Record Cleaning: Developing the Best Possible Methods

[Ciel Udbjørg]

Static? I use a (or used…) a ZeroStat anti-static gun on my LPs. When cleaning with a carbon fibre brush, they get horribly charged, but a good zap with the gun kills the static. When I pull a record out of its sleeve, I hold it up to the tip of my nose. If it’s charged, the teensy weensy hair on the very tip of your nose will feel that. So if the record is electric, I zap it. Works like a tee!
As for cleaning, I have used dishwashing soap & running warm water (living in a soft water district (Oslo). After washing, i spun the water off (having the record on a knitting needle) & leaving to dry on the dish rack.
I have tried the wood glue trick on a "throwaway" disc (a very worn single w/ The Rolling Stones…), and it came off, but I haven’t tried pakying yet (on an ancient Philips that also does 78s…). Now it seems it might not not be such a good idea, but I figure once won’t kill a disc… Or?

 

[homebrew]

Just a reminder from the US CDC: In order for a quat disinfectant to be fully effective, the surface has to remain wet for 10 minutes. How long are you leaving your disinfectant/sanitizing on the record? As for the ingredients in the various commercial products, search for the MSDS (or SDS). Any potentially hazardous ingredients must be listed on the safety data sheet.

 

[ETLS]

I respect everyones DIY formulas but is there any good pre-made solutions that you folks can recommend that do the job?

Bartertown is one of the best investments one could make.

 

[gbandera08]

I've long had a ZeroStat and it works well if you use it properly (slowly, avoiding trigger clicks, etc.). A leather platter mat also helps and I've found it far better than felt, but these are useful at time of playing. However, surely it makes sense to make charge removal part of the cleaning cycle itself, the use static free sleeves so you only have to reach for the gun when / if charge builds after playing?

Dish soap generally leaves a residue, and the mineral deposits in tap water means the rinse doesn't solve it for me. Each to their own, but I get the phys / chem of US cleaning and as I have to use distilled water anyway it is not a lot more hassle than a rinse tank. My remaining challenge though is the solution as to be effective it needs to break the surface tension of the distilled water. Again if I'm mixing a solution to do this then it seems a no-brainer to add the other elements to achieve better results / additional benefits...

 

[T68]

Well, I finally might be onto finding Triton here in Sweden ! Wasn't that hard once I remembered that you can filter on only Swedish pages in Google search ( doh!).
I actually found a company here in my home town that sells Triton X-100!
They seem to carry two different triton products:
- A 100ml bottle with 50% concentrate with 50% Triton X-100 and 50% Propan-2-ol (is this same as isopropanol?)
- A 1000ml bottle with a washing solution mix with <1 percent Triton X-100 and the rest is water

So which of these should I use for my record cleaning solution and which other ingridents do you suggest?

If I use the stronger stuff I assume I need to dilute with destilled water and isopropanol. Do I also need a wetting agent like detergent or ilfotol?
If I use the ready made washing stuff, just add isopropanol?

Then a totally different question regarding this. I plan to make a wand for vacuming the records when cleaning. You who clean this way, do you use different wands for vacuming the cleaning solution and the rinse afterwards? Or do you use the same?

Any input is much appreciated!

 

[T68]

So it wasn't unobtainium in Sweden after all (but darn close to it). But finally I got the Triton X-100!
Unfortunately I am not at liberty to disclose any information of where, how and how much it cost. Have to protect my source ...
My source calls it 100% Triton but the label says 50% Triton and 50% Propan-2-ol.
So as I posted above, how much of this stuff for 1000ml cleaning solution? 10ml should mean 0.5 percent strength if I do the math right?

 

[Thunderbox]

So it wasn't unobtainium in Sweden after all (but darn close to it). But finally I got the Triton X-100!
Unfortunately I am not at liberty to disclose any information of where, how and how much it cost. Have to protect my source ...
My source calls it 100% Triton but the label says 50% Triton and 50% Propan-2-ol.
So as I posted above, how much of this stuff for 1000ml cleaning solution? 10ml should mean 0.5 percent strength if I do the math right?
View attachment 1389371

I would tell you but it's a secret and I am not at liberty to tell you..

 

[T68]

Haha, you got me there! Touché!

 

[Thunderbox]

Haha, you got me there! Touché!

All in good fun.

 

[Tom6to1]

Just a reminder from the US CDC: In order for a quat disinfectant to be fully effective, the surface has to remain wet for 10 minutes. How long are you leaving your disinfectant/sanitizing on the record? As for the ingredients in the various commercial products, search for the MSDS (or SDS). Any potentially hazardous ingredients must be listed on the safety data sheet.

But I expect that is because the USCDC (US Center for Disease Control) is interested in the anti-bacterial properties of the quat, whereas for record cleaning my interest in using quats is for the anti-static properties. I expect the anti-static effect takes very little time at all. Can anyone with more knowledge than I have (not a chemist) comment?

 

[Alan G.]

I clean via Record Doctor and often wonder how long to leave the cleaning fluid on (the formula with the quat) before vacuuming. Mostly it’s on for maybe 10-15 seconds. After that no static problems.

 

[ETLS]

I've done the quick clean with paint pad, vacuum wand, and distilled water rinse. No static problem even with a quick clean. All of my records (for the record) have undergone a 10 minute ultrasonic cleaning beforehand.

 

[T68]

First try with my Triton x-100 brew on a thrift shop Bowie album.
Used a paint pad and a diy vacuum wand on a converted lazy Susan.
Hopefully fewer scary monsters in the groves after this.

 

[phantomrebel]

But I expect that is because the USCDC (US Center for Disease Control) is interested in the anti-bacterial properties of the quat, whereas for record cleaning my interest in using quats is for the anti-static properties. I expect the anti-static effect takes very little time at all. Can anyone with more knowledge than I have (not a chemist) comment?

Removal of static charge occurs instantaneously, even with plain water. The purpose of the quat is to provide long-term static protection. Increases in time or temperature during cleaning is to allow for better solubilization of contaminants in the detergent (similar to soaking a dirty pan in warm soapy water).

I respect everyones DIY formulas but is there any good pre-made solutions that you folks can recommend that do the job?

This thread is about making your own that is better than anything you could buy (kind of like a thread on a chefs group discussing the best soufflé recipe). The fact is that most pre-made solutions are simple detergent formulations that don't even contain an anti-stat. Yes, there are a few that now do, but even then, you are stuck with one formulation with little ability to adjust individual ingredients for specific applications. There are many other threads on commercial solutions if you search around.

...I am no chemist, but it looks to be weaker than Hepistat, with the composition detailed as 1%-5% on the COSHH datasheets (where as Hepistat runs to 8.7%) so I suspect a little more would be needed (I'll approximate the ratios if I have to, but if there are any chemists reading this it would be really useful to have an informed comparison of the two products in terms of ingredients, and a suggested ratio for Selgiene if it is a good substitute.
My other concern given that my USC is heated is the use of ethanol / alchohol due to the flash point. Does anyone have experiences of solutions without them? I have read that they add little to the cleaning process, and are more a drying agent? If so would Ilford Ilfotol and Triton-X100 alone produce the results needed?

Your ignoring the other quat compounds in these mixes. Hepastat is a mix containing almost 22% quat and the Selgiene (which looks promising) is 2-10% quat. Both also contain non-ionic detergent (Triton-like alcohol ethoxylates), with 6% in the Hepastat and 1-5% in the Selgiene. It could be used by itself (at 1:1000 dilution for example) and likely be quite effective.

 

[mhjmhjones]

Anyone know if I can use tergitol in a Spin Clean?

 

[MannyE]

Anyone know if I can use tergitol in a Spin Clean?

As long as it doesn't react with the plastic, you can use anything you want.

 

[MannyE]

thrift shop Bowie album.

View attachment 1391337

View attachment 1391338

This is the exceptional information! I wish I could find a Bowie album in a thrift!

 

[phantomrebel]

Anyone know if I can use tergitol in a Spin Clean?

This has been covered here many times. You can, but these systems are designed for solutions containing a flocculant that helps settle and gather the removed contaminants to the bottom of the tank. You could make your own by adding alum (aluminum sulfate), but you are better off using the manufacturers solution or ditching the device and using an RCM or ultrasonic cleaner so you aren't grinding the removed debris back into the record.

 

[theophile]

See? We told you were doing it wrong!

 

[T68]

Maybe this has been coberec in this massive thread and I've missed it. Sorry if so. But: if I skip rinse after vacuuming the cleaning solution off, is this better to keep the anti static effect of the Triton x100 on the vinyl?