Time Windows are here, unimpressed so far, some issues too

[DaveElton]

Just relating my own experience with my TW 1A's here , as Mark Hardy said they NEED room, and are somewhat finicky about placement. I ended up with mine about 22" from the rear wall and about 18" or so away from the side walls, this seemed to be the magic spot in my room with what is available to me. They will go low, but will not "thump" Bass timbre is always correct on these However, they are not "low-level-resolution" listening speakers. To come into their own, they need to be driven a bit, and thus did not fit in my current man cave, as I have to often listen at lower levels. Splended imaging speakers, and totaly non-fatiguing but detailed. Mine are current in storage awaiting future use IHMO only of course, In my room, they do not work as well as my 901 Series VI, however given they slightest chance, the TW's would easily be my primary or second set of go-too speakers

 

[dr*audio]

Pull the woofer out and look on the back for a part number.

 

[Committed]

Pull the woofer out and look on the back for a part number.

#'s on the back of woofer are 4846SD and 575123

It's blown, it was just transmitting sound from within the cabinet. Help with finding a suitable replacement would be much appreciated.

Btw that is some nasty glue they use took half the wood off the cabinet with it.

 

[dr*audio]

Apparently the woofers were made by DCM. No longer available. You will either have to get them rebuilt (GordonW may be able to do it) or use the Thiel and Small parameters of the woofer to find a suitable replacement. The parameters are in this thread:
http://audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=152004

 

[Committed]

I'm going to order a replacement from Parts Express for the time being, not anything pricey just something similar in specs with good reviews. I may replace it later.

Anyhow, I assume this is a 6 1/2" woofer correct?

 

[dr*audio]

Yep, 6 1/2".

 

[js1138]

You might Google the auction site for peerless 6.5 inch woofer.

Also Audax.

Also DCM woofer.

 

[Copa1934]

Ok so I had some time tonight to give a good listen and I found out why they didn't sound good with just one hooked up, it's because the one I hooked up has a bad driver. The upper left woof on it has about 1/4 or so the output of it's mate. You can physically see the difference in movement and when you put your ear next to it it's obviously barely working. The fact that it's working some seems strange to me. What could cause that?

Nevertheless, they made Neko Case sound absolutely awesome tonight! Man I love her voice. I moved them to 14' apart and sat about 16' away and I take back everything negative I said, I think I'm going to like these.

So are these little woofs hard to find? I've got some bookshelf JBL's and KLH's that have similar sized drivers, would it be criminal to swap with one of those? Or order a similar replacement new? That's assuming it's not something fixable.

There are those, not necessarily purists, who frown on replacing drivers with non oem drivers. Oh well, tough I say. I have some Celestion DL10's that my son (young at the time) managed to get a hold of a knife (we never figured that one out, those who have/had children know the challenge) and stabbed one of the speakers. Damaged the face, dented the tweeter protective grill (but not the tweeter) and cut a large opening into the woofer. Only once have I spotted the correct replacement only to lose a bidding war. Since then I replaced both with JBL 127a woofers. Honestly they seem to sound better in the bottom end with no obvious change in the rest of the frequency range.

Some people will swear on a Bible that nothing works as well as original. I've proven that wrong without question, and Celestion are not scrappy speakers to be sure. Best part, the JBL's were used simply because they were the only woofers (of many) that I already had and fit perfectly, and as a bonus made the speakers sound better.

So, with that I say, swap them out. If you come across another original you can always put them back to original. My only beef is not butchering speakers, like cutting up baffles and other such things when the speakers are in fine condition. Beaters? Heck, do what ever pleases you.

I've heard a lot of good things about the DCM's, and it sounds like you've confirmed it.

Congrats! Freebies like that are far and few between!

 

[stereofanboy]

How the hell did you get that woofer loose? I ask because I need to replace a tweeter and I just can't get it out.

 

[dr*audio]

How the hell did you get that woofer loose? I ask because I need to replace a tweeter and I just can't get it out.

The glue is a tar-like substance. I have a special tool made out of a crappy screwdriver I bent, like a crowbar. Start at one end and work around a little at a time. You may have to dig a small dent in the baffle to get it started.

 

[dr*audio]

Regarding replacements, as long as the T&S parameters match the original, the frequency response is the same and the sensitivity is the same, the sound should not change. Sometimes you can even improve the performance. I found a nice MCM woofer that is a good match for the EPI 100, and it has a rubber surround so it won't rot. It has better bass extension than the original.

 

[Copa1934]

The glue is a tar-like substance. I have a special tool made out of a crappy screwdriver I bent, like a crowbar. Start at one end and work around a little at a time. You may have to dig a small dent in the baffle to get it started.

What about heat? If it's a tar like substance it should soften up pretty quick with a hair dryer and as long as it's not left too long shouldn't do any damage to the driver or cabinet. Something I've used successfully on speakers and other "things" with similar adhesives.

Just a thought.

 

[Andyman]

It's like some sort of silicone from Hell,
DCM may make some nice sounding speakers, but they are the most user unfriendly speakers i have ever had to work one and that includes TimeFrames and TimePieces.

True 1st class PITAs...:yes:

 

[Committed]

It's like some sort of silicone from Hell,
DCM may make some nice sounding speakers, but they are the most user unfriendly speakers i have ever had to work one and that includes TimeFrames and TimePieces.

True 1st class PITAs...:yes:

Tell me about it, it was a royal pain. I used a small screwdriver handled pry bar. First I cut around it with a utility knife and then it was just a matter of prying the living crap out of it. In hindsight, I should've used my heat gun to soften up that adhesive from hell since just prying it out took a good bit of the particle board with it. I don't know how you would remove a tweeter without breaking it to pieces.

Here, look at what it did to the cabinet

 

[Blue Shadow]

I needed to get into a TW 1 to find out what was rattling loose inside. I opted to pull a tweeter as it has much less holding it in. Pretty easy after digging out most of the cement. Then the stuffing, damn near did not come out of the opening there was so much, all above the woofer. Found the part, a chunk of aluminum square stock that was supposed to be the core of an inductor. Glued it back in place and all good.

 

[lasminit2]

I used to sell the TW's back in the early '80's. Mhardyman is right on the money with his excellent post.

The TW's do have plenty of bass. They were designed to use themselves as stands, so getting them off the floor will probably reduce the bass in most rooms. Three feet out from the walls is good, although they really love "room to breathe" so try even further out if it is convenient. Also, we liked to start by spacing them 2/3 as far apart as they are away from your main listening spot. They are a remarkably balanced speaker, and they image beautifully. I can't think of a better speaker to help you to recover from Uber Loudness Syndrome (ULS). :thmbsp:

Oh, It is true that the caps might be shot, or close to it.

 

[dr*audio]

I believe I tried heat to soften the glue and it didn't work, but feel free to try it.

 

[lukiedog]

I thought these were a mirrored pair, are they possibly not matched? Are the serial numbers consecutive? One is a left and the other the right depending on whethere the number is even or odd, but I don't recall which is which.

 

[Blue Shadow]

The TW1 is not a mirror imaged speaker.

 

[Committed]

Party at my place tonight! Got my replacement driver in today from Parts Express, damn those guys are fast. Popped it in the cab and through on some tunes and all I can say is Wow, these TW's sound amazing! I now know the meaning to all those descriptive adjectives; soundstage, imaging and all that stuff. First time I've had speakers that totally disappear.

I spread them out a bit more, 4' or so off the back walls and maybe 5' off the sides. They are about 15' apart, 16" off the floor and I'm listening from about 20' away and it's fricken killer. They totally display the band in front of you and I was blown away by where sounds were coming from, that and the detail was amazing, and I take back what I said about no bass. The bass is accurate and tight, not overbearing but just right.

Last night I had one JVC hooked up along with one of the TW's since one was still missing a driver. The JVC sounded boomy and muddled compared to the TW. Now that both TW's are running there's no comparison, I've been schooled as far as what good sound really is. Happy camper here, very happy! Free beer tonight if you're in the U.P. of MI.

eidt it add: These things like power! They took everything my Sansui amp(80 wpc) could put out and wanted more (now I want a bigger amp lol). Not the greatest low level listening speaker but I do have some large Advents on B if I want to listen low.