Kappa 6.1 Aquisition

It seems I found the answer myself. At least partially. Through this whole procedure I have been running two sources into a speaker selector. When I powered down the Rotel amp for moving equipment around I noticed a difference through a different set of speakers from a different amp even though the Rotel was out of the loop. Long story short, even though the switcher is not powered there must be some crossfeed going on through it or the two output connections on the Mitsubishi pre I am using. The low freq distortion cleaned up considerably when I powered up the Kappas direct. They're still not quite there imo but as I said before, I'm not really a ported speaker guy. There is hope! Thanks for all your help I will continue with updates. My new nickname for the Kappas is "The Unforgiving" because I never really noticed this with other speakers.
 
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Lol , good name. I just tried out a new amp with my 7s today. The amp was klipping at 10oclock. I don't think the amp liked them.
 
It's my understanding that the 7's are a bit more power hungry than the 6.1's. Well, I was partially right about my 6.1's. I don't think it was the switcher as much as some backfeed from the Rotel amp. They sounded the cleanest with my adcom gfa545 or Sherwood 6040 cp. When I tried bi-amp with the 545 and another adcom, 535L the distortion is more pronounced. With the low freq isolated in the crossover (supposedly) the amps are still coupled at the two pre-outs on the Sherwood pre so there is some cross contamination of the amps.

Listening with one amp (at their best) I noticed how sweet and clear they are with precise notes but get muddied up when a lot of info is pushed their way. Example: the beginning of "Walking on the Moon" by Police they were sounding wonderful through all the great highs and drum/bassline lows until the music got fuller and then there was that resonant muddiness returning. The woofer section of the crossover has two coils and and a single cap. Replacing that cap is where I am heading next unless someone steers me elsewhere. For now they sound great for jazz and classical until a crescendo. I've heard these aren't considered "rock" speakers by some but I'm committed to making them sound better. Until then I'm moving on to the 3008's.
 
the .1 kappa series most definitely ARE rock speakers. I'm wondering if you're just playing a a db level that is near their max, or the amps max. they are nearly the bottom of the chain it was 6.1 7.1 8.1 9.1. But that's just a guess. I have no idea what your reference level is.

was 'walking on the moon' from the greatest hits cd or regatta de blanc, and which pressing? a LOT of the early eighties cd's really sucked bandwidth-wise, then came the loudness wars, which were almost worse.


either way, I predict you're going to like the 3008 better for rock and roll. while I don't have 3008, I do have two pairs of 3009 and two pairs of 3007, and they do just fine on rock and roll.

IMHO, the rotel is just passable as an amp. I liked the bryston 4b much better, but it ran so damn hot..... ultimately I've gone back to old carver amps, they sound like they were made for infinity speakers.
 
Thanks for your input Jazz. I know you are an Infinity guy. I KNOW (or think I know) these speakers should sound better to my ears, that's why I'm kinda grasping at straws here to clean up the bass. The mids and highs are impeccable. I have the pots set at midpoint now. In all fairness I am comparing them to AR58s set up next to them right now. They are sealed box speakers which my ears seem to prefer. I strongly suspect (but can't say for sure until I side by side them) that I would prefer my Qb's to the 6.1's right now. My next move is to pull the MCS 3125 out of it's recent sabbatical (yeah, all 60 lbs of it!) with it's 120wpc and built in EQ and give the Kappa's a go with it before I pull them out and inspect the crossovers. No speaker selector or other crap, just a receiver and it's speakers.

BTW "Walking on the Moon" was on FM radio.
 
I can only speak for the 3006s. They are most definitely Rock Speakers. I've only had them up and going for a couple weeks. In another thread, I indicated from 12 inch from the wall. I was looking for sonic impressions aka "dents" my 7s are perfect for just about everything I've played through them. For some reason zz top and Metallic and even U2. The bass is overwhelming.Ive tried to adjust, but can't seem to balance it out to my liking. In the same room the 3006s are perfect for them. So I can only imagine the 3007s, 008s, 009s would probably follow suit.
 
I haven't even started any refoam work on the 3008's. I'm not sure how the room will handle rear ported. I had some Klipsch towers (RF3) for awhile that were rear ported, and still have Timeframe 600's. The TF's sound good for what they are but never got my ears wrapped around the Klipsch. Bright and boomy at the same time they were pretty ear-fatiguing. I DO have fun mixing, matching, and experimenting. I keep telling myself I'm going to settle in on a system I like and be done with it....yeah right!
 
Try putting some non hardening model clay in the inside corners.
Rolled up like bread and tucked into the inside edges.
Did this with my RS-6's and it toned down some of the undesirable mid bass/
I run Kappa 6 woofers in the RS-6's since they are what doesn;t blow as easy and handle more power,
But they have a slightly different resonance than the stock poly drivers and needed a little taming.
Good luck.
 
Yeah, not going to happen.lol I think I'm now on my 23rd set of speakers. Only started getting serious concerning audiophile quality in the past year or so. I must say that the kappas are keepers. To increase to the 8s and 9s. My focus will need to shift to high end amps. From what I'm experiencing. I'm going to need to go that direction for my 7s. Room filled sound is great. That's about at 9oclock with 150wpc. When I want to let the neighbors across the street enjoy what I'm listening to. Well the amps seem to say h_ll no. I am going to start looking into the Carver amps that Jazz seems to have had good experiences with.
 
I haven't even started any refoam work on the 3008's. I'm not sure how the room will handle rear ported. I had some Klipsch towers (RF3) for awhile that were rear ported, and still have Timeframe 600's. The TF's sound good for what they are but never got my ears wrapped around the Klipsch. Bright and boomy at the same time they were pretty ear-fatiguing. I DO have fun mixing, matching, and experimenting. I keep telling myself I'm going to settle in on a system I like and be done with it....yeah right!
I bet you keep at least one pair of those Infinities though! :D
Given the proper power amp they will grow on you.
 
I've always said I could make any speakers sound good with the EQ on my 3125. I rolled off -3dB at 60hz and the difference was seriously night and day. At volume I liked -6 at 60 and -3 at 240. Now I can clearly hear the quality synergy these drivers have with each other. With a nod to the "the flat way is the only way" folks I think there is still something amiss with them but for now that's for another day.

Ironically the AR's are the opposite. Kind of bright and could use some bass. Anyway, I'm pushing the Kappa's pretty hard right now (80's mix-Talking Heads, Pretenders, etc) and am finally enjoying what I'm hearing from them. I still might bring the Qb's and stack 'em on the AR's for giggles but I no longer think they will outshine the 6.1's. Check the EQ settings in the pics. Unreal difference.
 

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Just so you all don't label me crazy or "bass-hater" here's the EQ settings I settled in on for the AR58s with non-stock tweeters.
 

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Amazing difference between the two settings.
I guess my adc sound shaper is going back into service and used with my 7s. Have not used with the musical groups I mentioned earlier. It will be interesting to see if dialing the low end back that far makes the difference. Dialing it back on the preamp seemed to take to much away from the music.
 
Loving me some Steely Dan on vinyl at low-mid volume right now. I have an old school Audio Control 520 (look up the owners manual it's hilarious) that I was thinking of using for the low end only when I was bi-amping the 6.1's but I was thinking signal path problems and I didn't want to add any extra circuitry. In retrospect that would have gave me the answer right then. It has adjustment at 30, 60, and 120 AND a subsonic filter. I had that MCS 3125 as my main for quite some time and that prompted the first sentence of my post #31. It's a sweet sounding receiver and though it looks a little funky I like that a quality EQ is built in so no need for extra cabling. When I got a pair of KEF 105.2's they were the first speakers that really sounded best flat to me. They are still my favorite speakers but kind of large. They fit nice with my HT setup so I'll leave them there for awhile.

I agree, simple tone controls do seem to take away from the overall tonal quality whereas an EQ can certainly dial it in better. I'm still curious as to why I had to go through all this with those Kappas. Something is not right.
 
7 Kappa and Kappa 7.1 or 6.1 Series II are completely different speakers. The x.1 Series II are supposed to be a bit easier on the power amp, and as noted they are front-ported. The 7 Kappa are in sealed boxes and have 12" woofers. 7.1 S II and 6.1 S II have 10" and 8" woofers, respectively.

The more I listen to the 7.1 Series II, the more I'm realizing how good they are. Bi-amped with two identical ATI 1502 power amps is doing the trick. The longevity of the Polydomes concerns me, but they definitely sound pretty good to my ears.
 
Loving me some Steely Dan on vinyl at low-mid volume right now. I have an old school Audio Control 520 (look up the owners manual it's hilarious) that I was thinking of using for the low end only when I was bi-amping the 6.1's but I was thinking signal path problems and I didn't want to add any extra circuitry. In retrospect that would have gave me the answer right then. It has adjustment at 30, 60, and 120 AND a subsonic filter. I had that MCS 3125 as my main for quite some time and that prompted the first sentence of my post #31. It's a sweet sounding receiver and though it looks a little funky I like that a quality EQ is built in so no need for extra cabling. When I got a pair of KEF 105.2's they were the first speakers that really sounded best flat to me. They are still my favorite speakers but kind of large. They fit nice with my HT setup so I'll leave them there for awhile.

I agree, simple tone controls do seem to take away from the overall tonal quality whereas an EQ can certainly dial it in better. I'm still curious as to why I had to go through all this with those Kappas. Something is not right.

So I have the 8.1s and think they sound great when I run my pre amp on tone defeat. I’m running a Parasound pre on both my Kappa 9s and 8.1s and they sound fantastic. The bass can be alittle boomy due to the port on the .1 series. My amps have level controls so on the woofers I have them set half way and that’s more than enough. It really gives them a tighter punch.
 
So I have the 8.1s and think they sound great when I run my pre amp on tone defeat. I’m running a Parasound pre on both my Kappa 9s and 8.1s and they sound fantastic. The bass can be alittle boomy due to the port on the .1 series. My amps have level controls so on the woofers I have them set half way and that’s more than enough. It really gives them a tighter punch.

When I bi-amped the 6.1's I used the 60wpc Adcom 535 with gain pots on the highs and 100wpc fixed on the woofers. I thought of switching because of the pots to tame the woofers but decided to go the receiver route instead. I'm pretty sure I would prefer the non-ported Kappas over the ported versions even if both in mint condition.
 
7 Kappa and Kappa 7.1 or 6.1 Series II are completely different speakers. The x.1 Series II are supposed to be a bit easier on the power amp, and as noted they are front-ported. The 7 Kappa are in sealed boxes and have 12" woofers. 7.1 S II and 6.1 S II have 10" and 8" woofers, respectively.

The more I listen to the 7.1 Series II, the more I'm realizing how good they are. Bi-amped with two identical ATI 1502 power amps is doing the trick. The longevity of the Polydomes concerns me, but they definitely sound pretty good to my ears.
This may be a bit out of the norm. Instead of getting my polydomes restored. I installed the mids from a set of RSb speakers. They sound fantastic! You can see them on my avatar. A post I read on AK indicated if you listen predominantly to rock music. The cones have more punch. And I enjoy what I hear from them. I believe the RS7s use these mids and some of the Quantums. Something you could experiment with. I kept the polydomes in case I desire to get them restored and put them back in sometime in the future. But for now, I'm good.
 
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This may be a bit out of the norm. Instead of getting my polydomes restored. I installed the mids from a set of RSb speakers. They sound fantastic! You can see them on my avatar. A post I read on AK indicated if you listen predominantly to rock music. The cones have more punch. And I enjoy what I hear from them. I believe the RS7s use these mids and some of the Quantums. Something you could experiment with. I kept the polydomes in case I desire to get them restored and put them back in sometime in the future. But for now, I'm good.

Interesting...any idea if that's the same mid-range used on the RS-II?

I also have a spare pair of 2.5" Polydomes from the RS-IIIa/4/5 series. Spares for my RS-IIIa and RS-5b. Maybe they would work in a pinch.

There's a member working or a new (proper) dome for the 3" Polydomes, so maybe all our worries will soon be over.
 
@TomBig58 , I think you will really like those Crescendos. They may like a larger room. I had the 3007s and adored them. When placed correctly, the Crescendo series shines.
And, if you have a larger room somewhere else in your house, try dragging the Kappas in that room. The Crescendo series likes larger rooms and I'd guess the Kappas would too. :)
Good luck with the refoam of the Crescendos, and enjoy both of them; they are great speakers.
 
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