Do receivers make good pre-amps?
- Thread starter Walt
- Start date
WildWest
Super Member
For my office system I am using the pre amp from an AVR. It's an old Harman/Kardon AVR 25II and it feeds my Marantz 240 amp. Some kind of Dolby Pro Logic unit. Works well enough off of the computer for MP3s.
As far as it being up to the standards of a deticated pre amp. Well, hard to say. Maybe not in some cases. It can't touch the pre amp I use in my main listening system But then again, not many pre amps can.
As far as it being up to the standards of a deticated pre amp. Well, hard to say. Maybe not in some cases. It can't touch the pre amp I use in my main listening system But then again, not many pre amps can.
Last edited:
Lefty
Super Member
Interesting questions but maybe too general a questions. I certainly feel the the preamp section of a top of the line receiver probably has just as good quality and specifications. More likely a seperate preamp may have more features then the equivelent function in a reciever. For instance my Kenwood basic C2 preamp has a independent headphone amp with it's own independent volume control, I like and use that. It also has more phono level and loading selections then my receivers have.
Actual I use both in a single system. I have too many tape/cd/vcr/cdburner/2 tuners/8 track/cassette, to hook to one receiver so several sources wire to the preamp and it's output feeds the aux input to my first receiver and one of it's preout wires to the aux of a second receiver and finally the pre out of that last receiver wires back to a aux input to the first preamp.
A giant circle that allows me great flexiblity in selecting and recording options.. pretty cool, but I did have to draw the system on paper so I can remember what hooks to what
My test for preamp quality?.... careful listening with headphones for any hiss with no source selected. None heard in my system once I gave up on equalizers... three different brands all introduced hiss.
Actual I use both in a single system. I have too many tape/cd/vcr/cdburner/2 tuners/8 track/cassette, to hook to one receiver so several sources wire to the preamp and it's output feeds the aux input to my first receiver and one of it's preout wires to the aux of a second receiver and finally the pre out of that last receiver wires back to a aux input to the first preamp.
A giant circle that allows me great flexiblity in selecting and recording options.. pretty cool, but I did have to draw the system on paper so I can remember what hooks to what
My test for preamp quality?.... careful listening with headphones for any hiss with no source selected. None heard in my system once I gave up on equalizers... three different brands all introduced hiss.
Walt
Well-Known Member
Thanks Lefty,
Yes the question was framed a bit wide, but I have heard a number of people swear that the pre-amp section on their receiver was grossly inferior to a dedicated pre-amp.
Now of course it depends on whether you're talking TOTL receivers where the build quality ensures that there are less corners cut, or just middle of the road where there are undoubtedly some concessions made to space considerations.
I have never had a dedicated pre-amp, I have always used the section of a (analog) receiver, and I wondered if I was missing out on something ... you know, kind of that "blacker than black" type of thing with regards to signal quality.
Hiss is an obvious indicator that the signal is degraded, but is there anything else concrete that you can draw a conclusion against?
BTW - Lefty - sheesh, you wouldn't want to move that setup around very often ... it must be spaghetti junction in behind!
Yes the question was framed a bit wide, but I have heard a number of people swear that the pre-amp section on their receiver was grossly inferior to a dedicated pre-amp.
Now of course it depends on whether you're talking TOTL receivers where the build quality ensures that there are less corners cut, or just middle of the road where there are undoubtedly some concessions made to space considerations.
I have never had a dedicated pre-amp, I have always used the section of a (analog) receiver, and I wondered if I was missing out on something ... you know, kind of that "blacker than black" type of thing with regards to signal quality.
Hiss is an obvious indicator that the signal is degraded, but is there anything else concrete that you can draw a conclusion against?
BTW - Lefty - sheesh, you wouldn't want to move that setup around very often ... it must be spaghetti junction in behind!
Lefty
Super Member
I'm from the school that the perfect amp (or preamp) would be a peice of wire with gain. I expect flat, wide response, no hum, no hiss, no 'coloring' of the signal no matter if you call it presence, soundstage, speed, punch, blackness, or the million other hi-fi expressions one hears often. Any system sound variations I think come from the speakers, room layout and of course the source recording.
All low level audio circuits, be they in receivers or preamps, are designed as class A biased circuits with plenty of voltage headroom. Build quality, features, styling, these are what I would think mostly rank the different brands and model line ups.
As far as great preamps, I wish I had the room for the Sansui C-3000 preamp. Try and see a picture of that thing someday. It's as large as most 125 wpc intergrated amps.
All low level audio circuits, be they in receivers or preamps, are designed as class A biased circuits with plenty of voltage headroom. Build quality, features, styling, these are what I would think mostly rank the different brands and model line ups.
As far as great preamps, I wish I had the room for the Sansui C-3000 preamp. Try and see a picture of that thing someday. It's as large as most 125 wpc intergrated amps.
ProAc_Fan
Addicted Member
Hey Lefty I just sold my CA-3000 pre about a month ago. It was a very nice pre. I agree that a preamps job is just to intoduce gain with as little coloration as posssble. I don't really like too many bells and whistles on a pre as they invariably introduce "noise" along the way. I subscribe to the Keep It Simple Stupid school of audio design.
Mike
Mike
I sure thought I remembered to posting to this question!
Well, Lefty pretty well covered the question.
Partial to TOTL receivers as I am, I think they are very capable to act as a preamp in any except the most esoteric systems, but would most likely do just fine there, too.
Plus, using the appropriate Y-adaptor patch cord, you can use the amplifiers in the receiver to drive a second pair of speakers, or to bi-amp a pair of bi-ampable speakers.
I can vouch for the extraordinary qualities of the Kenwood Basic C-2 preamp. I liked mine so much I bought a second one.
The C-1 is similar, but much simpler, and can for no good reason I understand be bought for not much more than a song on eBay.
Their phono sections are really something to listen to! As fine as any made, then or now.
With the C-2, there is just no cartridge it will not support and provide exceptional clarity and sound to the amplifier.
And, I have some of what I think are very fine preamps.
Among receivers, I would suggest the big Pioneers provide an excellent preamp section, with nearly unflappable phono sections.
But, being wishy-washy, I would not fault any of the TOTL receivers I have, so would suspect those brands other TOTL models from throughout the mid-70s to the early 80s would also be fine in the role you suggest.
pete
Well, Lefty pretty well covered the question.
Partial to TOTL receivers as I am, I think they are very capable to act as a preamp in any except the most esoteric systems, but would most likely do just fine there, too.
Plus, using the appropriate Y-adaptor patch cord, you can use the amplifiers in the receiver to drive a second pair of speakers, or to bi-amp a pair of bi-ampable speakers.
I can vouch for the extraordinary qualities of the Kenwood Basic C-2 preamp. I liked mine so much I bought a second one.
The C-1 is similar, but much simpler, and can for no good reason I understand be bought for not much more than a song on eBay.
Their phono sections are really something to listen to! As fine as any made, then or now.
With the C-2, there is just no cartridge it will not support and provide exceptional clarity and sound to the amplifier.
And, I have some of what I think are very fine preamps.
Among receivers, I would suggest the big Pioneers provide an excellent preamp section, with nearly unflappable phono sections.
But, being wishy-washy, I would not fault any of the TOTL receivers I have, so would suspect those brands other TOTL models from throughout the mid-70s to the early 80s would also be fine in the role you suggest.
pete
