Moore lay offs & bad news at Gibson ....Is the end near?

Discussion in 'Musical Instruments' started by PureQuill, Mar 1, 2018.

  1. valvenator

    valvenator curious bystander, serious procrastinator Subscriber

    Well, please do tell. We like stories.
    Unlike the junk we had to struggle with back in the day a student can get a quality instrument that's very playable and sounds really good for under $200.
     

     

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  2. Ross6860

    Ross6860 AK Subscriber Subscriber

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    I was thinking of thinning the herd. May as well keep them for another decade. Maybe they will go out of business and the stuff will appreciate in value;)

    Never bought a new Gibson or Fender (except for a 50's Tribute with a broken neck). Plenty of great guitars out there for a lot less scratch.

    I absolutely had to have a real Gibson LP Standard in Cherry Sunburst. Picked up one used that looked like NOS for about 1/3 of a new one, and it's not made from two or three pieces of mahogany, either.
     
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  3. PureQuill

    PureQuill AK Member Subscriber

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    I don’t think Gibson will disappear completely the brand is a worldwide household name. But I bet they will be bought out hopefully by their employees and shed everything but Epiphone and get back to making legendary quality gutiars that are worth what they cost.There is market for high end & professional instruments PRS And Taylor have proven that. Gibson needs guitarist that understands what players want and need running the company on all levels from manafacturing to marketing and research and development. Not a bunch of Wall Street suits and advertise executives that only interest is their quarterly bonuses and golden parachutes.
    Cheers
    PQ
     
  4. Pio1980

    Pio1980 AK Member Subscriber

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    Les is Moore?
     
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  5. Ross6860

    Ross6860 AK Subscriber Subscriber

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    Agreed. The name alone is probably too valuable to die. Hopefully whatever happens they will get back to making guitars at least close to their price.

    But is any new LP worth $5000-$6000? They currently list 23 Les Paul models >$9000. 48 at $7000 or more. Really?
     
  6. Rockon1

    Rockon1 Well-Known Member

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    ..another LP player?

     
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  7. joekapahulu

    joekapahulu Active Member

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    The current CEO bought the company out and resuscitated it once over 20 years ago. They then proceeded to treat it like a Business School case on brand management and line extensions. Along the way they made some interesting decisions, some good, some questionable, many not that different than those made by Fender, Taylor, others in past eras. But in the last few years, they seem to have repeated the errors made by previous owners of both Gibson and Fender (aka Norlin and CBS) getting into businesses they didnt understand, overpaying for company, loading up on debt, damaging dealer relationships and those with the employees. Now, it seems to have caught up with them. Getting rid of their senior people (i.e. the ones with the knowledge and skills who probaby also cost the most) is incredibly short term thinking which will probably bite them in the ass big time. Heritage Guitars in Kalamazoo had its genesis in the last near collapse of Gibson. Lets see what comes out of this one. The market is very different than it was the last time Gibson tanked. Lots of great guitars coming out of Asia and lots of alternative brands, copies of the LP and others not protected any more, etc.
     
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  8. Binkman

    Binkman AK Subscriber Subscriber

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    Snatched an auction 2012 lp for under 200 w/ bigsby vebrat & and surprising perfect finish w/kit bag. Didn't care for the bigs. so swapped back, installed bone nut & new gibson gold bucks. night and day. Seller set neck for slide action, took a long gradual approach to get it back in as it was skewed as well. I've auditioned a good share of gibson's and results caused me to buy a hard shell case.

    http://www.epiphone.com/news-features/features/2012/les-paul-standard-available-in-3-new-colors.aspx
    This one is Pelham Blue.
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2018
  9. savatage1973

    savatage1973 Addicted Member

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    I agree that the "brand" is valuable, and it's history and legend that follows it will not disappear. However, I think it is destined for another "conglomerate", just like all of the brands bought out by Harman, and then turned over to Samsung. I doubt that an employee buy-out is even a viable option given the level of debt and need to shed all of the acquisitions--that would take big money. So get ready to buy your new Chinese Gibson soon.
     
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  10. John James

    John James "Bob's your uncle" (Stolen) Subscriber

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  11. luvvinvinyl

    luvvinvinyl Aggie! Staff Member Admin Subscriber

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    More or less.
     
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  12. Binkman

    Binkman AK Subscriber Subscriber

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    Binkman, Yesterday at 4:25 AM Edit Report
    #28
    I was trying to illustrate comparisons of other epi owners who beefed up theirs in alternative to owner Gibson brand lp of which i've auditioned several. For neck action after my adjusting. if i were blind folded and handed both I would have a hard time telling the difference. many players online of late share a fine line after tweaks and proper set-up.
     
  13. Ross6860

    Ross6860 AK Subscriber Subscriber

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    Absolutely nothing wrong with Epi, Hamer, Agile, Squire, Gretsch, or many of the other Indonesian/Chinese built guitars out there.

    Korean and Japanese stuff can be even better.

    Change the pickups, pots, and caps and play happily away with a bunch of money left in your pocket.
     
  14. PureQuill

    PureQuill AK Member Subscriber

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    I will say this about Gibson quality last year when I walked in to buy a Gibson 335 and I walked out with an Epiphone Dot.
    Gibson quality control was so poor and the Epiphones was so good that I simply could not justify the difference in price I am sad to say.
    As always your YMMV.
    PQ
     
  15. Ross6860

    Ross6860 AK Subscriber Subscriber

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    It's been bad for a while. I have a Custom Shop 330 that came with bad wiring and '61 RI SG that had a nut that looked like it was never fit.

    Thankfully the build was fine otherwise on both. The 330 is a real screamer. I can't spring for a Byrdland so it will have to do.
     
  16. quartersaw

    quartersaw Well-Known Member

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    Unless you buy Custom Shop, the quality is simply awful. Squarish shaped necks. Poorly dressed frets. Etc. I bought an MIJ Orville By Gibson ES-335, because the build quality was like a vintage 335. (I've been playing for 48 years)
    Custom Shop guitars are way overpriced, so they've killed their own market..Oh, well....
     

     

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  17. quartersaw

    quartersaw Well-Known Member

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    I also have a 1998 Epiphone MIJ Les Paul Standard(Open book headstock model) I swapped out the pickups with a '57 classic in the neck position,and a Burstbucker III for the bridge. Build quality is excellent. Long tenon neck set, just like a Gibson Custom Shop model. I paid $625 with the hardshell case, and shipping included off of the 'bay. I'd love to have a custom shop LP standard. 6$K+???
    No thanks.
     
  18. mhedges

    mhedges Super Member

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    Curious what the opinions are on the other two large scale US acoustic guitar makers (Martin and Taylor). Are they also having quality issues?

    I have a lower end Martin (D16GT) from the early 00’s and it had an issue with bad lacquer on the top. But other than that it’s pretty good.
     
  19. savatage1973

    savatage1973 Addicted Member

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    "Custom" anything is expensive--far beyond buying "off the rack". It doesn't "kill the market", but it sure limits the number of buyers, and "exclusivity" further drives prices up.

    I am a contractor, and build and remodel homes/offices. If you choose cabinets out of the catalogues for your kitchen, I can do it for a couple grand--if we have to custom build and stain to your specifications, basically you can add one more zero to the price. It is what it is. OTOH, "custom" does not equal more valuable in the future--unless someone thinks you have/had impeccable taste in your custom job.
     
  20. quartersaw

    quartersaw Well-Known Member

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    I'm sure that you don't do a 'casual' job when installing lessor quality cabinets, but this is exactly what Gibson does with their standard line of goods. I don't mind paying for quality, but when making the leap from $2K, to $7K for a guitar, I can't justify that expense to get details that should be standard for anything that comes out of the Gibson factory.
     

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