Neat P-68H - Platter Bearing

mdye

Active Member
Any Neat P-68H owners out there? Looks like early 60's, Japanese idler. Very cool table. I recently came into possession of one and am attempting some basic service on it. One of the first things I wanted to do was remove the main bearing housing with the platter spindle for a good cleaning and re-lube, but I cant for the life of me figure out how to remove the spindle from the housing.

The housing attaches to the top plate with three screws. I can remove it from the top plate with no issues, but from there I'm lost. There isn't any sort of set screw holding the spindle in, and the bottom of the housing doesn't seem to unscrew to expose the bearing itself. It would seem that you're suppose to just pull the spindle out, but that doesn't work either.

Anyone have any clues? I can post some pics of the housing when I get home tonight for further reference.
 
Attaching some pics. You can see a seam about an inch from the bottom of the bearing housing. I initially thought that a screw cap was on the bottom (I've seen others like that), but that bottom does not budge. I now think it's a solid brass housing, but that must mean that the spindle just pulls straight out of the top. There is some play there, but it doesn't come out easily, and I don't want to damage anything.
 

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You can see a seam about an inch from the bottom of the bearing housing. I initially thought that a screw cap was on the bottom (I've seen others like that), but that bottom does not budge. I now think it's a solid brass housing, but that must mean that the spindle just pulls straight out of the top. There is some play there, but it doesn't come out easily, and I don't want to damage anything.
Maybe the seam does unscrew, but it's just jammed on tight, and needs that dreaded word, Force. Same for pulling the spindle out. A straight-pull won't cause damage (I hope).

Bottom line, does it not work? You can 'drip' some fresh oil in. There maybe sludge you can't reach, but if it spins and isn't noisy... don't let the perfect be the enemy of it-works...
 
That's what I thought too, but I've tried heating the metal and still can't get even the slightest budge. Pliers and clamps didn't work either.

Your advice on letting it be if it works is spot-on, and I am guilty of not following my own advice in those regards more often than I care to admit. I've broken, stripped, etc. a few parts in my time after I told myself to just let it be...and didn't. That's the direction I'm going to go this time, unless someone can come along and confirm exactly how this housing comes apart.
 
An internal snap ring type retainer maybe? The bottom of the spindle might be rounded or machined down a bit to slip past the retainer ring. Pushing the ring into a groove, then snapping back into a groove in the spindle once pushed into the housing. I've seen that kind of thing before, but not on a turntable. It makes for ease of assembly, but not very serviceable.
 
I've broken, stripped, etc. a few parts in my time after I told myself to just let it be...and didn't
Perfectionism, a blessing and a curse. We both learned the hard way. I have a TT bearing issue right now too — not as intractable as yours, but it's a direct-drive, I have to take a lot of things apart just to get at it, and might screw it up 'cause it's complex. It's working, but there's sludge in there, I know it, and I should clean it out, it'll work better, like when it was new...

But it's working fine so I'm leaving it alone. If it stops working, I'll blame myself then... not now. If we don't learn from our mistakes, what were they for?
 
mdye - that's what I did with mine. I left it alone because it works well and still spins down for more than a minute when it shuts off. I don't recall the exact numbers but I tested it that way and decided it was better than good enough so I left well enough alone. I did drip some oil down the shaft well. I was absorbed so, again - left well enough alone. I love this table and I think the build quality of these and quality overall is near TD124 territory. These are hidden gems in the idler world. I have a couple variations of the 68 series. One with a GA-12 arm and another with the GA-15 arm. Both work well but have proprietary headshells that are worth their weight in gold since they are not going to be easily replaced. Good luck with yours.
 
What did you use to get it apart? Looks like the bottom unscrews. Pliers? Did you do it without any damage. Love to see more pictures of this. Top of the shaft/well. Bottom of the spindle. I see a circlip on the spindle. Assume that comes apart and you lubricate that?
 
What did you use to get it apart? Looks like the bottom unscrews. Pliers? Did you do it without any damage. Love to see more pictures of this. Top of the shaft/well. Bottom of the spindle. I see a circlip on the spindle. Assume that comes apart and you lubricate that?


P58Hbearing (1).jpg

The P58H bearing is different from the OP's P68H. The bottom thrust pad is threaded and gives limited adjustment to platter height. Not much force was needed to remove it. I just used my fingers. At worse, you'll need a screw driver. The spindle comes out from the bottom and the cir-clip is there to prevent it from being pulled from the top.

IMG_7438.jpg

38531582850_e10dbc1f1b_c.jpg

Neat P58H
 
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Does it feel "springy" when you try to pull the spindle out, or is it more like a hard stop? If it's springy then it could simply be the oil holding it in. As you're pulling, you're creating a vacuum at the bottom of the well. I played around with a smaller, much lower grade consumer TT bearing once and even that thing was a bugger to pull apart, simply because air can't get past the oil into the well.

I don't consider myself a perfectionist but using the bearing as is would drive me nuts. I would need to know for sure it's clean and filled with fresh oil.
 
There is some springy, vertical movement of the spindle within the shaft, but when you pull up on the spindle it feels like a hard stop at its most vertical point. Feels like a cir-clip or something that prevents it from going any further.

Would love to get the housing apart so that I could get it clean, but the risk seems too great at the moment.
 
Maybe a stupid suggestion but can it be a locking mechanism by alignment. That is if you turn the spindle to a specific location it will release?
 
If it feels springy, I'd say that's the vacuum from the oil in the bearing. On my DIY bearing, it takes at least a couple minutes to remove the shaft from the bearing, and just as much time to reinsert it. If it moves up and stops, it likely has a cir-clip, and comes out the bottom. I would be tempted to bolt it back to the top plate, and put a pliers on the very bottom. Bolting it to the top plate will hold the top of the bearing with no damage. If you grip the very bottom of the bearing with a pliers should not collapse the bearing wall, because it's solid across the bottom. Just go easy, and use a small pair of pliers. One other idea for gripping the bottom without damage, is to wrap a piece of emery cloth around the bottom section (again, try to stay low where it's solid across the bottom). Pinch the emery paper onto he bottom with a vice grip, Then push your vice grip in the direction of loosening. This binds the emery paper and applied even force all the way around the bottom cap, No point contact pressure like pliers. I have done this with success on other delicate things. I typically use emery paper around 150 or 180 grit.

One other thought, this might be left hand thread. Right hand threads would potentially unscrew with the rotation of the platter. If it doesn't move with the old righty tighty lefty loosey, try going the other way.

Keep us posted, I want to see inside that bearing.

Onebean
 
When you get this sorted I would appreciate some pictures. I've never heath of or seen a Neat TT.
 
Bolting to the top plate and attempting turn that screw cap, if that is indeed what it is, would seem to make sense, but I think that's asking for trouble too. The 3 mounting holes are too large which allows the housing to move a few mm if the mounting bolts are not on tight. I think the amount of force from using pliers on it would cause stripping or damage to the top plate. I may think about mounting the spindle housing to a piece of wood for a tighter hold instead of to the top plate.

Will post some picture once my new motor mounts show up and I can put the table back together. The one I have came with a GA-15 tonearm, which looks interesting. The GA-15 manual says it's pivot to spindle mounting distance is 245 - 250mm, however the stock armboard for the P-68H table seems to be approximately 225mm (based on a quick measurement). Was it common back in the day for manufactures to ignore recommended mounting distances of their own products?
 
One thing that has always annoyed me about the NEAT P-68H is the lack of a dust cover. The strobe area really gets filled with dust and debris. After years of keeping the TT in an enclosure like a stereo center, I decided to buy a custom made acrylic dust cover. This particular TT has been in our family since the mid or late 1950's, so it's one that I'll always have at least on display, although it does work great.

After looking into a half-dozen companies, I chose JMK Display, Inc (http://www.jmkdisplays.com) and they did not disappoint! The pictures show their cover. My contact there, Jay, said he kept my order information including the dimensions. It's amazing how a new dust cover can make a 60+ year old turntable look almost new. The edges are polished smooth so I probably don't need to add felt to the base, but I still might.

I can post more pictures and provide dimensions if anyone wants them.
 

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One thing that has always annoyed me about the NEAT P-68H is the lack of a dust cover. The strobe area really gets filled with dust and debris. After years of keeping the TT in an enclosure like a stereo center, I decided to buy a custom made acrylic dust cover. This particular TT has been in our family since the mid or late 1950's, so it's one that I'll always have at least on display, although it does work great.

After looking into a half-dozen companies, I chose JMK Display, Inc (http://www.jmkdisplays.com) and they did not disappoint! The pictures show their cover. My contact there, Jay, said he kept my order information including the dimensions. It's amazing how a new dust cover can make a 60+ year old turntable look almost new. The edges are polished smooth so I probably don't need to add felt to the base, but I still might.

I can post more pictures and provide dimensions if anyone wants them.

Nice!

JVC turntable next to the NEAT?
 
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