My AK Fest Experience; First and Probably My Last.

[SubWolfer]

One caveat before I give y’all my perspective. I'm a noob and this is a total noob's perspective of AK Fest. But we're all entitled to our opinion and I wanted to share my experience. So please don't get angry or flame me.

First off, I’m certainly no expert on hi-fi audio, as I have only recently been bitten by the vintage audio bug. As far as really high-end two channel audio components go, I have very limited experience. Never-the-less, I discovered this really friendly forum and have nothing but good things to say about AK.org; Very friendly people, excellent info and mostly very helpful advice from AK members.

I read and perused various forums here on AK, asking for help and advice. In doing so, discovered and read about AK Fest. Well, since I reside here in Michigan and AK Fest was being held practically right in my backyard, I told a buddy of mine (who was quite surprised by my sudden interest in hi-fi audio and vintage stereo) about it. I asked him if he wanted to go check it out. He could not make it on Saturday, which was fine with me because I felt it might be very crowded that day, and plus, May 3 was the first Saturday in May, Kentucky Derby Day!

Sunday morning my buddy and I went to the AK Fest and arrived about 10:00 AM. Very nice hotel very friendly people, But I'm going to be totally honest and not sugarcoat anything.. My very brief and blunt perception was… a big let-down. I thought it was really lame and so did my buddy. We were both totally disappointed and felt it was highly over-rated.

I guess I didn’t know what to expect at AK Fest. The Fest seemed as though it was all about super high-end gear that was way out of my league, like speakers that cost $10,000 a pair. And check this, I just recently bought a used Pioneer integrated amp and used Paradigm speakers for off eBay. I also recently bought an old vintage 60's Pioneer tube tuner. But still, I certainly thought there would be something for everyone at the Fest. That was not to be. They had one tiny room with some older used stuff, which in my opinion wasn’t even worth putting on eBay, let alone on display and for sale at an audio show.

The show itself was, well… I thought it sucked to be totally blunt. All these very small, single hotel rooms that all had their doors shut and the blinds closed. When you walked in, it felt like you were interrupting something. Not that anyone was rude mind you. But I just didn’t feel comfortable. Especially after walking into a few of the rooms (remember, you had to actually open the door, you couldn’t just freely walk in) with this feeling like I was disturbing the occupants. Not anything like I expected, that’s for sure.

I live here in Michigan and every year we have the International North America Auto Show, held in Detroit. I’m sure y’all know what that’s about. It’s really awesome. I kind of thought this would be somewhat similar. Sure, I knew there were going to be some listening rooms set up, but I expected there to be some wide open areas as well, big conference rooms that you could just walk around and check stuff out. But again, this was not to be. Every room was a tiny little single hotel room with the doors closed that had occupants engaged in what felt like some private affairs. It felt like I was intruding, due mostly to the fact of how small each room was and the closed doors. It was like walking into an auto dealership and entering the room where the salesman is speaking to a perspective client in a small cubicle. It just wasn’t a very open, inviting atmosphere. And no vintage audio gear to boot. If there was, I didn’t see it because after trespassing into several rooms, we left.

Total time spent at the AK Fest; just over an hour at a cost of $15. It just wasn’t what I expected. I guess if you know everyone and want to get into BS sessions, it could be fun. But that’s not what I went there for. At least at the Auto Show, even if you don’t care for checking out all the newest cars, there’s other exhibits and something for everyone, including attractive female models. I found the AK Fest to be nothing but two floors of un-inviting tiny hotel rooms with expensive high-end audio and old men engaged in uninteresting private conversation.

My first and probably last AK Fest, I'm sorry to say.

 

[Fisher-Dave]

Sorry you feel that way.

I remember my first trip to the fest, yes it did seem a bit odd not really knowing folks but before I left, I was feeling right at home. When it was time to leave, why it was kinda hard to walk away from.Should have gave it a little time, I mean folks are excited after waiting a year to meet up again, so sure they gonna be bullshitting. I know I did. LOL, I bullshit more each time I go as folks only become closer :thmbsp:

Each listening room had a place to sit and listen to the systems :yes:

 

[SubWolfer]

Sorry you feel that way.

Each listening room had a place to sit and listen to the systems :yes:

True that, a love seat style sofa that could accommodate two adults. Glad I went Sunday rather than Saturday. Can't imagine trying to walk in those tiny rooms with any type of crowd there, and it wasn't like it was a ghost town on Sunday, either.

I reckon if I could have walked into each room with a full understanding of what to expect and realized that you had to sort of "fit in" to get the most out of it, maybe then I would have got something out of it. But I had a buddy with me and he had the exact same impression I did. He actually felt like they shouldn't charge a dime for admission. But I told him I'd buy him a couple beers to make up for leading him on and talking it up. I was disappointed to say the least. And none, I mean not one female, except for the check-in gals. it was just boring I thought, I wasn't wowed except for the price tags on some of the gear.

And don't get me wrong, I didn't go there hoping to see hot chicks dancing wildly or expecting a freakin party (although it would have helped). But the atmosphere was so dry that it made me want to leave after just 10 minutes of being there. And the extremely expensive gear and all the older men BS'n, it just wasn't what I would call "fun" at all. How anyone found it to be is beyond me. Would have been a little more enjoyable to at least have some women to talk to. I don't know. maybe I aint "mature" enough to appreciate the Fest. But I just felt that there was nothing "festive" about the "Fest" in my opinion.

 

[Kegger]

As you say, you are definatly entitled to your oppinion, but you really didn't
give the fest a fair chance as you really need to spend some time there and
check things out a bit, sure there's a bunch of high end/expensive gear in a
good bit of the rooms, but there's also some moderatly priced things as well
(the fest is really paid for by the exhibitors) plus there is plenty of DIY and
vintage there to in the members rooms which were scattered in with the big
manufacturers, the fest is large and it does take some time to see it all/and
or what one might be looking for.

Hope you give it another shot next year, look for the members rooms, they'll
give you more of what you were looking for.

 

[BajaGringo]

I have never gone to one of these events but I have had the opportunity to attend similar venues from online forums. My experience in general is that if one goes to such an event that has a history, you will find that your first time will be a bit difficult as they all seem to know each other and you will feel like the odd man out. It happens. My suggestions...

For the "newbies" - make an effort to go up to folks and introduce yourself and include your online handle. Tell them where you are from and that this is your first time. In other words, "break the ice..."

For the "veterans" - it can be intimidating for someone coming for the first time with not a single friendly face around. Especially if you are all in your own little groups and the conversation stops the minute a newbie walks in and you are all staring at him/her like they just stepped off an alien spaceship. Be the first to extend your hand and introduce yourselves. Invite the newbie into the conversation and find some common ground. Remember what it's like to be in his/her shoes...

I wasn't aware it was only high end / high $$$ gear. I thought there would be a lot of old and hard to find gear as well in addition to some gear members brought to sell/show. A balance would be good to offer broader appeal.

But what do I know...

 

[Wigwam Jones]

True that, a love seat style sofa that could accommodate two adults. Glad I went Sunday rather than Saturday. Can't imagine trying to walk in those tiny rooms with any type of crowd there, and it wasn't like it was a ghost town on Sunday, either.

Some of the rooms were quite crowded, but many were empty a good part of the day Sunday. And it ebbed and flowed - if there was a room you wanted to get into, sometimes just waiting for a song to end could make the difference.

I reckon if I could have walked into each room with a full understanding of what to expect and realized that you had to sort of "fit in" to get the most out of it, maybe then I would have got something out of it. But I had a buddy with me and he had the exact same impression I did.

Well, I have to say I'm honestly not sure what you mean there. We have all types at AK. From the outgoing to the fairly introverted. I didn't know what to expect in each room (this was my 2nd Fest) and I just barged right in and plopped myself down. Never noticed anything amiss - perhaps my skin is too thick?

He actually felt like they shouldn't charge a dime for admission. But I told him I'd buy him a couple beers to make up for leading him on and talking it up. I was disappointed to say the least. And none, I mean not one female, except for the check-in gals.

Yeah, well there I think you're a little off-base. I won't flame you, but you know, if you want hot chicks, go to a bar. This is AK, and a very large contingent of us are typical middle-class, middle-aged, men. Sure, some women get into audio gear, and some husbands and wives share an interest and come to these things together. But really - most of us are a bit past the need to see a swimsuit model explain the characteristic curve of a new speaker design.

it was just boring I thought, I wasn't wowed except for the price tags on some of the gear.

If you were bored, then yes, you were probably in the wrong place. It's not glam and glitter. Pricey? Hey, I'm in the same boat you are - I could not afford one of those speakers - hell, I could not afford one of the cables they used to hook 'em up.

But - I did get to listen to them. And you know, it is great to be able to hear what 'top of the line' sounds like from time to time. And especially in an environment where there is no pressure on you to buy anything - nobody sizing you up or pre-qualifying you or trying to figure out how much disposable income you may have. I'm intimidated walking into the high-end audio salons, frankly. I'm not able to buy that gear and I feel like I'm wasting their time going in there. But at AK, they come to me.

And don't get me wrong, I didn't go there hoping to see hot chicks or expecting a freakin party. But the atmosphere, the extremely expensive gear, all the older men BS'n, it just wasn't what I would call "fun" at all.

Well, as to being old, we're old. Sorry. Deal with it. I'm 47 this July. What would you like me to do about it? Wave a magic wand and be 20 again?

I'll tell you this - for all that being 20 was cool and fun and all - I am currently in a situation where I rent a room in a house in Royal Oak with three 20-something guys, and half the time they wake me up when they come in wrecked at 3 in the morning, and I've found more than one of them face-down in their own puke when I leave for work in the morning. I'm pretty happy at 47. Really.

How anyone found it to be is beyond me. There was nothing "festive" about the "Fest" in my opinion.

I'm guessing that a lot of us older men who stood around BS'ing found it interesting - and yes, I am going to guess it is beyond you. Not trying to be insulting, but you have to get old before you understand old. Our advantage is that we've been your age - you haven't been ours.

I hope you'll give the Fest a try again sometime. Maybe a different set of expectations would help - and I mean that in a positive and hopefully helpful way. Consider it a chance to audition lots of very expensive gear without being hassled. Grow a bit of a thicker skin and just walk in any room you like and deposit yourself on the sofa. Even bring some of your favorite music (I got turned on to Modest Mouse yesterday, interesting stuff) and make the sales guy play that for you. They'll do it, trust me. Hell, it might even clear out some of the old guys.

Oh and one last thing - did you check out the 'AK Member' rooms? Lots of AK guys had their DIY, low-cost, vintage, and other non-nose-bleed expensive stuff there. Some of it sounded terrific!

THAT, I can afford.

The nice thing about AK and AK Fest for me is that I can go there with a bunch of guys who have WAY more money than I do, and while they might be able to buy that top-end kit and I can't - they never act like they're better than me. That means a lot to me.

 

[onepixel]

Sub,

AK isn't solely about "vintage" audio although a lot of us here enjoy vintage gear. Listening to music is an intimate, "private", and individual experience. It's nearly impossible to properly listen to music in a "big conference room" with most home audio.

And like "auto shows" it should be fun checking out what the hot performers are, like a Maserati, Lotus or any other exotic and expensive automobile. The Fest gives the vendors and sponors a place to show off their best.

As for the old guys sitting around talking, most are good friends and they have some very interesting things to say.

If you hang around here long enough, you'll get a better understanding of it all.

 

[jeffsab]

I can relate to what SubWolfer wrote. I'm new to the hobby and also found the event to be different than I expected, but I still had a great time. I do think it would be nice if there was some sort of "newbie" room or orientation session next year. On that note, perhaps some official seminars on things like replacing speaker surrounds or cleaning out a Salvation Army receiver with Deoxit.

 

[SubWolfer]

Please understand, this is just one mans opinion. A first-timer and a very inexperienced audio fan. I certainly don't want tot take anything away from the enjoyment other audiophile veterans got from the Fest experience. I just didn't get that same sense of satisfaction and just felt it was way over-rated. And one thing I can say for sure, being a noob to vintage audio and and hi-fi stereo, this show didn't help me or educate me at all. I was hoping that it would but it did not. I guess what really turned me off the most was the tiny rooms. If there was more than 5 people in there it felt cramped. Maybe I'm a little claustrophobic. Or perhaps I just didn't like being in a tiny room with all guys. Some rooms I just opened the door and peeked in, didn't even want to walk in cause the vibe was just strange. Again. if there would been some females in there dancing or some laughing and a festive vibe, I woulda felt different and probably enjoyed it. But sorry, IMHO, it was lame. Guess it aint for everyone.

 

[Wigwam Jones]

While I can relate to everything SubWolfer wrote. I'm new to the hobby and also found the event to be different than I expected, but I still had a great time. I do think it would be nice if there was some sort of "newbie" room or orientation session next year. On that note, perhaps some official seminars on things like replacing speaker surrounds or cleaning out a Salvation Army receiver with Deoxit.

Those are good ideas. Nobody liked my idea of having a Bose Toss contest.

But I would happily volunteer to terrorize, I mean tenderize, I mean terminate, I mean, show the newbies around and 'splain things to them if that would help.

And by the by - I think Squidward has to be given some cred here - he was very welcoming - anyone who stopped by his room got a warm invite, was offered a seat and conversation, and he always explained what he was showing off (his own tube amps) and how he built them, and he even tried to evangelize (in a nice and gentle way) how easy it was to DIY a tube amp - I nearly memorized his whole speech after hearing about five times while I was taking pictures of his tube amp innards. Squidward went the extra mile - he was the true AK Ambassador of DIY Funk, and I think he should be thanked for it.

Sorry our new guy here didn't make it by his room!

 

[BajaGringo]

I think that if we can keep this topic above board there might be a lot of value for both newbies and veterans. I would like to hear the perspective of more newbies and veterans. An honest conversation with no hurt feelings would only help to make the next event an even bigger success. It is easy to see how such an event in the beginning would tend to be a get-together between good friends but as years pass and the event grows it is probably a good idea to accept that the scope and venue will change in size and dynamic.

I would like to attend a fest in the future and I would be interested to hear what folks on both side of the issue think...

 

[Wigwam Jones]

Please understand, this is just one mans opinion. A first-timer and a very inexperienced audio fan. I certainly don't want tot take anything away from the enjoyment other audiophile veterans got from the Fest experience. I just didn't get that same sense of satisfaction and just felt it was way over-rated. And one thing I can say for sure, being a noob to vintage audio and and hi-fi stereo, this show didn't help me or educate me at all. I was hoping that it would but it did not. I guess what really turned me off the most was the tiny rooms. If there was more than 5 people in there it felt cramped. Maybe I'm a little claustrophobic. Or perhaps I just didn't like being in a tiny room with all guys. Some rooms I just opened the door and peeked in, didn't even want to walk in cause the vibe was just strange. Again. if there would been some females in there dancing or some laughing and a festive vibe, I woulda felt different and probably enjoyed it. But sorry, IMHO, it was lame. Guess it aint for everyone.

OK, well, I'm really trying to be nice and you were very polite and said not to flame you, so I really don't want to.

But what you're saying is that you wanted the room layout to be different - well it is a hotel, not sure how that happens, do we tear out the walls for you? And you want the male-female ratio to be different - ok go round up some willing female audiophiles, I guess - good luck, we haven't been too good at that ourselves up to now, and you have a 'too many guys' tweek - well sorry, but really, son, I spent six years in the Marines sleeping in a room with 80 other guys, if five or so bother you, you might consider that you've got an issue going on there. And as to the laughing and dancing. Well, I laughed the whole time (ask anyone) and hell man, I'll dance for you, but you'll probably claw your own eyeballs out to get the memory out of your brain.

Seriously, I'm sorry you didn't dig it. But you're not showing that you're willing to do much more than show up and say 'entertain me'. Hey, wasn't that a song?

 

[Celadon]

Sorry to hear that the Fest wasn't your cup of tea, but to me the Fest represents the camaraderie that AK is all about.

I only wish that I were fortunate enough to have been able to attend something that was "was being held practically right in my backyard" as you say. For me, the Fest is a couple thousand miles away-- maybe next year! :thmbsp:

Putting together faces with the online community that AK is, and spending time with those faces, in real time-- sharing experiences and laughs seems to be what the real spirit of AK is about anyway.

Hell, if I wanted to see a bunch of females dancing around there's plenty of places for that sort of thing, and car shows too.

No flame, just my 2 cents, and my appreciation for your point of view, and more so, for AudioKarma and what it represents to me.

 

[Kegger]

Yes if you really wanted the Vintage or an AK feeling or a DIY thing one really
did need to make a point to get to the members rooms, there you would have
gotten that experience you went there to find and maybe learn something to.

 

[SubWolfer]

I have never gone to one of these events but...

For the "veterans" - it can be intimidating for someone coming for the first time with not a single friendly face around. Especially if you are all in your own little groups and the conversation stops the minute a newbie walks in and you are all staring at him/her like they just stepped off an alien spaceship.

For never being to one of these events you hit it right on the head. What I quoted from you above describes my experience to the T. Add in in expensive gear (which was way out of my league) and I think you get the picture.

I'm sure a lota folks had a great time. I just have to be honest though and express I wasn't one of them. But hey, it's OK. Me and my buddy had a couple beers and a burger and talked about the gear i recently acquired. Still had an enjoyable day. Oh, and by the way, my buddy did buy several used LP's in the Vinyl Swap room and I got a really cool old Ian Hunter LP.

 

[Wigwam Jones]

Yes if you really wanted the Vintage or an AK feeling or a DIY thing one really
did need to make a point to get to the members rooms, there you would have
gotten that experience you went there to find and maybe learn something to.

Me and Kegger could both dance for you. Oooh, baby. Makes me fell warm all over.

 

[Justen]

So you let your own fear and discomfort (and lack of women) turn you away from a potential learning experience. You get of life exactly what you put into it; no more, and no less.

 

[BajaGringo]

Sorry to hear that the Fest wasn't your cup of tea, but to me the Fest represents the camaraderie that AK is all about.

I wasn't even there so I can only try to read between the lines. You mention the "camaraderie" and I understand the value in that. So imagine the perspective of a newbie who walks into rooms where he feels like he is breaking up private conversations between friends. It is not a very comfortable feeling and probably contributed to him wanting to make an early escape and not having an overall good feeling about the event. Maybe some of the old timers who arrive knowing many or most of the faces could make an effort to help reach out to the new faces. I would if I wanted to help make the event continue to grow.

More people means more exposure for the sponsors meaning more support from them. Just seems like common sense.

But what do I know...

 

[Kegger]

OK I'm tired, time to crash, 3 days of staying up till 4am and partying with a
bunch of good people has taken it's tole on me, peace brothers!

I welcomed anyone and everyone into my room with a handshake and an intro!!

CAN'T WAIT TILL NEXT YEAR! (Already got next years amplifier project in my head)

 

[fotno]

Perhaps if you'd hung around here a little longer, and gotten to know the people who make up the AK family, you'd likely have realized that some of those old men engaged in "uninteresting" conversation, have a great deal to offer a young person who would take the time to introduce themselves.

There was more audio (and world-wise) knowledge in those tiny rooms, that you can even imagine. Amp builders, speaker builders, designers and engineers, not to mention the hobbyists who have forgotten more than I'll probably ever know, not to mention Men and Women who have sailed the world over, traveled to the far corners of the globe, and have the stories (and scars) to show for it.

But more importantly, you walked into a place filled with my friends. A building packed to the rafters with some of the best & kindest people I've ever known. Those "old men" have treated me like a brother, and have given of their time and energy over and over, till I know I'll never balance the scales. One of my proudest achievements as a human being is to be counted in their number, to be one of them.

I was not there this year. I wish that I could have been... I would have loved to have had the opportunity you had.

You said every one is entitled to an opinion, well there's mine.