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Wood Glue as Vinyl Cleaner

Discussion in 'Turntables' started by Mopic5, Feb 7, 2007.

  1. Bob E.

    Bob E. Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    507
    Location:
    Santa Clara, CA
    I think the guy that thought this up must have gotten the idea after watching his wife wax her, uh, legs. Interesting to read about, but I'm not going anywhere near my vinyl with glue! Discwasher II is good enough for me.

    --Bob
     

     

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  2. REDone

    REDone Super Member

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    1,310
    Very interesting method

    Could you give a link to the discussion on the Europe site ?
    We have brand names & products floating around here not available in UK
     
  3. Mopic5

    Mopic5 Super Member

    Messages:
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    Location:
    Ann Arbor
    Hi Outlawmws,

    Your right, it is PVA with the A standing for acetate. I should take more care when typing these chemicals in. And jmather's post of his findings on this principle last winter, points to the genesis of all this. Apparently the Euroboys quickly discovered that the "disc peel" product was PVA glue with a hefty mark-up. Buying 200 ml containers of wood glue at "the pound" store or by the gallon at lumber supply stores proved much more economical. It seems they also migrated to wood glue over the "disc peel" product because it was less runny and gave a better peel - but not having used the "commercial" product I really can't say for sure.
    An English chemist who tried out wood glue on his vinyl - endorsed the process as safe and effective, while cautioning against not leaving it on too long after it is dry because:
    1- The glue will become less pliable and more difficult to remove in one piece.
    2- The long term curing of the glue on the vinyl could lead to leeching of plasticides from the record to the glue.
    I believe it was in this late-stage curing process that he used the term "acrylate" - to connote a chemical change through curing - though I'm not sure.

    This was in answer to someone's question about the possibility of storing their LPs in wood glue cacoons, only to crack them open when ready for pristine play.

    - Mario
     
  4. rulerboyz

    rulerboyz AK Member

    Messages:
    2,458
    Location:
    Cornwall Ontario Canada

    Reminds me a lot of the following:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5oFftxwjJmQ
     
  5. Combwork

    Combwork Super Member

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    Brechin, Scotland
     
  6. ampegdan

    ampegdan Super Member

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    This one went all over my wood shop today, got a few of us scratchin our greys. Consensus is, don't water the glue down as it can leave a film that would be difficult to remove. It wouldn't come off in one piece, either.
    Don't know about the idea about using "expired glue". I'd prefer the predictable results of new glue for something like this. Easy for me to say-we consume the stuff in 5 gal. buckets like Pooh's "hunny pots". I daresay one or two of us might get daring enough late at night to try this..
    Yeah, Gorilla Glue wouldn't be the best idea for this now would it? OK, now everybody go save a Village People album or something for posterity.
     

     

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  7. jasong

    jasong Music enthusiast

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    The sure fire teller would be to look at the surface with a microscope after the cleaning. Maybe even leave a patch uncleaned to compare.
     
  8. rulerboyz

    rulerboyz AK Member

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    Not sure if anyone covered it here yet or not. How do you take off the layer of glue without scratching the record?
     
  9. ozmoid

    ozmoid Lunatic Member

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    13,320
    The glue should just peel up. The first post detailed adding "tabs" to the edge of the record to give you a handle for starting the peel. It was also suggested to add a layer of paper as the glue begins to dry to help it come off in one piece.

    I'll be trying this on something expendable first. :yes:
     
  10. rulerboyz

    rulerboyz AK Member

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    2,458
    Location:
    Cornwall Ontario Canada
    I figured it out. Use something that is thin plastic, like a plastic ruler or maybe a credit card, and dig into the glue (holding your spatula near horizontal) and lift up. This should pry up enough to get one started. Although it is well over twelve hours now that I have this on, and it still isn't completely transparent, so I must wait some more. :boring:
     
  11. Arkay

    Arkay Lunatic Member

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    Location:
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    I think this looks worth a try, although I won't be in any hurry to test it on my finest, favorite or most valuable LPs, just in case. :no: Could be a good first step for some of those really grungy but not-too-scratched flea market bargains. :yes:

    Might be good to do comparison testing on one LP: glue-clean one side, VPI clean the other. Glue-clean half of one side and leave the other half uncleaned. Then compare the results.

    I think even if I adopt this method for really dirty records, I will follow it up with a VPI cleaning, though, just in case there are any broken-off/residual bits of glue compound that might be left stuck in the grooves. Wouldn't want them --or any residual thin chemical film-- gumming up the stylus.

    Nice to have another potentially useful "tweak trick" in the bag; thanks for posting this! :thmbsp:
     

     

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  12. rulerboyz

    rulerboyz AK Member

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    I don't think I will trying this again. After 16 hours of drying, some glue still stuck to the vinyl. The record sounds worse than before. I put it on for just a few seconds to test and then quickly put the record away.
     
  13. totem

    totem AK Subscriber Subscriber

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    excessive glue perhaps??
     
  14. outlawmws

    outlawmws On the Run

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    What specific brand of glue did you use, and how old was it?
     
  15. rulerboyz

    rulerboyz AK Member

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    It says on the bottle "Gorilla Glue" :stupid: ...just kidding

    No it says: Elmer's Carpenter's Glue.

    "A fast grabbing, fast-setting, super-strenght glue formulated especially for vinyl record enthusiasts with way too much time on their hands, who are searching for for a novel way to clean their vinyl records."


    Warning: The above statement has not been evaluated for accuracy by the FDA.

    There's no best before date that I can tell. I did not wait long enough for the record to become completely transparent, I think that might have been the key.
     
  16. ozmoid

    ozmoid Lunatic Member

    Messages:
    13,320
    :nono: Patience, grasshopper. If the glue does not completely cure, it will leave a thin residue (and possibly some thicker areas) on the vinyl. Get it back out, give it another coat, and put it in a warm, dry room.

    Then go listen to some records or something and forget about it for a while. :music:
     

     

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  17. Mopic5

    Mopic5 Super Member

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    Well said, Ozmoid,
    Rulerboyz...
    It certainly shouldn't have taken 18 hours - must have been too much glue or a questionable ingredients in the Elmer’s.

    Listen, this method of vinyl cleaning takes some patience and practice (including a reapplication if undried glue is present after peel). Compare it to soldering or a closer anology - baking a cake – give it some time, because it’s a skill – just like aligning a cart. That said, this obviously is not for everybody. For me, the results were most convincing - so much so that I will attempt to rescue some old treasured LPs that I thought lost to gunk. Maybe some of them are already damaged in the grooves – but I’ll give it a go.

    - Mario
     
  18. jeffn

    jeffn Mid-Fi Crisis

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    What temperature is it in your part of the world?
     
  19. rulerboyz

    rulerboyz AK Member

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    Location:
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    About 68-70 F inside. 14 F outside. Pretty dry too.
     
  20. jeffn

    jeffn Mid-Fi Crisis

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