Finally, Full-Frame EVIL Camera

I hoped that this day would one day come along!

The Sony A7 and A7r are about to be released, and they are FULL FRAME (relative to 35mm film) mirrorless cameras with an OLED integrated viewfinder and focus-peaking for manual focus.

That checks everything on my list for a digital camera body that can take an adapter and finally, my beloved Canon FL lenses. I am so glad I kept them over the years! I am going to be selling off a lot of camera gear so that I can buy one of these (not cheap) camera bodies!

http://www.theverge.com/2013/10/14/4836792/sony-a7-a7r-full-frame-cameras-leak-photos



For me, this is huge. This will be the first full-frame digital camera that offers a digital eye-level viewfinder (not the LCD on the back), the ability to manually focus, and the ability to mount my Canon FD/FL lenses with an adapter and NOT require an image-degrading glass element between the lens and the sensor, nor have a crop-factor that turns a 50mm lens into a 75mm or a 100mm lens.

It's not going to be cheap. I will have to sell off a lot of my remaining stock of collectible cameras, but I don't care. It can all go away now. This is what I want (pending more information from Sony on the actual camera).

Happy days!

A quick question, what benefit do you gain other than a very small difference in body size when going mirrorless? I've never found anything that I personally consider worth the loss of a mirror, especially in a high quality camera.

It looks like a great camera regardless, though.

Taowolf51 said:

A quick question, what benefit do you gain other than a very small difference in body size when going mirrorless? I've never found anything that I personally consider worth the loss of a mirror, especially in a high quality camera.

It looks like a great camera regardless, though.

Click to expand...

I have never wanted a mirrorless camera. The benefit to consumers (other than me) is supposedly two-fold. One, reduction in size (most consumers are lazy) and two, you can frame and focus using the LCD on the back (most consumers are not photographers, they just wanna take a pitchur).

But a mirrorless camera offers me the ONE thing I wanted above all else, and that is the ability to use my old Canon FD/FL manual focus (film camera era) lenses again. The Canon FD mount is one of the shortest lens-to-film distances of all SLR cameras, and that means you cannot build an adapter for most digital cameras (and all digital full frame cameras) without a) optical correction lens or b) macro use only. I reject both options as unacceptable for me. I want that Canon lens goodness to interact directly with the camera sensor, no crop-factor (APS-C and 4/3 sized sensors) and no optical adapters in the way.

I could also put a Canon FD/FL lens on a Leica M9, but a) no eye-level viewfinder and b) WAY too much money for me.

So this looks like it works perfectly for what I want it for.

My favorite lens in the whole world is my Canon FL 55mm f/1.2. That is going to look SO good on this camera. Just imagining it now. Wow.

I'll tell you what. I had high expectations when I got my NEX-6 mirrorless from Sony this part Christmas.

I'll tell you another thing. It EXCEEDED all those expectations. The quality, using a <$20 adapter ring, of the photos using 1960's and 1970's vintage Minolta FC/FD lenses is absolutely outstanding.

I can't recommend these things highly enough, and I'm incredibly psyched about this latest announcement.

Imagine if they could make it multi-focus like a Lytro. That would be a wow!
(My first camera use was a fully manual Minolta SLR. I'm a lazy point-and-shooter now

xratedpez said:

I'll tell you what. I had high expectations when I got my NEX-6 mirrorless from Sony this part Christmas.

I'll tell you another thing. It EXCEEDED all those expectations. The quality, using a <$20 adapter ring, of the photos using 1960's and 1970's vintage Minolta FC/FD lenses is absolutely outstanding.

I can't recommend these things highly enough, and I'm incredibly psyched about this latest announcement.

Click to expand...

I was torn between the NEX-6 (and variants) and the Samsung NX-11; both are worthy and both would take a Canon FL mount adapter without optical insert and still achieve infinity focus. Only the crop-factor kept me on the sidelines (and my budget). Now I have no more excuses. I need to pile up some cheddar so I can afford one of these. I've still got a pile of 35mm and medium format cameras and lenses, worth less every day. Gotta move those things down the road.

http://www.eoshd.com/content/11296/...dium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed:+EOSHD+(EOSHD.com)

Just took this one yesterday. So many great images with this camera already.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/s224f7ppv5isaim/_DSC9599.JPG

xratedpez said:

Just took this one yesterday. So many great images with this camera already.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/s224f7ppv5isaim/_DSC9599.JPG

Click to expand...

Very nice! And the Minolta manual focus lenses were justifiably well-regarded; still great even by modern standards.

How do you tell the pioneers? They're the ones with the arrows in their backs. My luck with buying the first model of things has not been good. The camera sounds great, but I'd be waiting a year or so for rev. 2.0 :yes:

This is definitely a cool camera. I have a micro 4/3 and one of the main issues is the crop factor that affects the DOF. Of course, the crop factor could be considered a plus if you want to use something like a 200 f2.8 and get a very inexpensive 400mm f2.8 lens equivalent. I still prefer full frame for several reasons, though.

I am curious to see if they make very many small lenses that work with it. For me, a small camera offers very little benefit if I need to carry around heavy lenses, which is why I didn't buy an EOS M.

For you specific purposes, I think this is the perfect choice, though.

uofmtiger said:

This is definitely a cool camera. I have a micro 4/3 and one of the main issues is the crop factor that affects the DOF. Of course, the crop factor could be considered a plus if you want to use something like a 200 f2.8 and get a very inexpensive 400mm f2.8 lens equivalent. I still prefer full frame for several reasons, though.

I am curious to see if they make very many small lenses that work with it. For me, a small camera offers very little benefit if I need to carry around heavy lenses, which is why I didn't buy an EOS M.

Click to expand...

From what I've been reading, because it is the Sony E-mount and not the A-mount, it will physically mount all the NEX lenses. The end-user will have the option of either doing an in-camera crop or accepting heavy vignetting from the smaller image created by E-mount NEX lenses. Those are fairly small lenses, so I suppose a bunch of folks will want them for that, even though you lose the full-frame advantage.

For you specific purposes, I think this is the perfect choice, though.

Click to expand...

Yep. Not many people want to do do what I want to do, which is cool. A very small group of people wanted a 'digital Canon FD' for many years, but there was zero chance of it ever happening. This will be like the first realistic option.

I had flirted with the idea of messing with one of those one-way, no-going-back adapters made for the Sigma SD14 (I have one of those bodies), but ultimately decided against it. Glad I waited.

Wigwam Jones said:

I hoped that this day would one day come along!

Click to expand...

Which one do you plan on buying the The A7 (24 megapixel) or the A7R (36 megapixel).

Common features of A7 and A7r both cameras: -

A7 and A7r have focus peaking
eye tracking AF
Wifi and NFC
1/8000 shutter speed
both have tiltable screens

List of Upcoming Lenses from Sony:

Zeiss FE 24-70mm f/4.0 OSS
Sony G 28-70mm f/3.5-5.6
Zeiss FE 35mm f/2.8
Zeiss FE 55mm f/1.8
Zeiss FE 70-200mm f/4.0 OSS

hwirt said:

Which one do you plan on buying the The A7 (24 megapixel) or the A7R (36 megapixel).

Click to expand...

It looks to me as though they are identical except for pixel count and the anti-aliasing filter deletion on the A7r. That's a pretty steep price for just those two features, and I've never been one to believe that more megapixels is automatically better. I've sold photos for magazine covers that were 6MP, so I know this is overkill for my purposes for either one.

But anti-aliasing is supposedly a very nice feature.

I guess I will just have to see how this all shakes out. It's going to take me awhile to stack up that much cheddar, so I have time. I guess all things being equal, at the moment, I'd go with the A7 and forgo the extra MP and lack of AA filter of the A7r.

Taowolf51 said:

A quick question, what benefit do you gain other than a very small difference in body size when going mirrorless? I've never found anything that I personally consider worth the loss of a mirror, especially in a high quality camera.

It looks like a great camera regardless, though.

Click to expand...

Can had mirror-less slr's in the 1990's, but they lost a stop because of the technology needed to make a mirror-less film slr. The advantage is that nothing gets blacked-out while shooting, which sports and nature action shooters love. It is also quieter, which nature shooters - or those of us who shoot quiet live performances - need. Also, less moving parts, so they should last longer... and no slapping mirror to cause more camera shake at slow speeds.

Interesting. Thanks for the post.

Wiggy, if you aren't already familiar, you may find this site handy:

http://www.sonyalpharumors.com/

A fellow from Germany who spends far more time than he should tracking down Sony-related camera rumors on a daily basis. Also very up-front about his confidence in any particular rumor... he rates each one on a 5-point scale.

Otto

ofajen said:

Wiggy, if you aren't already familiar, you may find this site handy:

http://www.sonyalpharumors.com/

A fellow from Germany who spends far more time than he should tracking down Sony-related camera rumors on a daily basis. Also very up-front about his confidence in any particular rumor... he rates each one on a 5-point scale.

Otto

Click to expand...

Yes, I do follow it, but thanks for posting that link; others will no doubt find it useful as well!

Wigwam Jones said:

Yes, I do follow it, but thanks for posting that link; others will no doubt find it useful as well!

Click to expand...

I've been checking that site occasionally, more to get a sense for what the future will hold for Sony A-mount cameras like my A57.

I like what Sony is doing with the new FF bodies and high-end lenses, but it is all likely to remain more costly than I can justify.

I don't have a relevant body of high-end legacy lenses to liberate, so I content myself with a few of their good but cheap lenses for the APS-C format. I'm getting good photo results on a consistent basis, so my family will not see much sense in spending a lot more on cameras.

Otto

Very nice! I want one!

Sony Australia will stream the official rollout of the A7/A7r early tomorrow morning at 2:00 AM EDT. This link currently shows a countdown timer:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VfSrsqn3ESc



• A7 has 24 Megapixel sensor with Phase detection AF
• A7r has 36 Megapixel with no on sensor Phase detection and no Anti Aliasing filter for maximum sharpness
• A7 body costs $1698 and $1998 with 28-70mm f/3.5-5.6 OSS lens. A7r costs $2198 body only
• Both cameras have a fixed OLED EVF with 2,4 million dot resolution. It’s the same used by the Olympus E-M1
• AF speed is faster than the RX series.
• Takes SD cards and uses the NEX battery
• A7/A7r Body is weather sealed
• 1/8000 shutter speed
• Tiltable LCD screen
• Focus peaking
• Built-in Wifi and NFC
• Play memories Camera Apps
• The menu interface is the same as the RX series (and not the one used by NEX cameras)
• Optional vertical grip
• New LAEA Full Frame A to E-mount adapter
• Current NEX APS-C lenses will work in crop mode or Full Frame mode (with heavy vignetting or dark corners)