Do you like horns?

[Nemo bit]

I have aways preferred multiple choice tests. I listen to my mood and that is the directive for the speaker choice of the day or hour or track...see there is really no wrong answers. I have always liked variety. My ears seem to also there is no one perfect speaker there are actually many..sonic chemistry is and must factor in what sounds correct at a given hour location and of course the people whom you are sharing what ever is on the play list. I dont think for me that I would land in any one speaker and proclaim the law says this is the end all be all sound producing device period that soon would spill into every aspect and soon all would wear the same color jumpsuit and have the same haircut all would be standardized. I prefer some conflict as it leads to opinions.
You know the rest. I have several of each. I like it that way. Cheers!

 

[Nemo bit]

Ok, no you may not...
Do you feel better?

 

[twiiii]

I owned Stevens, Altec, Klipsch home heritage speakers with horns. I installed EV, Altec Frazier, Beta, Klipsch, and JBL professionally for over 35 years. Horn design really improved there toward the end of the 80 and on into the 90's. Todays horns have been modified and made into components of line arrays. They have better coverage, are potentially louder with much lower distortion. Though I'm not always fond of column speakers, Bozak made some great ones. I know line arrays have a lot of issues, but I prefer them over horns. That said Horns can sound great if damped properly and crossed over just as they begin to loose the designed pattern control. Most companies cross horns at to low of frequency. A 311 Altec crossed at 800 HZ has a beautiful sound. Adding a super tweeter and 9 KHZ makes for a very neutral sound. The problem is what do you do below 800 HZ. This is normally where the real colorizing of sound take s place for me. I admit in most cases you are giving up 10 db of potential dynamic range unless you buy very expensive amps and line arrays. But there will be magnitudes less distortion and you don't have to sit right next to your speakers to get the desired dynamic range. Line arrays and horns allow you to have the best sound in larger rooms too. So the entire family can enjoy the best sound not just one or two.

There are solutions if you just can't stand the idea of horns or line arrays. It involves controlling the acoustics of your room and doing a lot of research to obtain the right speaker amp combination. I really enjoyed Snells A7 and with a great 300 watts per channel gave fantastic results. A Hafler DH 500 at a modest price would be a perfect amp, and if a pair of Snells could be found I'm sure a great deal could be made. The older Magico S5 has a great tweeter and mid with bass that could be optimized witha Mini DSP that would make a great investment soon when people start upgrading. A new pair or Corn walls with a mini DSP would really amaze folks. It was back in the 70's when we were using 1/3 octave room EQ's. Most of that objectionable horn sound went away. Even big Klipschorn sound really improved when voiced to a room in a home.

There are so many possibilities today. But you have to choose which parameters are most important to you. Is it Dynamic range without need for big power, is it controlled dispersion, is it low distortion, is it precise imaging, etc, etc, etc. . If we are lucky we can get two or three parameters to our satisfaction without giving up to many others. Advanced processing can maybe help with another parameter or two. But if Dynamic range is your thing and you are on a budget, horns are the only answer. STILL!

 

[Nemo bit]

Zombie thread, I know; sorry, just noticed it. But ^^^^This^^^^.

The question is too narrowly focused, the answers are too binary (by definition-- there are only two extremes!).

It depends on brand, installation, application, etc., etc. There are horns in all of my pro reinforcement gear. None at this time in my home set-up. They might be too harsh in the small enclosed environment I have available, but it doesn't mean I wouldn't give them a try sometime.

So, "It Depends."

Poll declined!

GJ

Excellent! I like speakers

 

[bowtie427ss]

I like horns done well/properly as much as any other kind of speaker done well/properly.

I dislike bad horns(plenty of those) as much as i dislike any other kind of bad speaker(plenty of those too).

 

[twiiii]

I just read a review on a Magico S5 and the reviewer was listening with his ears 96 inches from the speakers in a recliner. That would put my feet about 2.5 ft away from the speakers. Thats not going to happen. I will use my STAX ear speakers first. I listen with my ears appox. 189 inches from the vertical tweeter array. How can you enjoy a massive wall of sound being created when you can almost touch the speakers. I don't want to listen to small group jazz or classical quartets or quintets sitting in my lap or having to listen to Diana Krall as if she is spitting in my ear. I want some space for the sound to mature in the listening space to make you feel like your at a live concert, not in a recording booth. How can you listen to Michael Murray playing away on a big pipe organ that will fill a chapel when the speakers are only 96 inches away. You can't. I suppose I could listen to Segovia or other guitarists at that distance. But Basie's or Kenton's big bands, no way. Ive been to to many of their live concerts and dances at clubs to listen that way. Its just not natural. Line arrays and horns give you that distance that I need to feel comfortable.

When we installed the sound system in the Basilica in Mexico City, it was 70 meters from the Bishops chair and Altar to the front row of the balcony. The Church is in the shape of a sea shell, similar to Shell Oil Products logo. We used 5 Altec 203 B Horns for the balcony and 4 803B for the floor with Frazier under balcony speakers. The EAD was less than 8 ft. Thats the equivalent acoustic distance. Meaning when a person is speaking in a microphone at a distance of 2 ft the sound the listener hears is 8 ft.at his 210 ft seating position When you are seated appox 200 ft away and the sound of the spoken or sung word is only 8 ft; it can be a little startling to the ear and mind. But with the acoustics of the room and all the people present and the poor signal to noise ratio the EAD has to be that short in order to prevent the loss of understanding. We added a Lexicon digital processor later on so for musical events the voices didn't spit in your ear. In adverse acoustical conditions some times you have to over engineer the sound to make word understood. But in a home with close to 40 or 50 db signal to noise below the spoken word level, there is no need for speakers to be 3 ft from your feet. Let the sound breathe and become more natural .

Can you imagine trying to listen to a pair of Klipschhorns or a JBL Paragon at 8ft. I would be running away as fat as I could. Maybe thats the reason for the complaints I hear about Klipsch Heritage speakers. Any thing closer that 16 ft for a Cornerhorn, La Scala, Belle and Cornwall is just to close. A Hersey at 12 ft can be a little to close, too.

 

[twiiii]

No, I am saying I want a natural smooth and in this case loving sound. Not something foul and disgusting. Its like the difference between between Maynard Furgeson and Harry James. Both can play a lot of horn but Harry's reputation is to be smoother, more sophisticated, and not trying to kill you with sound. I want a Winton Marsalis flavor. He can be highly technical, too but he can be laid back like Bobby Hackett . Clarke Terry is my Favorite, playing Bugle and trumpet. Thats the kind of sound I want. Have you ever heard Maynard played in a living room on a pair of A-7 500's at only 12 ft. I have and I wanted to run for the hills. Now Mac's 2K speakers can be to offensive, also. They balance their speakers to give equal energy per octave of sound. And thats just unnatural. Sure it reveals the sound in a recording studio, but thats not the natural sound you hear at a live performance unless you are standing with all the musicians facing you up close and personal. If you have never stood on the podium in front of an orchestra or a Symphonic 60 piece wind band you have know idea what up close and in your face is all about. Its not much fun when they are cranking out a triple Forte. I want some natural hall sound mixed in there in addition. I need for the room to support the lower brass and reed sounds, to reinforce the bass drums and tympani. I spent an entire semester sitting in front of the tympani playing Euphonium, and the sound is nothing like being in the audience. I asked to be moved, so next semester I played Trombone. I wonder if Clayton, ever recovered after 4 years of Tympani in his ears. Of course 3 years of sitting in front of 4 trumpets in lab and dance bands was a real education. Sitting next to a trap set really helped when I had to mic drums later on. Sitting in behind 4 french horns in Symphony was ying and yang for sure. I'll take the back row anytime. It was all good fun and I used the experiences quite a bit when recording Master tapes later on in life. It also allowed me to get the mixes just right for live PA systems. So when I walk in to audition a set of speakers I have a list of predetermined sounds I want to hear. The last thing I want to hear is in your face type of sound! Unless, the recording was made that way. How do you determine how the recording was really made, for me a pair of great STAX earspeakers. The most difficult sound to capture with Symphonic orchestra for me was Cello and double basses on commercial recordings. getting the right mix of fundamental re-enforced by the room along with the upper harmonics to give the right amount of definition to the strings being bowed. In that respect Digital has opened up an entire world of correctness in capturing the true sound of a grand Symphonic orchestras, and not a bunch of mush heard on early analog recordings.

 

[Tim64]

I voted horns but not the screeching ones that make your ears bleed.

 

[GregDunn]

I've heard plenty of horns over the last 50 years. Every Klipsch I've heard during that time (even the vaunted Klipschorn) had a midrange that made my ears hurt on recordings which were anything close to flat. Dealers, private systems, etc. etc. - all had that issue. My roommate had a pair of Altec A7s; at least they didn't have the peaky high end (not sure they had *any* high end), but the mids were just way too much. I don't really count the Pioneer and Sansui systems I've heard in peoples' homes; they just weren't designed well (I think those are referred to as 'kabuki' speakers around here?)...

Actually, though I heard one horn-based speaker that impressed me; it was the venerable E-V Patrician 800. That's the one with the 30" woofer. It's probably a bit unfair to use this one as an example, though, because the owner (1) crossed it over to a pair of JansZen 130 ESL tweeters, and (2) spent considerable time EQing the system to get rid of some of the colorations. The crossover probably excluded at least one of the horns - it wasn't clear where the owner had set it. But they were quite decent sounding!

 

[cwall99]

I know lots of people like 'em for their efficiency, but when I hear horns, I'm almost always reminded of people cupping their hands around their mouths and yelling.

Not all horns that I've heard have produced this effect, but most have.

 

[Beobloke]

I always though the job of hi-fi was to make the music sound like the performers are in your room.

99% of the horn loudspeakers I have heard make the music sound more like a bad tribute band playing in a bathroom 20 feet away.

 

[Grenadeslio]

I always though the job of hi-fi was to make the music sound like the performers are in your room.

99% of the horn loudspeakers I have heard make the music sound more like a bad tribute band playing in a bathroom 20 feet away.

All of my dome/cone speakers give that "you are there" presentation, my Klipsch that "they are here" presentation, so when I want to invite Mick and the boys over to jam I fire me up some horns. I've heard no other type of loud speaker that brings the performers into your living rm better than a good set of horn speakers.

 

[Adam S]

If you ever hear the horns on the Technics SB-L series speakers it's a no-brainer. Fantastic

 

[egellings]

Some sound good; some sound blatty, shouty.

 

[bowtie427ss]

Watusi, in particular.

 

[tonyg88]

I only have one pair of speakers that are sansuis that are horns and yes the horns definitely help clear the higher frequencies up.

 

[vonclod]

Done right, like my Duo's, for sure.

Some are not as pleasing as that overall, most have their charms though.

 

[JesusChrysler]

Even 5 years ago when this thread appeared...

I still like horns .

Klipsch please.


Matt

 

[avionic]

Really like the horn on a 1969 Roadrunner..

 

[JesusChrysler]

∆∆∆
As a person with the Superbee emblem tattooed on his forearm I want to let you know I appreciate that sir.

Mopar threadjack over.

;-)


Matt