Record Cleaning: Developing the Best Possible Methods

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Thanks DOC! l'll see how I feel in the AM! :) This is actually an older formula from a post I read long ago. Interesting thing about these formulas even the packaged one, is I never read anything about long term testing. At my age though short term is fair enough. My Photoflo is probably dated by now all 99.9% that is left after cleaning 1500 records. The only reason I used Lysol it was the disinfecting part. Some of the records I find are pretty rough to say the least.
 
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Yes. pH is a measure of the concentration of H+ ions so the effect of dilution is easily calculated, especially since there are no buffering agents in just water and alcohol. pH is on a logarithmic scale so a ten fold dilution of pH 1 stock will essentially be around pH 2 and a hundred fold pH 3. This is still very acidic. So what is your dilution factor?
Well Vince let me get the beakers out and see if I can come up with the answer for you :D

Seriously My alcohol & water mix is 1 Gallon of distilled water minus 8 oz which I add 8 oz of 91% isopropyl alcohol to. Then I use a 10 oz plastic bottle which I add sorry I really don't have a beaker 4 or 5 drops of the jet dry to then add the mix to the top.

Help me with the math Mr. Wizard! I'm probably destroying my records aren't i? Although it seems to work really well as I use a shop vac system to vacuum it. :cool:
 
The only reason I used Lysol it was the disinfecting part. Some of the records I find are pretty rough to say the least.
Ok, but alcohol alone is a great disinfectant. In fact, that is the active ingredient in the spray form of Lysol we are used to (ethanol). I would bet those old records are rough due to multiple contaminants, and that microbes are a minor part of the problem.
 
You can't do much better physically than ultrasonic cleaning. You should still watch the detergent you use though, for the reasons already mentioned as well as their foaming properties. The devices are typically cost prohibitive however for an average user. I am not trying to cover devices (and open up another can of worms), just typical wash solution ingredients.
But you can use the best solution in the world and damage records by the method and application. My thoughts are the least the groove are touched physicaly and the record handled the better one is even with what you might call harmful as a solution.
 
Well Vince let me get the beakers out and see if I can come up with the answer for you :D

Seriously My alcohol & water mix is 1 Gallon of distilled water minus 8 oz which I add 8 oz of 91% isopropyl alcohol to. Then I use a 10 oz plastic bottle which I add sorry I really don't have a beaker 4 or 5 drops of the jet dry to then add the mix to the top.

Help me with the math Mr. Wizard! I'm probably destroying my records aren't i? Although it seems to work really well as I use a shop vac system to vacuum it. :cool:
So let's reasonably estimate and round off and say your ketchup bottle is around 300 ml and your 5 drops is about 0.3 ml. This is a 1000 fold dilution so your pH likely goes from 1 to 4. This is still acidic. For comparison, your teeth are very tough, but dental damage can occur below pH 5 and you've likely seen experimental results of Coke (ph ~3.5) on teeth. Rough example, but I'm trying to get something you can relate to.
 
But you can use the best solution in the world and damage records by the method and application. My thoughts are the least the groove are touched physicaly and the record handled the better one is even with what you might call harmful as a solution.
Indeed. I can't argue with that!
 
Thinking Out Loud, Part II: to help the surfactant mix with water, how about a "coupler", possibly 2-butoxyethanol?
 
So let's reasonably estimate and round off and say your ketchup bottle is around 300 ml and your 5 drops is about 0.3 ml. This is a 1000 fold dilution so your pH likely goes from 1 to 4. This is still acidic.

Damn it I knew it. Ok looks like I'll give that stuff on Amazon a try. Maybe I'll buy a beaker to mix it in :D Then it's just distilled and a little alcohol as per the recipe from earlier in the thread. Got it. Has there been a recipe for dummies conversion posted yet? Like How much of the soap mixture for a gallon of distilled water and alcohol? If so sorry for asking again I'll go re read through again.

Seriously thanks for taking the time to help me get it right
:beerchug:
 
Indeed. I can't argue with that!
Of course not :biggrin:

I Ultrasonic in a 10L tank, 2gal distilled water two drops photo flow, two drops dish soap. and about 3oz of 90% alcohol, @ 45c and drip dry....

I really can eliminate the soap as the alcohol will do a little degreasing.

Oh I don't listen to people online:naughty:
 
I Ultrasonic in a 10L tank, 2gal distilled water two drops photo flow, two drops dish soap. and about 3oz of 90% alcohol, @ 45c and drip dry....

At those low concentrations, it's likely the ultrasonic disruption does most of the work and I wouldn't change much if you are not experiencing any static issues. Methods employing large dilution factors and strong mechanical disruption are hard to beat.
 
Thinking Out Loud, Part II: to help the surfactant mix with water, how about a "coupler", possibly 2-butoxyethanol?
Interesting idea...but I'll let you be the one to tell wrbear he has to search out and buy yet another ingredient! I know they use this in products like Simple Green, but don't think it is really necessary in our application. I've never experimented with it.
 
At those low concentrations, it's likely the ultrasonic disruption does most of the work and I wouldn't change much if you are not experiencing any static issues. Methods employing large dilution factors and strong mechanical disruption are hard to beat.
Well the best thing with ultrasonic cleaning is the expansion and contraction, it pulls every bit of static out of the record.
 
Interesting idea...but I'll let you be the one to tell wrbear he has to search out and buy yet another ingredient! I know they use this in products like Simple Green, but don't think it is really necessary in our application. I've never experimented with it.
Says the guy who's already telling people to buy several hard-to-finds and hard-to-mixes. Interesting response to a helpful suggestion. Anyway, I got the idea from this little group of people who have experimented with it. And as you say, it's not hard to find in normal stores.
 
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Vince1- Thanks for another great thread!

Glad to know that there's not a short shelf life on Tergitol.

You mentioned that refrigeration caused cloudiness. Is there a way to get s-9 back to clear? (Asking for a friend. ;-)
 
I have used Dawn (and more than just a drop in a bunch of water) for well over 30 years and the records I cleaned with it are hunky-dory.

Theories are nice but experience and results trump them.

Doug
 
Just to add a little something into the "mix" here (see what I did there). Not sure how many times most of you deep clean your records. I will probably clean them this way once they enter my home. I'm taking care of them in a controlled environment vs the places they came from, if bought used. I don't see a need to clean them heavily more than that for me. I handle and store them with care and don't drink/eat and drive. The solutions I use are more than likely going to be used once (at my age). I then lightly clean them on the table with a good store bought product. Not sure what others do.

As far as Lysol I was just looking at the percentage (touted) of bacteria it addressed. Some of the used record finds are pretty dirty. Then.....I found this just now....

"We would recommend that one wipe is applied in one application to one surface, and then discarded," Williams said. "This is in an attempt to prevent the transfer of bacteria to different surfaces."

Not sure if the vacuum wand has this effect.......Somebody save me!!!!!!
 
Vince1- Thanks for another great thread!
Glad to know that there's not a short shelf life on Tergitol.
You mentioned that refrigeration caused cloudiness. Is there a way to get s-9 back to clear? (Asking for a friend. ;-)
Gentle heating should bring it back. Bring the container to room temperature, then run it under hot water while swirling.
 
I have used Dawn (and more than just a drop in a bunch of water) for well over 30 years and the records I cleaned with it are hunky-dory.
Theories are nice but experience and results trump them.
Doug

Nobody is saying this detergent doesn't work. I'm just saying you can do better with very little effort. If you aren't experiencing any issues with static using your method, then great...you've somehow beaten the odds. Keep on trucking.
 
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