel your pain. I'd grab one of those if the price was right even though I have 4 Duals, 2 Elacs, 1 Technics, 1 Realistic, 1 BIC, and 1 BSR. Lol.

 

[Lazerbrains]

Darn it guys, I REALLY don't need another turntable, but there is an 810 for sale locally at a very reasonable price. The seller claim it works, but is missing the dust cover, needs new stylus (M91ED cart) and the RCA cables replaced. I'm a real sucker for walnut veneer and am tempted to buy it for that reason alone...



I can handle replacing the interconnects, I've done it on other tables, and I already have a couple N91 replacement styli (my Dual 1228 came with an M91ED), but I already have two Duals, two Elacs, two MCSs, two JVCs, a Technics and a Realistic. I should be consolidating, not expanding...

Looks very clean. The interconnects can be completely replaced with a standard RCA phono cable - they plug in on the underside of the turntable instead of being hardwired. I think Garrards are the same way.
The M91E Cart is very nice, IMHO. Might be worth the price of admission alone if the TT doesn't work.

I hear you about TT's - they have a habit of reproducing around here to. I have two Duals, two BICs, one Elac, and this one.

 

[dbxdx5]

I have a 710 that's awaiting a restoration. Perhaps I'll take some pics along the way.

 

[stereofisher]

Here’s a pic of the BSR 810. Never seen one like this. I remember them like the ones posted above. Don’t need but it’s rare like early Dual 1219s

Eric