Pursuing great digital on the bleeding edge

[Billfort]

Now that I’ve spent a few weeks with this new set-up, I thought I’d post some thoughts – particularly on the SOtM sMS-100 I got from www.audioconnections.ca – the Canadian distributor Sonore put me in touch with.

The sMS-100 is a simple, lean, DLNA renderer that only does 1 thing – stream music via USB - and it seems, does it very well once sorted. I like that it’s hard wired via Ethernet, has an external power supply (providing options) and is not a bad-ass tweaked PC – the more I learn about tweaking PCs to feed DACs, the more I don’t want to go down that sink-hole. It’s pretty close to a plug-in dedicated audio DLNA streaming appliance that lets you avoid the computer geek side of this and just get to playing music accept for…

Jriver>sMS was a challenge to get configured but with a few network changes, firmware upgrades and a lot of help from Jesus at Sonore and Trevor at Audio Connections, it seems to have stabilized and now streams all formats up to 2xDSD. Occasionally, the whole thing will lock up but lately, it’s been trouble free and problems seem to be mostly related to the JRiver music server PC and remote control of that PC – the SMS seems solid.

I’m not sure if (up to) DSD128 is possible with all of the light-weight linux based streaming appliances like the Pi, CuBox, beaglebone etc., or if they can interface with Jriver’s DLNA implementation, but I’m really seeing the wisdom of this approach. A lot of ‘ifs’ to consider but they might prove to be a cheaper route to doing this (if you can figure out how to build and configure them, if they can play all the formats you want, if you are happy with player options, if you can find help when you need it etc.). For me, paying a little extra to be close out of the box and to have the support I had available was well worth it.

Another software option I’d like to investigate is Signalyst’s HQPlayer which seems built around the concept of streaming everything as DSD128 and is supported by the sMS-100 in Network Audio Adapter mode. I gave up on HQPlayer in the past after a quick trial a while back as I think this product needs more computer power than my PC has to do it’s on-the-fly conversion, but since Jriver doesn’t seem capable of working in this mode (when using DLNA), I will try it again.

Jriver now runs on the PC in another room, I remote control it with an app on a phone and the SMS does its thing completely silently in the listening room – simple, clean and configured only for audio. I select music using the great Jriver interfaces and press play – nice and simple. As complicated as it gets is switching sources between the AN and Concero DAC on my pre-amp if I want a different taste on redbook, maybe changing configuration a bit on the Concero remote, but that’s it.

The external power supply of sMS has proven to be a nice benefit and the fact that the Concero is USB powered means it might be stepping up right along with the sMS when I upgrade the PS. Replacing the wall-wart with a bench style linear/regulated supply made for a nice improvement overall that was a little surprising considering how cheap a supply like this is on the used market. Current requirements for these lean devices is low so even with some headroom it’s pretty easy to find dead quiet (fanless) and much better performance than you’d get with any ATX style switching supply that would end up in a PC.

 

[Billfort]

I have heard differences with the DACs I’ve used when fed with different CD player/transports, computers & laptops and that certainly continues here, and in a good way with this latest mix.

The sMS-100 out of the box seemed to bring along a little more detail and a sense of ease to both DACs, out-doing my previous best USB DAC source – a Win7 laptop. They started to sound a little smoother and more natural – more ‘analog’ to me, which is a very good thing.

The addition of the linear power supply made for a little more of the good stuff the sMS-100 brought along; the image is a more precise, has more depth and detail seems to come from a darker background. Pretty cool and especially surprising with good redbook recordings – I’ve never heard some of them come across this good before and the Concero even gives the AN a better run for its money now – maybe power supplies matter more than I thought in DACs. DSD is just fantastic too and I’m sometimes hearing it best some of my vinyl where I have multiple formats to compare.

Lots of surprises; things my logical brain say shouldn’t matter seem to, little things are adding up and digital is sounding fantastic and good enough that I’m reveling in its convenience and consistency instead of obsessing about what is missing. I’m spending more time just listening to all this available material that I often wrote-off in the past, and being wowed by what the new hi-res formats have to offer. I sure spend a lot less time in front of the record cleaning machine performing that little ritual these days.

Next up for opening my eyes to possibilities that don’t make sense should probably be USB cables – no way can they make a difference!

 

[RichPA]

Thanks for the observations, Bill. One of these days, I'm sure I'll follow you into hi-res land.

 

[Billfort]

The deeper I sink, the better it gets.

I haven’t done anything with USB cables yet but have started to investigate Signalyst HQPlayer and wow – there is good stuff down this path.

The Bad;

I had trouble even figuring out how to start the thing in Network Audio Adapter mode (but I feel like an idiot now that I know).

Even though I narrowed it down to only one output mode – converting everything to DSD128 - there is a dizzying array of options for filters and upsampling schemes which I haven’t even begun to understand or try.

All these options are really only there if you have some serious computer balls to run them as many configurations are very CPU and memory heavy – and I lack those balls (computer upgrades looming ahead…). I have however found some settings that let me do what I want – output everything as DSD128 – I just lack some options when it comes to ‘how’ the upsampling is done.

No remote control apps for this one – I have to use TeamViewer on a laptop or tablet in the music room to drive the player PC in the other room. Still nice to have that noisy thing elsewhere but a proper remote is a hell of lot nicer than Teamviewer.

A few hours in and I STILL can’t figure out how to move files from the Library to playlist window in HQPlayer! I’m probably just an idiot and missing some basic step but this interface is NOT Jriver refined and simple and I’m thinking something can’t be working right – it shouldn’t be THIS difficult.

I’m actually using Windows Explorer to find albums & tracks, then just dragging and dropping them into the HQPlayer playlist window. Ridiculous, but it works without a hitch. I could use some other software to create playlists (maybe even Jriver) and dump the results into HQPlayer which seems crazy to me at this point but then there is ‘The Good’.

The Good;

Music played with this software sounds amazing! DSD64 files streamed as DSD128 is a VERY good thing with whatever Signalyst is doing with this software. Not apples-to-apples as Jriver can’t upscale DSD64>DSD128 in DLNA mode (and I believe even goes through a PCM stage to do it) but this sounds much better than on-the-fly conversion did on Jriver.

PCM to DSD128 is extremely good – maybe even better than the AudioNote overall, and I love that dac in this sMS>Concero as SPDIF converter setup. I truly can’t believe how good some PCM sounds converted to DSD128 with this software.

The Concero HD seems a very good 2xDSD dac. Apparently feeding it DSD let's it work in a leaner way that bypasses some stages needed for PCM...I don't understand the details but doing the heavy-lifting outside the dac seems a good thing here. I really don't miss that dead hi-end Sony SACD player anymore.

I'm CPU challenged now in the other room but this just makes sense – as Signalyst puts it;

“Processing is performed by the player application and the processed data is then asynchronously streamed over network to a very lightweight network audio adapter interfacing to the DAC. Asynchronous FIFO provides maximum isolation between processing and audio reproduction.”

Ethernet connection to a lean player that only does audio, powered by a clean linear power supply that also feeds the dac. I like it as it seems to flat-out work.

This whole thing is surprisingly similar to what I went through with low-power SETs. Insane, impractical, full of compromises and ridiculed by the masses but that doesn 't matter much – it just sounds bloody good. I'll work through the warts and come up with agreeable compromises just like I did with those flea amps because what I'm hearing here is worth it and what this hobby is all about for me.

 

[Billfort]

Tried another wrinkle tonight and man, is this getting exciting.

I have The Cowboy Junkies, The Trinity Session on vinyl and love it so never bothered to get it on CD, even though it was originally recorded digitally so might have been great in that format.

Now that I have this new digital angle going I figured I'd give it a try so bought a used CD & ripped it to wav in Jriver to be played back using all the above. I've been reading about an even more 'out-there' approach to redbook where you upconvert to PCM 24/352.8 offline, then use HQPlayer to convert on-the-fly to DSD128. Sounds strange but the theory seems to be to make the DSD conversion easier during real-time conversion on playing which I already know I love when HQPlayer is doing the crunching for the Concero.

The results are stunning - liquid & smooth with an immersive soundstage that I didn't think this recording had to this degree - and I already thought it was damn good on vinyl. I just sat down for quick listen but turned out the lights and listened to whole thing through like it was the first time - just mesmerizing.

I am loving this.

 

[iamjaymo]

Just am seeing this thread now...going to re-read. I think you're on to something here.

My buddy just purchased the Sonore to mimic his old Squeezebox. Will get at least a first impressions review tomorrow.


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[Billfort]

The last thing tried - going through the interim step of offline conversion to PCM 24/352.8 - seems a step too far into crazy territory for me. I really think all the system and process changes I tried before this are what matters and playing 16/44.1 wav rips through HQPlayer to an NAA and DSD128 DAC is where the 'special' is happening.

Going to do some more critical listening to the 2 methods this weekend but I'm finding it tough - that Junkies album last night had me turning off the 'anal-ysis' view and just enjoying music.

 

[michaelhigh]

Following this with interest, Bill. I'm sure there will be turnkey systems for what you're chasing in the next few years. I think I'll wait, but very interested to hear more about your experiences.

Waiting for turnkey here, too. Good to see our more adventurous players blazing the trail. Thank you for your time and effort, as well as many others. It's what got me into computer audio in the first place, which is now an everyday part of my listening regimen.

For now it's PCM, but the DSD bug will eventually catch me as PCM did. I'm slow to innovate, but relatively quick to glom on to a big new discovery... :yes:

 

[BadassBob]

My buddy just purchased the Sonore to mimic his old Squeezebox. Will get at least a first impressions review tomorrow.

The Sonore, while nice, can be replicated at home. LMS has supported DSD streaming for awhile now, as long as one was running the nightly builds and the Squeezelite software music player. Logitech Media Server and Squeezelite are part of Vortexbox, which makes up the server/client end of the Sonore units.

 

[Bigerik]

The Sonore, while nice, can be replicated at home. LMS has supported DSD streaming for awhile now, as long as one was running the nightly builds and the Squeezelite software music player. Logitech Media Server and Squeezelite are part of Vortexbox, which makes up the server/client end of the Sonore units.

Wow. I have no idea what any of that means!

 

[Bigerik]

The last thing tried - going through the interim step of offline conversion to PCM 24/352.8 - seems a step too far into crazy territory for me. I really think all the system and process changes I tried before this are what matters and playing 16/44.1 wav rips through HQPlayer to an NAA and DSD128 DAC is where the 'special' is happening.

Going to do some more critical listening to the 2 methods this weekend but I'm finding it tough - that Junkies album last night had me turning off the 'anal-ysis' view and just enjoying music.

Ok, now I am getting anxious to listen to it. When is the invite coming, Bill?

(Even though I know it can't sound better then regular 16/44.1 anyway. )

 

[BadassBob]

Wow. I have no idea what any of that means!

That's the general consensus . In all seriousness, it's great fun getting down to the software level. You can make your own magic happen. I need to make a trip across the Detroit River and sample Bill's system one of these days. His makes me drool the most out of all of them here :yes:

 

[Billfort]

Thanks Bob! You are welcome any time and Erik, let's talk and set up an evening – maybe around the local Jazz&Blues fest in a few weeks?

I know the SMS-100 (a review can be seen here) is 'just' a Pogoplug E02 circuit board running a version of Linux in a pretty case and as mentioned in that review, could probably be diy'ed, hacked and cracked to work as it does for less bucks. Since the power-supply is external, you can also just do as I did and pick up a good lab grade linear power supply used – makes for a pretty cost-effective package.

For me though, it's about what this thing can do with HQPlayer crunching the numbers at the other end of the network and running Signalyst's NAA software in the listening room – this was a big step up from Jriver feeding the DAC direct or even the SMS as a upnp renderer. It is also about the stellar support I received from the Canadian distributor for the SMS-100, Jesus at Sonore and Jussi at Signalyst and for me, that is invaluable and hard to put a price on. The SMS-100 is pretty damn close to plug-and-play now, I'm getting used to HQPlayer and the HQPlayer's NAA software is a simple menu selection in the SMS-100's web interface - it just works from there. This stuff is pretty much ready for prime-time and help is an email, phone call or remote desktop session away.

The SMS-100 is about $450, HQPlayer is $200, the power supply was maybe $70 and I already had a decent computer in the other room and the network needed to make it work.The Concero HD adds another $850 so I'm all in here for about $1600 – which is a LOT less than my vinyl setup and it's honestly putting it to shame at times, using reliable source material I can grab on the cheap.

A great option in my system and SO much music to explore now that plain old redbook sounds so good.

 

[BadassBob]

Thanks Bob! You are welcome any time and Erik, let's talk and set up an evening – maybe around the local Jazz&Blues fest in a few weeks?

I'm due to renew my license, I will grab an enhanced license so I can cross the border without a passport

 

[Billfort]

There you go! I think the problem is getting back into the US and I know for us it's passport only so we all keep them current - even the kids since they where babies.

 

[olson_jr]

Going to do some more critical listening to the 2 methods this weekend but I'm finding it tough - that Junkies album last night had me turning off the 'anal-ysis' view and just enjoying music.

And isn't that what is all about? :thmbsp:

 

[Art K.]

Hmm, very interesting. Hold on to those CD's as you never know what is lurking inside!!! Nice report.

 

[Billfort]

Very true Art - I have gone through a lot of changes in my system over the years but what I've learned to never do, is give up on and purge music because it's not in the right 'format'. I still pull out 40yr old records I haven't listened too since they were new (and maybe dismissed) but sit amazed at the great music locked in those grooves - the lp didn't change, but my system sure did.

Vinyl does it best for me but DSD done in this way seems to bring the things I love about analog to the digital world. I often felt that way about SACD (and am glad I bought all those SACDs) but now these pieces are allowing me to enjoy those old CDs I dismissed (but kept) like I never thought possible. Pretty cool.

 

[stoutblock]

I have been following these developments for some time now. The geeks are finally answering the questions many of us have been asking for several years now. Why is there not a simple, high quality and smart Ethernet to USB converter? A simple device able to be placed near a USB DAC and your audio system has been missing from the available options for way too long. I was beginning to think it was a conspiracy as it is too simple.

Thanks to the guys over at SOtM for blazing the trail!

Now they need to get the price down...

 

[Billfort]

The last thing tried - going through the interim step of offline conversion to PCM 24/352.8 - seems a step too far into crazy territory for me. I really think all the system and process changes I tried before this are what matters and playing 16/44.1 wav rips through HQPlayer to an NAA and DSD128 DAC is where the 'special' is happening.

Going to do some more critical listening to the 2 methods this weekend but I'm finding it tough - that Junkies album last night had me turning off the 'anal-ysis' view and just enjoying music.

Meh...maybe a step too far over the edge. They are really close but you know, I think I prefer going straight from 16/44.1 wav to DSD128 in one step - seems like there is a little more immediacy and detail there. Maybe adding another layer of processing (in JRiver) is hurting and it could be that it's best to let HQPlayer do it's thing straight-up from the raw wav rip. I'm really starting to think HQPlayer is the real star here that is letting all the pieces play so nice in the end.

Since DSD128 is the endgame, it's also nice that the 500MB file is sounding better/the same as the 6GB file.