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Zilch's AK Design Collaborative - Econowave Speaker

Being "Econo," they are all a "bit rough," in my experience, especially in the area where the sprue was attached in the mold, which is cleaned up by hand during manufacture, usually by the worker removing them from the machine.

Even with the $200 apiece Geddes waveguides, he recommends smoothing and filling any anomalies using clay for the smoothest transition at the throat. I don't bother, generally. An aforementioned O-ring or gasket may help with this, as well.

A poster in another forum said he took one look and threw them in the trash. Hundreds of others have moved through and past this, of course.

[Persist, and the rewards will be forthcoming.... :) ]
 
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I'm happy if it's the "norm" actually. Happy to work them out. Can you tell from these pics if they are so?

dsc_4638.png


dsc_4639.png
 
They look like mine did. Take a couple swipes at it with a round file or some sandpaper to clean it up if you like.
 
GordonW said:
omg...

I just finished the high-power E-waves... which I'm calling the "Big Black"s (to distinguish them from the "Big Reds" and "Little Reds". Dual 15"s... top woofer is a custom-reconed JBL M1158A, bottom woofer is a custom-reconed B52 15". Dayton 6512 horn flare (same as PH612), and Selenium D2500Ti-ND. It's wired as a 2.5 way (bottom woofer bass only).

Well, I have to say... the Selenium D2500 lives up to the hype. The little bit of "tizziness" or "metallic texture" on the top of the D220Ti (15K-up region)? It's not there at all on the D2500. Neither is the tiny bit of "raspiness" on the bottom end (around 1.5KHz). Not a bit of histrionics, of any kind. Just SMOOOOOOTH. And detailed. This is, in fact, the best imaging and instrument "sonic texture" I've heard from ANY of the E-wave systems I've built myself, or heard elsewhere, so far.

I'm building up a pair of Z19 crossovers for a client to use with the DE250s and Altec 416s... I hopefully will get to hear this system after completion (he lives a ways away from here), so I can compare the treble quality of the DE250 and the D2500Ti. My gut instinct says the D2500 may well match or better it, from what I've heard of both of them to this point...

Nice thing, is that the extra sensitivity of the D2500, makes even higher-efficiency systems plausible. Even with a 99dB sensitivity woofer-section in the system I just finished (using the high-efficiency version of the crossover), the L-pad is still less than 2/3s of the way up. This combo should support 101dB woofers, easily... maybe even 102dB...

Regards,
Gordon.
Click to expand...

Very happy to hear that, re: 2500. The neo ring seems a better choice than a honkin' ceramic. A downside, however, was that unit consistency was very poor in the impedance domain. Took some real doing to get a well matched pair. I'll press them into service soon enough :)
 
badman said:
Very happy to hear that, re: 2500. The neo ring seems a better choice than a honkin' ceramic. A downside, however, was that unit consistency was very poor in the impedance domain. Took some real doing to get a well matched pair. I'll press them into service soon enough :)
Click to expand...

The good thing about the Ewave design, is that with the parallel resistor and the L-pad, impedance variations in the driver are "normalized out" to a great degree (i.e, the L-pad sort of "buffers" the crossover from the driver impedance a bit). I haven't had any problem with any of the Selenium drivers causing response problems, despite differences in Fs and the magnitude of the impedance peak at resonance...

Regards,
Gordon.
 
gainphile said:
I'm happy if it's the "norm" actually. Happy to work them out. Can you tell from these pics if they are so?

dsc_4638.png
Click to expand...

Looks pretty normal.

Also, BTW: With the brass-colored insert, that looks like the Pyle Pro version of the flare. Even if it's not from Pyle, I'd bet it was made by the same company that makes the Pyle PH612.

The JBL has no metal insert (plastic threads), and the Dayton/PE version has a zinc-colored (gray/silver) metal insert.

Regards,
Gordon.
 
Thanks!

The said Australian store (DJCity) in fact sells similar horns loke those of PE (e.g. those round WGs). I think they simply imported and relabled those.

In any case Antripodean is selling me his JBLs so I will compare and report once they arrive. I will measure both as well just for interest.

cheers!

:)
 
Hey Ewavers!

I just wanted to post that Im finally finished my 3 Detalite 2512 Ewaves for my front stage. Ive had them done for like 2-3 months but I left one waveguide without any dampening on the back thinking that I was going to run some tests and see if I could hear a difference with one with dampening on the back to one without, but I never did and with just switching them around I could hear something. So now all three have some fiberglass on the back of them. :thmbsp:

Here they are in in their new home. :D
Ewavesdone2.jpg

My stands are being built soon to replace what I have in there right now. lol

A outside shot of one
EWave5.jpg


And one to show the Duplicolor truck box liner
closeup2.jpg


Two more for my sides should be happening soon too

cheers boyz
 
Been planning to build the EconoWave "Deluxe" Kit. I see that QSC has now made their horn unavailable for our purpose. What would be the suggested replacement for the QSC horn?
 
If I "had" to build something right now, I'd use XT1086, but we're working on getting the 152i available again soon.

Contact your Parts Express sales representative so they know there is a real demand; they're our best hope for future availability right now.... :yes:
 
Thanks, I can hang on a while. I will give PE a call tomorrow. Does there seem to be any hope regarding PE producing or distributing the part?
 
I just got my new drivers in for my wedge surrounds.

P1010072.jpg


I am thinking 2x6.5" drivers per wedge with a horn overtop.

eWave_Wedge.jpg


I have two B&C 250's leftover from my main speaker build (don't ask) and was wondering if I should just pick up 2 more to make it an all B&C 250 theater or if going to the Selenium 2500Ti-Nd or the Celestion CD would be a comparable solution for less money?

I would like to go with the Pyle PH612 or equivalent horn to make these speakers smaller as they will serve 100% surround duty only.

Also...I need to figure out a crossover for this combination...either that or I just put in the standard crossover and see how they sound?

I am not looking for much thump from these...just clear and articulate surround reproduction.
 
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DE250 is bolt-on, whereas the standard eWaveguide is thread on. Go with the Celestion CDX1-1731 drivers.

Several members are working with those Klipsch 6.5" buyouts over on Tech Talk forum. What you've drawn should probably use them in 2.5 mode. Skywave's working on that over there, but there may be others with the same approach in a TMM alignment....
 
Zilch said:
DE250 is bolt-on, whereas the standard eWaveguide is thread on. Go with the Celestion CDX1-1731 drivers.

Several members are working with those Klipsch 6.5" buyouts over on Tech Talk forum. What you've drawn should probably use them in 2.5 mode. Skywave's working on that over there, but there may be others with the same approach in a TMM alignment....
Click to expand...

I know they are bolt-on....but they are just sitting in a box in my basement :)

Did anyone ever find a bolt-on equivalent to the QSC horns? I was having trouble finding them on the QSC parts website the other day.

Would the Celestion's be $80 better after filling out all 4 surrounds in lieu of the 2500Ti-Nd?

Can you direct me to a thread title at TechTalk? I scanned it really quick but I couldn't find one.

Thanks Zilch!
 
I need some tuning advice.

As you may recall, my friend Dell and I built him a pair of eWaves...see link.

http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showpost.php?p=4001756&postcount=11737

And at the time with freash new woofers, I thought they sounded a bit thin but would come around after break in.

I went up to see him last weekend and the eWave just don't sound that good AT ALL!

The compression driver is a B&C DE10

I had no measuring equipment but it was obvious that the high comp was way too high. The other issue was the L-pad was just barely turned and it was too much.

The best I can do to explain the sound is to say that when I put on Brian Braumburg playing only solo stand up bass, I turned up the l-pad around 1/4 to get the mids coming out of the horn to match with the woofer volume wise. When I put on full range music on, the highs nearly shattered my ears.

I think just bringing down the high comp would do it. So what should I change and to what value?

I used a 30ohm and 15ohm and .47uf cap to start with.

P.S., I also broke off the Shure 91 stylis on the Duel 1229 I gave him.....clumbzyyy
 
greg_mitch said:
Did anyone ever find a bolt-on equivalent to the QSC horns? I was having trouble finding them on the QSC parts website the other day.

Would the Celestion's be $80 better after filling out all 4 surrounds in lieu of the 2500Ti-Nd?

Can you direct me to a thread title at TechTalk?
Click to expand...
http://techtalk.parts-express.com/showthread.php?t=219975

http://techtalk.parts-express.com/showthread.php?t=219912

We are working to restore availability of the QSC 152i waveguides. Tell your Parts Express representative that you want/need them.

The Celestions are my current favorite over Seleniums at 2 kHz and above, their recommended minimum crossover frequency. I've crossed them at 2.1 kHz with the buyout 6.5s over there.... :yes:
 
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djnagle said:
I need some tuning advice.
Click to expand...
That's the standard eWave crossover, and it should balance easily with DQ-10 woofers, which are the same as in large Advents, basically, used with DE10 compression drivers.

What are those woofers, actually?

What did you do for the 12uF in the lowpass there? Is that a 10uF electrolytic in parallel with a 2uF film cap? A BIPOLAR electrolytic?

Put the correct 12uF MPP cap in there and see if it still sounds like ass....
 
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Q

1MOR said:
Thanks, I can hang on a while. I will give PE a call tomorrow. Does there seem to be any hope regarding PE producing or distributing the part?
Click to expand...

I wrote to Karl at PE about the QSC waveguide and pointed to the related thread on their techtalk forum. He said he was interested and asked if I had any drawings of it, I offered to lend him one of the horns I had as a model. No answer on that yet.

I think they are kind of busy right now (trying to bring to market a microphone product I designed for them, some production pains). With luck they may be able to get something out like the QSC guide in a while.
 
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