Fisher Consoles 1959-1965

I know it was likely outside the original intent but it would have been interesting to know what these sounded like with good mid range speakers of the day. (I know they did some testing with limited factory add on speakers)
I was wondering about that myself. But when you add the price of some halfway decent speakers to the price of a console you're starting to get up there into the price realm of the highly-rated component systems.

Also noted were the numerous DOA consoles. Makes one think about actual quality back in the good old days. Not saying things are better or worse now. Just noted the defect level seems to be rather high.
Many of these manufacturers were only in their first or second year of solid-state electronics. I don't think a lot of these products were really ready to hit the showroom quite yet. I wonder if the reputations of some of these companies weren't really damaged by their rush to get transistorized products on the market before they were ready. Perhaps this illustrates one of the weaknesses in the US electronics industry that gave overseas manufacturers their opportunity to break into the US market.

Fisher was surprisingly conservative with their introduction of solid-state technology. Avery was usually all about "firsts" but for some reason he held onto the tube technology for a lot longer than many of his rivals - and we thank him for that.
 
After reading recently that the 1940 and 1941 Philharmonics were rated best of the pre-war radio-phonograph 'combinations', as they were referred to back then; it was reassuring to see that Fisher's bottom-of-the-line P-290 Philharmonic 'console' was still upholding Avery's tradition of quality 25 years later:



Most of the machines were wanting in one or more important aspects of FM and AM radio performance (see table). Only two machines, the Fisher P-290W and the Zenith MM2606, combined good reception on FM and AM with a fairly good tone quality. Either may give the console shopper substantially what he is looking for. A third machine, the Masterwork M5024, was judged about equal to the first two in tone quality; moreover, the tone quality of its phonograph could be improved by substituting, for about $11, a different stylus for the one supplied, a change the owner can make in a few seconds. However, the Masterwork was judged inadequate in FM selectivity, a weakness that may be important in locations where stations are spaced close together on the dial.

For the two top-rated machines we bought the extension speakers offered by the manufacturers - the WS-1 for the Fisher ($49.50 per pair); the MR-102W for the Zenith ($59.50 per pair). The Fisher speakers (3-3/4x11-1/4x4-1/2 inches, with 15-foot wires) were judged to improve the stereo effect, but they added some shrillness to the tone quality. These speakers can’t be turned off while they are plugged in; there is no switch for them. The Zenith speakers (11-1/2x14x3-1/2 inches, with 26-foot wires also enhanced the stereo, and they did not detract from the original tone quality (though they didn’t make it any better). They have individual on-off switches at their backs. Thus, for a price, you can get better stereo along with fairly good tone quality and good radio reception from at least one of the tested consoles.



Defects and Bungled Repairs:

But choice of a satisfactory model is not the only problem facing a console buyer. If the machines we bought for testing are at all typical, the buyer stands a big chance of getting a defective sample. And if our experience with manufacturers’ authorized service firms in the New York City area is typical of what one would find in the rest of the country, he is likely to face nearly endless frustration when he tries to get a defective machine fixed under the manufacturer’s warranty.

In the Philco N1763MB certain transistors were extremely susceptible to overload and became damaged under laboratory test conditions, first in one sample, then in a second. It took the authorized repair shop from three to five weeks to install replacement transistors. After two such breakdowns, there was no time left to test the model for inclusion in this test.

The Electro-Home TR18M185 arrived with the receiver chassis broken away from its internal mountings. In a second sample the AM section was not operating. The authorized service shop did not have the needed replacement parts, and failed to get them during 15 weeks of waiting. Again, testing time ran out.

The Symphonic T-4CS98 had excessive distortion on FM. A second sample was totally inoperative. Once more, by the time repairs were done, there was no time to test the model.

The GE RC7630A, judged Not Acceptable because of excessive hum and rumble, was given to an authorized repair shop. Meanwhile, a second sample was bought and proved as bad as the first. Repairs to the first sample reduced the hum slightly, but not enough to change the Not Acceptable Rating.

Four more of our test samples, a Westinghouse M 1330, a Sears Silvertone 5071, a V-M 954, and an RCA VFT 44W, had crippling defects as delivered. A second sample of each of these models was properly operative and could be tested. But the first sample of the Westinghouse added to the score on bungled repairs: sent to an authorized shop, it came back still defective. We returned it for further repairs, and were still awaiting results as we went to press.

Any buyer who gets one of the apparently numerous lemons in this product’s current crop is caught in a bad situation. He can’t just tote a five-foot wide, heavy console back to the dealer and demand an exchange. Even if he did, most dealers wouldn’t make an exchange (though some might be willing to cancel the whole deal and refund his money). The dealer expects his customer to have any defects that show up in the set corrected under the manufacturer’s warranty.


The Performance Tests

The performance test confirmed a point we’ve often made before: a consumer can draw no conclusion about quality of performance from the presence of transistors, rather than tubes, in a model. Transistors do, however, offer the advantages of longer life, immediate start-up, and low heat generation.

The changer tests brought good news compared with findings on changers in perviously tested console phonographs. Only negligible rumble was found in the Acceptable changers, and only two, as the table shows, had even moderate flutter. Moreover, the tracking force settings were far below the record-destroying 6 to 10 grams often found in earlier tests of changers. Settings of 5 grams or more will definitely cause accelerated wear and high distortion on stereo discs, and even 4 grams is considered marginal. Of the six machines that came with tracking force of 4 grams or more, three (see table) could be readjusted to 3.5 grams or less and still “track” properly, without skipping or jumping at loud passages or on the inside grooves of a record.

Controls and Indicators

The radio control panels of the tested consoles, with their rows of knobs, switches, and lights, look much like those of component-type tuners. Common to all are separate bass and treble controls, and all except the Magnavox have speaker balance controls on the radio panel. The Magnavox also has this control, but inside the console, inaccessible to the user. Although this model came with correct speaker balance, an accessible control is desirable if external speakers are used; in any case, the control should be handy for eventual readjustment to compensate for aging parts.

Seven of the sets have tuning indicators (either meter or eye tube) meant to give visual assurance that a station is tuned in precisely. In our tests, however, the peak point on the meter or narrowest shadow on the “eye” generally did not correspond to the point of least distortion; fine-tuning had to be done by ear after the indicator had shown approximately where the station was.

Every machine tested has a stereo indicator that lights up to tell you that a stereo FM program is tuned in. On some it operates only when the set is switched to FM stereo; on others it works on both FM mono and FM stereo settings. This difference did not seem to us to be important.

All but two set have automatic frequency control (AFC), which “locks” the FM radio on a station to prevent drifting as the radio warms. When you try to tune in a weak station very near a strong one on the dial, however, the AFC may pull the tuning over to the strong one. In order to listen to the weaker station, you need a switch that turns the AFC off. All the sets with AFC, except the V-M, have such a switch. The two sets without AFC, Fisher and Masterwork, did not drift.

Some Conveniences

Most sets provide auxiliary jacks for tape recorders, although among the two highest-ranked machines only the Fisher has output as well as input jacks. If you plug a tape recorder into an input jack, you can listen to tape recordings through the amplifier and speakers of the console. Plug it into an output jack, and you can make tape recordings of any program, from radio or disc, that you hear on the console. Besides tape recorder jacks, three models (Sears, Sylvania, and Clairtone) have jacks for plugging in stereo headphones, a convenience for private listening or for those who want the special stereo experience such phones can give.

Generally the jacks are at the rear and directly accessible, but the Wards Airline and V-M have jacks inside the console, accessible only when the back cover is taken off-hardly a convenient arrangement. However, a serviceman can fit these machines with external jacks. On the Zenith, Magnavox, and Sylvania, an optional kit to provide external jacks is available, but the kit must be installed by a serviceman.

Summary:

All in all, then these “packaged” consoles aren’t going to satisfy a demanding listener who wants the sound quality and stereo effect the ads promise. But, it should be added, neither will anything else in the same price range. Top-grade sound from a system made up of components we rated highly would list at about $600 - without a cabinet. So it is a straight case of paying more for more, less for less.

On the other hand, if the buyer is “upgrading” his listening to one of these machines from a table model radio plus a portable phonograph - sources that currently furnish sound in millions of American homes - he’s apt to consider the tone quality of the better consoles, by comparison, positively grand.
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I like how the Zenith is rated a close second to the Fisher.I don't think Zenith gets nearly the respect it does,compared to Magnavox.I don't want to use mine any more,until I get it recapped and tuned up,but I can't wait until I can use it with the XP7s.

Magnavox may have had the Jensens,but that 2g/Cobra combination on the '62-'63 is great too.

What is the original source of this ?
 
I like how the Zenith is rated a close second to the Fisher.I don't think Zenith gets nearly the respect it does,compared to Magnavox.I don't want to use mine any more,until I get it recapped and tuned up,but I can't wait until I can use it with the XP7s.

Magnavox may have had the Jensens,but that 2g/Cobra combination on the '62-'63 is great too.

What is the original source of this ?

V-M is the source for the Cobramatic table and Zenith has the arm/headshell fitted.

I believe it a Consumer's Report Article.

Larry
 
Add another member to Larry's Console Stable. A 1959 FISHER 510 Series Consolette sans the 560 extension. Got it from Red. Definately needs a ReCap. Brought it up on the Variac, and almost as soon as I hit 90-100Volts, one ofthe 6BQ5's started Redplating. Tubes all tested good. ALL TUBES are FISHER Branded made in Great Britain. Swapped the outputs and same condition. So the amp is out for rehab. This has the 2.5oHm output transformer. It has 3 8" full range drivers, 2 of which have whizzer cones.

EDIT: (02Oct12) Mid June I believe it was BugleGirl completed the 510 / 560 combo with a 560 in running shape, also a 610 chassis. The 510 is now a 610. Strictly "PLUG AND PLAY! Absolutely no changes to the cabinet were made, except for the face plate for the tuner. So the 510 and 610 amplifiers are interchangeable with no mods. this is an Early 610 chassis as there is no provision for MPX, altho the addition of the RCA Jacks and a couple of wires for MPX is straightforward.

Also has a Garrard RC121-MKII. Never seen a Garrard with all meta Gear Train. Surprisingly it's not any noisier than other units with plastic or phenolic gear trains. The Stylus is in Decent shape however the suspension on the cartridge is shot. So I'm going to put a Pickering 400V.3 on it. @ 10mv output it'll do the job. it's about the same weight as the Sonotone.

2 of the knob brights were missing and found when the unit was dis-assembled for inspection, under the changer. Some Glue and all knobs are now bright.

It's in the bedroom right now. If I can find a 560, great. If not I can hook it up to my RCA SHF-5 and use it as an extension.

DAMNED CUTE little FISHER! Now to get it running.
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The 61 Coronet II (C-55) cabinet is crying out for a recever or separates. I had my 400 in it before I sold the 400. So I'm seriously considering putting the 800C into the cabinet. Sort of a poor man's Executive.


Larry
 
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Unrepresented below are the saddest cases: AK members who have inherited Fisher consoles through their families. They are truly blameless; having grown up with the high fidelity and never knowing any other mode of existence. Off the top of my head I can only think of only one such case: Duffinator and his beautiful 1955 Custom Electra II. Are there others?

Since this post was from last year, you know by now that I'm another "saddest case," having inherited a GORGEOUS truly custom console, boohoopoorpoorpitifulme. LOL. http://audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=409688

I'm also laughing at your explanation of your avatar's ultimate intent and your grid pics - reminds me of my dad and his plotting everything on graph paper to ensure exactly where chosen pieces, including said Fisher console, would go when they moved into this (current) house. And the avatar creative process sounds more than a little familiar. Seems I'm not the only one who slaved over a dumb little graphic. ;-)
 
We've had a Contemporary C-810 and Stereo Companion 560 in the family for years; it sat for years in our guest room as decorative furniture for many years. For Christmas last year my partner had the whole thing gone over, and we've been enjoying it now for several weeks.

Capacitors have been replaced, and tubes have all been checked. The radio may never again be what it once was, but the amps sound terrific. We're not going to do anything with the old Garrard changer; my Dual 1229 plugged into a phono preamp sounds magnificent on this rig. We are cheating in one regard, though: tonight I plugged my old Pioneer graphic equalizer in to see if the midrange could be tamed on the speakers--they were much too "forward" for my taste, and the high treble much too weak. It seems to have worked; a big cut at 1 kHz and a somewhat lesser one at 4 kHz, plus even smaller ones at 250 Hz and 2 kHz balance the tone considerably--the treble comes through better now.

I'm amazed at how authoritatively this console fills a huge living room!
 
New Fisher console owner!

Well, just picked up a Custom Electra V Modern this weekend. It is my first console and first vacuum tube-driven audio component. The thing is in fairly tip top shape. I think one of the midrange drivers is out and every so often the audio crackles in & out...not sure if that is the electronics or the vinyl or what. Overall, though, it sounds pretty good.

It appears to be all original tubes, everything appears to work, and even the business card from the dealer is taped to the back - looks to have been local all its life. It has the MPX unit installed, though it is not reflected in the model # tag on the back with an "X". I plan to spend some time here learning how I can get this beauty cleaned up a bit more. After just a wipe down and polish with a bit of lemon oil the cabinet looks great. I certainly wouldn't guess it is 50 years old. How do I know if I need/should re-cap?

Also, was originally planning to plug in a standalone turntable to the Aux in, but it is only mono aux in :(
Can I plug in another stereo source into the MPX inputs instead or will that not work? What is the REV in/out used for? I searched and haven't found anything about this, yet.

Here's some initial pics...
 

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Congratulations! The CE V Modern cabinet is one of Fisher's all-time best designs (in my opinion). Yours looks to be in excellent condition.

Jon has the service manual available at the fisherconsoles.com website. I took a quick look at the preamp schematic. I wonder why they only offered a mono AUX input on this model - that was uncharacteristically stingy for Fisher. My '59 Contemporary II is both earlier and further down in the model hierarchy but it has stereo AUX inputs.

I presume the standalone turntable you mention has a low-level output magnetic cartridge. In that case you should have good results using the MPX inputs providing you use an outboard phono preamp. Alternately, you could use the PHONO inputs but you'd have to either unplug the on-board changer or use an input switching device. Looking at the schematic, the 460-T's PHONO inputs do appear to be low-level inputs designed for magnetic cartridges. They have an extra preamp stage as well as RIAA EQ.
 
Yeah, it thought it odd there was not stereo aux inputs. Now that you say it, an external switcher on the phono input does sound like the best idea, to take advantage of the built-in preamp stage.

Looking at the back label stamped "W" I am taking that to mean walnut finish. Does that sound right?
 
Looking at the back label stamped "W" I am taking that to mean walnut finish. Does that sound right?
Yes and walnut almost always equals modern/contemporary. Somewhere I posted a list of Fisher 'cabinet codes'. . . here:

http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?p=4094132#post4094132

Sometimes they indicate the wood (which was used in a particular style console - i.e.: W = Walnut = Modern/Contemporary) and sometimes they indicate the style (for which a particular type of wood was usually used - i.e.: P = Provincial = Cherry/Fruitwood). Fisher was very consistent in their inconsistencies.
 
What's a Custom Electric V Modern look worth in working condition? I picked one up that was supposedly working a couple months ago. I've never owned a console before, so I am excited to check the Fisher console out.
 
Well, I got it home and it works! Evidently the previous owner didn't know how to operate it. Where is the aux on the 460a? I can't seem to find it and I want to test it out.
 
Well, I got it home and it works! Evidently the previous owner didn't know how to operate it. Where is the aux on the 460a? I can't seem to find it and I want to test it out.

It's just left of/and next to the Phono inputs. It's just a single RCA since the Aux is mono only.
 
pictures

Here are a couple pictures of the console. I still can't believe the previous owner didn't think it worked. :banana: It sounds great!
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Congratulations! Yet another beautiful CE V! That wouldn't, by any chance, be the Delaware one, would it? There have been some real interesting Fisher consoles popping up recently. Late Summer/Fall is always a dangerous time for me.
 
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