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sx-1250 power amp SMOKED help

installing transistors correctly

Well I'm at the replacement of q1-q11 and want to make sure I am positioning these correctly. I know they look the same but I read somewhere that just because the flat spot goes the same direction doesn't mean the new part is the same. I've read a post somewhere on Audiokarma on this but can't find it now. Thanks again guys!


You NEVER use the original transistor layout for the replacement, you use the replacement transistor's data sheet downloaded from the Mouser link for the transistor, and the symbol that is silk screened onto the board.

I have lost count of the number of times I and others have said this.

every Mouser transistor has a data sheet available for download.... download them and look them up. then install as per the symbol printed on the pc board at that location.
never ever use the original transistor to determine how the replacement will go in.

from an earlier post:



First you need to learn about what the three transistor leads are about, and identifying which is which and where it goes according to the symbol. Then you will see that my parts list include lead arrangements - which assume the transistor lettering (and flat) are facing you and the leads are facing down, then go left to right.

Q13 2sc938 150v 0.05a 0.6w
512-KSC2383YTA to-92L ecb 160v 1a .9w 50mhz 160-320hfe $0.17


attachment.php


The big TO-220's with the metal mounting plate are hard to reverse, but the smaller ones are, but my specified replacements are usually E C B as a rule of thumb BUT we ALWAYS CHECK...

But you really should start here and follow ALL the links...

http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=331932&page=5

here's a preview, DO YOU SEE these symbols on the boards you are working on?:


80px-BJT_PNP_symbol.svg.png


80px-BJT_NPN_symbol.svg.png


e is always the arrow on one angled line (direction can be out (npn) or in (pnp) towards the base)
b is always the flat line the other two lines come out if at an angle
c is always the angled line without the arrow

letters can be smudged or illegible, while the symbols are hard to mistake and pretty language independent
pioneer doesn't use letters, if there is a symbol. sometimes in a linear hole arrangement, there is only an 'e'.... with no room for a symbol.



attachment.php



-----------------------------------------------------

now a quick lesson on installing a small transistor in a traditional triangular hole arrangement with a symbol printed in the center of the triangle

1. find the LEFTmost lead on the package and identify it's designation (emitter? base? collector?)
2. look at the symbol on the board, find the corresponding hole
3. insert that lead into that hole
4. find the RIGHTmost lead on the package and identify it's designation (emitter? base? collector?)
5. look at the symbol on the board, find the corresponding hole
6. insert that lead into that hole
7. the center lead will now need to bent forward or back to go into the leftover hole.

DON'T THINK "WHERE IS THE FLAT FACING"
think
"outside leads" and THEIR holes...

this one's ecb....
attachment.php


and two transistor layouts, ebc and ecb with the same triangular target hole arrangement
attachment.php
well, you do need to get the parts, first.... :D

and when ordering the transistors, mouser has links to the transistor's data sheets, DOWNLOAD the data sheets!!! THEY are your BEST guide as to the correct lead connections for THAT particular transistor.

Do you understand the transistor symbol? enough to identify the emitter, base and collector from it? Because most boards (Pioneer) have the symbol printed on it, with holes around it, and it is orientated so there is an emitter hole, a base hole and a collector hole. And obviously, only the transistor's emitter goes into the emitter hole, the base into the base's hole and the collector into the collector's hole. IF you want it to work... :D

oh, and by the way, the symbol usually DOESN'T have the E, C and B letters ON on it... :stupid:
there are two flavors,
pnp: arrow pointing in, 2sa,2sb, ksa, ksb part number prefixes
npn: arrow pointing out, 2sc,2sd,ksc,ksd part number prefixes

attachment.php


hint: if "rotating" it in your mind is a puzzler, orient it in the hole this way(transistor hole arrangements are usually triangular):

choose the leftmost lead, use the data sheet to identify it... for example it is the emitter
put it in the emitter hole

choose the rightmost lead, use the data sheet to identify it... for example it is the base
find the base hole, rotate the transistor line of leads around the inserted leftmost lead to point at the base hole
put the rightmost (base) lead in the base hole.

the THIRD hole is now either in front of or behind the transistor, in this example the collector is "left over"
bend the center lead forward or back to go into the hole.

easy...

notice that this example had the lead order of emitter, collector, base which is a common lead arrangement

that means that:

looking at the transistor, with the leads pointing DOWN, and the flat part (or lettering in the case of some zetex transistors) FACING YOU
going from left to right has the lead order of emitter, collector, base


attachment.php
 
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I just saw this reply. I found your posting and have installed the transistors correctly! thanks a bunch

still waiting on the stv3-h diodes tracking says they are in NY!
 
Hello guys, I finally finished rebuilding the boards. Still waiting on the stv3-h diodes however. Before I put the power boards in, Is there anything I can adjust first? I thought I read somewhere that I had to get the voltages set before connecting the power boards. Germany is a long ways away. I can't beleive it's taking this long!!!!! any way, thanks again!
 
There's a procedure to check and set the +-65v regulated supplies. It's in the manual. You can leave the amp boards out of the set to do this check. The test pins are located on the stabilizer board along with the two VR trimmers you may need to set.
 
slightly off the subject but does anyone know where I can get a bass knob 50hz AAB-100 or ATB-051 Ferrite bar-antenna? The antenna is missing and the know is broke.

Oh and the string for the tuner
 
use parts.pioneerelectronics.com to find a list of donor units for both part numbers

AAB-100

450, 650, 750, 850, 950, 1050, 1250 and watch out, they are pricey...


ATB-051
this is just the 1250... I'll look around in the next few days... but it involves digging that I can't do right now.
 
well the diodes arrived today and I have sound! O.K> i followed the directions on setting the voltages on the power boards v1 and v2 Is there a special way to do this because for one I couldn't get the readings correct on the right side and the left side didn't seem to change when I adjusted them especially the vr1 I'm sure there has got to be something wrong I just don't know what? I made the adjustments with a 100 dim bulb test. would that make the difference? I decided to plug in my iPod and some speakers and I am listening to it now and am loving the sound! I still want to make it right however. I found a string and by the way. eBay! HOLY COW THIS THING SOUNDS GREAT even with crappy speakers. Oh in case you did't catch on I"M HAPPY!!!!!!!
 
Mark don't go crazy trying to find info on my previous post. I found another one you helped on with the same problems and that will do just fine. As far as the AAB-100 I have that what I need is the Part it goes on. One of the tabs broke off on me. I'm thinking it's going to be the pot?
 
Use the DBT to check the response of the idles. If they are good then to full house power. The idles will only adjust to 60mV's or so when on the DBT (100 watt bulb). You want 100mV's when on house power.
 
What is a good way to repair the wires that go from awg-041 to awm-089 that are wrapped around the terminal? Things are coming along good, This is a lot more work than I thought it would be. I'm learning a lot about electronics. I picked up a pair of old Bozak speakers and a Pilot tubed receiver I will be working on next.
 
Also I want to check all the voltages of the receiver, I am new at this and here is another learning curve. How do I know what pin is supposed to have what voltage? I know it probably tells you in the manual but I don't know what to look at. Thanks in advance guys.
 
The best way to reconnect the hook-up wires is to run a completely new wire from pin to pin using the original wire wrap method (OEM). This is the way I do it. Expensive for a one time event! You need to have the right stuff, tooling, wire and a need to use the equipment and supplies for other projects. Other than that; wrap the wire is well as you can a few turns around the post and solder using flux to secure a better connection. If it's a break in the middle, solder the twisted leads at the connection and cover the connection with the heat shrink (which you previously installed over the broken leads :D ). The hook-up wire is solid core, 20-22 gauge. Use this wire as anything will else will label you. :yes: Radio Shack may have this wire at the store. If you want to take it to the degree, I can supply you with the tooling vendors and wire suppliers if requested.
The voltages are listed in the Service Manual at the individual board pages. You will see the circuit voltages in the schematic near strategic points like near the transistors. Also located next to the numbered pins.
 
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Houston We have a problem.....
On AWR-106 I replaced Q1-Q13 with theses numbers
Q1: 863-MJE15032G
Q2: 512KSC2383YTA
Q3: 512-KSC1845FTA
Q4: 512-KSC2690AYS
Q5: 863-MJE15033G
Q6: 512-KSA1013YBU
Q7: 512-KSA992FBU
Q8: 512-KSA1220AYS
Q9: 863-MJE15032G
Q10: 512-KSC2383YTA
Q11: 512-KSC1845FTA
Q12: 863-MJE15032G
Q13: 512-KSC2383YTA
TO-220 MICAS

Also replaced diodes D1-D6 with theses numbers

D1: 512-1N5252B
D2: 512-1N4148
D3: 512-1N5252B
D4: 512-1N4148
D5: 512-1N5234B
D6: 512-1N4148

So, after replacing them I unplugged both power supplies,plugged in the stabilizer board AWR-106 and flipped the switch...(without dbt) I'm a dumb***. It blew a fuse. I pulled the board out and (plugged in the dbt) and flipped the switch again. It lights up and seemed ok. I then removed all the diodes I just replaced and tested and reinstalled the old ones which tested ok, Put it back in and flipped the switch (with dbt) the bulb goes full bright (100w bulb) so I turned it off. Obviously I goofed somewhere. It worked last night and was playing music just fine. I wanted to restore this receiver completely which is why I replaced the parts on this board. I did check all the transistors for correct placement.

I read somewhere about a list of parts that was wrong and was wondering if this is the one..... anyway I hope someone can help....

Thanks again guys.
 
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o.k. so i've made some learning mistakes. I am going to try a different approach, One that my ADD won't interfear with. Do any of you have ADD? I bet 80% of you do. Thats why we can do this stuff. I'm going to order all new parts for AWR-106 and the tuner and proceed with caution and patience. If someone has the latest list for these boards I would be very happy, In fact I would pay the subscription for you for a year to AK. I guess it's a way of saying "Thanks". Thanks again!
 
Sorry to hear about the board issue. You need to wait for assistance and directions before you jump ahead. Mark is the eyes for you when you are walking through the minefield. Follow instructions, post results then WAIT for further instructions. You will get the receiver running and when you do YOU can say "I did this".
 
MTF's list and it's good:

sx-1250,power,supply,stabilizer,ok,,,,,
sx-1250,awr-106,c1,220,80,cea,,220,100,647-UPW2A221MHD
sx-1250,awr-106,c2,220,80,cea,,220,100,647-UPW2A221MHD
sx-1250,awr-106,C5,47,35,cea,,47,35,647-UPW1V470MED
sx-1250,awr-106,C6,47,35,cea,,47,35,647-UPW1V470MED
sx-1250,awr-106,C7,22,50,cea,,22,50,647-UPW1H220MDD
sx-1250,awr-106,C8,22,50,cea,,22,50,647-UPW1H220MDD
sx-1250,awr-106,C9,100,35,cea,,100,50,647-UPW1H101MPD
sx-1250,awr-106,C10,100,35,cea,,100,50,647-UPW1H101MPD
sx-1250,awr-106,C11,47,80,cea,,47,100,647-UPW2A470MPD
sx-1250,awr-106,C12,47,80,cea,,47,100,647-UPW2A470MPD
sx-1250,awr-106,C13,1000,25,ceb,,1000,35,647-TVX1V102MCD
sx-1250,awr-106,C15,47,10,cea,,47,10,647-UPW1A470MDD6
sx-1250,awr-106,C16,22,10,cea,,22,10,647-UPW1A220MDD
sx-1250,awr-106,C17,220,16,cea,,220,25,647-UPW1E221MPD1TD
sx-1250,awr-106,C18,47,10,cea,,47,10,647-UPW1A470MDD6
sx-1250,awr-106,C19,47,10,cea,,47,10,647-UPW1A470MDD6
sx-1250,awr-106,q1,2sd313,pass +65,,,,,512-KSC2073TU
sx-1250,awr-106,q2,2sc869,darl,,,,,512-KSC2383YTA
sx-1250,awr-106,q3,2sc1318,err-amp,,,,,512-KSC1845FTA
sx-1250,awr-106,q4,2sc1384,pass +25,,,,,512-KSC2690AYS
sx-1250,awr-106,q5,2sb507,pass -65,,,,,512-KSA940TU
sx-1250,awr-106,q6,2sa628,darl,,,,,512-KSA1013YBU
sx-1250,awr-106,q7,2sa720,err-amp,,,,,512-KSA992FBU
sx-1250,awr-106,q8,2sa684,pass -25,,,,,512-KSA1220AYS
sx-1250,awr-106,q9,2sd325,pass +13,,,,,512-KSC2073TU
sx-1250,awr-106,q10,2sc945,darl,,,,,512-KSC2383YTA
sx-1250,awr-106,q11,2sc945,err-amp,,,,,512-KSC1845FTA
sx-1250,awr-106,q12,2sd325,pass +5.5 ,,,,,512-KSC2073TU
sx-1250,awr-106,q13,2sc945,darl,,,,,512-KSC2383YTA
sx-1250,awr-106,d1,wz-240,,,,,,512-1N5252B
sx-1250,awr-106,d3,wz-240,,,,,,512-1N5252B
sx-1250,awr-106,d5,wz-061,,,,,,512-1N5234B
sx-1250,awr-106,d2,1s2473,,,,,,512-1n4148
sx-1250,awr-106,d4,1s2473,,,,,,512-1n4148
sx-1250,awr-106,vr1,4.7k,1 turn,,,,,652-3386H-1-502LF
sx-1250,awr-106,vr2,4.7k,1 turn,,,,,652-3386H-1-502LF
sx-1250,awr-106,R13,680,2W mox,,,,,660-MO2C681J
sx-1250,awr-106,R14,1.5K,2W mox,,,,,660-MO2C152J
sx-1250,awr-106,R18,100,2W mox,,,,,660-MO2C101J
 
Good! don't plug in the amps in until you get the PS sorted!

Check out this Thread from "Mattsd".

http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=420950

It is my bible for the 1250. Compare his pictures with your board and keep looking for a self induced mistake. It's easy to put the 2690's and 1220's in wrong due to their block shape. Solder bridges and connections. Make sure you had the plastic Molex plugs installed correctly. Diodes and caps in the right direction.
I know you probably checked all of these suggestions but it was working. Look for something that could cause a dead short.

Did you change out the large filter caps?
 
Houston We have a problem.....
On AWR-106 I replaced Q1-Q13 with theses numbers
Q1: 863-MJE15032G
Q2: 512KSC2383YTA
Q3: 512-KSC1845FTA
Q4: 512-KSC2690AYS
Q5: 863-MJE15033G
Q6: 512-KSA1013YBU
Q7: 512-KSA992FBU
Q8: 512-KSA1220AYS
Q9: 863-MJE15032G
Q10: 512-KSC2383YTA
Q11: 512-KSC1845FTA

Q12: 863-MJE15032G
Q13: 512-KSC2383YTA
TO-220 MICAS

Also replaced diodes D1-D6 with theses numbers

D1: 512-1N5252B
D2: 512-1N4148
D3: 512-1N5252B
D4: 512-1N4148
D5: 512-1N5234B
D6: 512-1N4148

So, after replacing them I unplugged both power supplies,plugged in the stabilizer board AWR-106 and flipped the switch...(without dbt) I'm a dumb***. It blew a fuse. I pulled the board out and (plugged in the dbt) and flipped the switch again. It lights up and seemed ok. I then removed all the diodes I just replaced and tested and reinstalled the old ones which tested ok, Put it back in and flipped the switch (with dbt) the bulb goes full bright (100w bulb) so I turned it off. Obviously I goofed somewhere. It worked last night and was playing music just fine. I wanted to restore this receiver completely which is why I replaced the parts on this board. I did check all the transistors for correct placement.

I read somewhere about a list of parts that was wrong and was wondering if this is the one..... anyway I hope someone can help....

Thanks again guys.

The dim bulb tester should be bright first then go dim. This is a good sign that all was done correctly. If the dbt stays bright then you know there is a problem with that board. Then check your installed components for correct pin out. Caps for correct placement
then recheck using the data specs for each part.
 
As always thank you guys for the replies. Zebulon1, would you like me to pay for a year for you? I am a man of my word.
 
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