Gibsonian
Super Member
It's quite a bit more than that actually. The fully comp WOPL conversion takes "It" to a higher level in all of it's old good qualities, and this can both be measured and perceived, quite easily.
What power amps really have 'it?'
- Thread starter DonQuixote99
- Start date
It's quite a bit more than that actually. The fully comp WOPL conversion takes "It" to a higher level in all of it's old good qualities, and this can both be measured and perceived, quite easily.
eljr
Koyaanisqatsi
Superampman
AK Member
No one's mentioned the Brits, Acoustat TNT, Hafler 9500 series, the Ampzillas-especially GAS500, Yamaha MX10000, HK Citation XX, Citation 16, Bob Carver's Sunfire, the venerable Altec 9440, my own fav-LSR&D. They all have it in spades.
Blue Shadow
Waiting for Vintage Gear from this century
Really? Are you new here?
IT seems to be synergy between the speakers and amplifier. There are a number of instances where an IT amp just won't play with some speakers. We have read that the OP wants to drive AR-3a clones by Heath to the ideal IT sound. So instead of dumping all of our loved amps whether we own them or lust for them into the thread, knowing the amp plays well with the selected speakers might help. Don't forget the star rating system that has been presented.
With that said, I'm out. No experience with IT amps and 3a speakers and the amp I used with the AR-5 way back then is just 60wpc so it is out. When I had the AR-LST/2 here, the McCormack DNA-1 was fine but the speakers didn't thrill. I've heard 4 DNA-1 amps and only 1 of them had the IT in my opinion. If you want an uncolored amp, clean powerful and right, the Odyssey line is good amps but they might not have the 160 watt requirement without going to the top amp, in mono.
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There are bad amps, good amps, and great amps. Getting that "IT" sound is dependent on much more than the amp. I would find a good, well designed amplifier and go from there. As mentioned I love my Kenwood L-09M monoblocks. When they're paired with the KEF 105.1 and the Sony ES CD player there is more "IT" than I've ever had before. Change that source to high rez files on the iPod there's a little less "IT" but still plenty. Change that source again to a TT and there tons of "IT", just in a different form then the other sources. Change my speakers out to the ADS L1530s tons of "IT" only a little bit less than the KEFs. Throw in the Dynaco A50s and again less "IT" than the other speakers but still very good. I feel the A50s do better with the TT than the CD player and vise versa for the other two speakers. You talk about getting tight chest feeling bass. I get that in spades with these amps out of all of my speakers, but I move the ADS L1530s an additional 18" back and the bass becomes boomy and flubby.
I put all of this gear into another room and this could all be changed. Change my preamp and things could change. At least I known I have a good foundation with the amps and from there I can mold the sound in a way with different speakers, sources, room treatments, speaker placement, etc.
Dan
I put all of this gear into another room and this could all be changed. Change my preamp and things could change. At least I known I have a good foundation with the amps and from there I can mold the sound in a way with different speakers, sources, room treatments, speaker placement, etc.
Dan
Dunno if I've missed a post or a meeting, but is it easier to get "it" with a decent tube amp than solid state? Seems some fairly simple tube amps seem to get closer than tyical SS to me, and I love the no-hassle of solid state.
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Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk
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I have two QSC GX3 amps for my surround system and they sound great. Paid $300 each brand new. My experience is that pro audio equipment works great and is the best bargain new or used. Like everything else pro audio has profited from newer available technology and they have made good use of it. Lower the impedance of the load and it produces more power and is stable at 2 ohms. The QSC has both balanced and unbalanced inputs with XLR or RCA jacks and your choice of speaker connects along with mono mode and crossover points, if desired, and signal indicator, clip indication and soft protection against hard clipping. It's almost as though pro audio is a well kept secret in the home audio field. I'm sure Crowns are a fine choice too it's just that I'm familiar with QSC. These things deliver...for performance and reliability I wouldn't consider anything else.
BobbyBluz
Super Member
Personally based upon years of experience used Pro audio amps are my only choice. I'm a BGW guy but Crown and Crest are also very good. After doing some haggling last Fall I picked up 3 mint condition Crest FA901's for $94 each. Mid-90's vintage, USA made and stellar audio quality & power for more than 5X what I paid for them.
Loud & Clear
"Welcome To The Machine"
I Did A Lot Of Live Sound, For A Lot Of Years. I Used Crest, QSC, And BGW. I Was Absolutely Certain That BGW Could Not Be Beat. Then It Happened, I Had Rebuilt A BGW 250B, An SAE 2200, And Finally A Soundcraftsmen 2502. Now These Are All Comparable Amplifiers. Turns Out I Needed Room In My Shop, So I Took These Three Amplifiers & Racked Them In My Spare Rack Located Next To The System I Was Using In My Living Room (BGW's). That System Was Biamped At The Time. Well I Brought In My JBL L-300's For Something, And Decided While They Were There, I Just As Well Listen To The Amplifiers I Had Racked Earlier. And "Wups" The Soundcraftsmen Out Shined The BGW, And SAE By A Huge Margin... The Sonics Were SO Much Better. I Didn't Want It To Be So, But It Was. As I Knew For Certain The BGW Would Be King, It Had To Be. I Was Basing My Whole System Around The BGW Amplifiers. I Had Even Gone To Extensive Measures (time and money) To Obtain And Build The BGW's The Way I Wanted Them. Well, To Make A Long Story Short - I Run Soundcraftsmen Now... I Love The Chassis And Overall Build Quality Of The BGW Best, But For The Best Sound Quality By Far, Soundcraftsmen Stands Above The Rest. I Learned That The Hard Way... As Far As Crest, QSC, And Crown Go, I Wouldn't Have Anything Else In My Pro Audio Racks, But For Sound Quality There Whining Variable Speed Fans Etc... Just Do No Cut It In An Audiophile Situation... Just My Educated Opinion Of Course... 
I Did A Lot Of Live Sound, For A Lot Of Years. I Used Crest, QSC, And BGW. I Was Absolutely Certain That BGW Could Not Be Beat. Then It Happened, I Had Rebuilt A BGW 250B, An SAE 2200, And Finally A Soundcraftsmen 2502. Now These Are All Comparable Amplifiers. Turns Out I Needed Room In My Shop, So I Took These Three Amplifiers & Racked Them In My Spare Rack Located Next To The System I Was Using In My Living Room (BGW's). That System Was Biamped At The Time. Well I Brought In My JBL L-300's For Something, And Decided While They Were There, I Just As Well Listen To The Amplifiers I Had Racked Earlier. And "Wups" The Soundcraftsmen Out Shined The BGW, And SAE By A Huge Margin... The Sonics Were SO Much Better. I Didn't Want It To Be So, But It Was. As I Knew For Certain The BGW Would Be King, It Had To Be. I Was Basing My Whole System Around The BGW Amplifiers. I Had Even Gone To Extensive Measures (time and money) To Obtain And Build The BGW's The Way I Wanted Them. Well, To Make A Long Story Short - I Run Soundcraftsmen Now... I Love The Chassis And Overall Build Quality Of The BGW Best, But For The Best Sound Quality By Far, Soundcraftsmen Stands Above The Rest. I Learned That The Hard Way... As Far As Crest, QSC, And Crown Go, I Wouldn't Have Anything Else In My Pro Audio Racks, But For Sound Quality There Whining Variable Speed Fans Etc... Just Do No Cut It In An Audiophile Situation... Just My Educated Opinion Of Course...
I did that too a number of years back and had the same experience... not with Soundcraftsmen but others like Phase Linear and Sansui. We repaired audio mostly, sometimes installed or upgraded reinforcement systems, sometimes operate them... mostly repair though. I distinctly remember SAE and Crown having a 'harsh' sound compared to high powered home units and it set me against ever considering pro audio for home use.. amps like Peavey weren't even considered. That was then though and the comparisons I've done of late with current models using current technology has been a different experience. Still though, I have to believe that high power high end audio made for more domestic purposes has to have refinements that can be heard... I know that I am hard pressed to discern it. My speakers are Altec 19, JBL L220 and LBL L150. Also have stacked Advents and Infinity 5000s in another system.
The fans... yes, noisy.. the amps are behind glass so I don't hear them.
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Vintagegeek
Well-Known Member
I just picked up a Cinepro 1K2 and have spent time listening with it. A stellar amp with plenty of power. I have never heard a set of Maggie's sound so good. Pushed my MMG's to around 100+ db yesterday and there was plenty left in the amp to spare. Detailed, dynamic and great soundstage.
Ya know, in an important way, the OP is asking for something that doesn't exist.
Amps with tons of IT are well-known, highly prized... and not cheap.
Someone mentioned Threshold amps, almost all of which have a lot of IT, and almost all of which still carry premium prices. Prices of Adcom models with a lot of IT are higher than the lesser models, and the same is true even of McIntosh. I have an Audio Research D-400 MkII, which has gobs of IT... and which still carries a high price tag.
Can anyone think of an amp with IT that doesn't command a premium price?
Amps with tons of IT are well-known, highly prized... and not cheap.
Someone mentioned Threshold amps, almost all of which have a lot of IT, and almost all of which still carry premium prices. Prices of Adcom models with a lot of IT are higher than the lesser models, and the same is true even of McIntosh. I have an Audio Research D-400 MkII, which has gobs of IT... and which still carries a high price tag.
Can anyone think of an amp with IT that doesn't command a premium price?
Ya know, in an important way, the OP is asking for something that doesn't exist.
Amps with tons of IT are well-known, highly prized... and not cheap.
Someone mentioned Threshold amps, almost all of which have a lot of IT, and almost all of which still carry premium prices. Prices of Adcom models with a lot of IT are higher than the lesser models, and the same is true even of McIntosh. I have an Audio Research D-400 MkII, which has gobs of IT... and which still carries a high price tag.
OTOH, a Marantz 170DC has a fair amount of IT (not as much as a 250 or a 300DC), and you can pick one up for below $500. A 500 has tons of IT, but can't be had for cheap. Any of these will probably need a recap.
Can anyone think of other amps with IT that don't command a premium price, or require a restoration?
Amps with tons of IT are well-known, highly prized... and not cheap.
Someone mentioned Threshold amps, almost all of which have a lot of IT, and almost all of which still carry premium prices. Prices of Adcom models with a lot of IT are higher than the lesser models, and the same is true even of McIntosh. I have an Audio Research D-400 MkII, which has gobs of IT... and which still carries a high price tag.
OTOH, a Marantz 170DC has a fair amount of IT (not as much as a 250 or a 300DC), and you can pick one up for below $500. A 500 has tons of IT, but can't be had for cheap. Any of these will probably need a recap.
Can anyone think of other amps with IT that don't command a premium price, or require a restoration?
IT..is
A pair of MC501
But you don't get IT by droping nice amps into any old system. The whole food chain is important starting with Source > Quality Media > IC > Pre > IC > Amp >Cables > Speakers > Room Acoustics > Fram of Mind = IT
Heh... yeah, MC-501s have a ton of IT, and for that matter so do the 352, 602, 601, 452, 1201 and 1.2Kw... and none of them can be had for less than $3000, most are over $5000 and the big boys are over $10,000. Great amps, but not what the OP asked for!
