Astonishing Sony XDRF1HD Tuner

I picked up a stock Sony a few months ago for very reasonable money thanks to a generous fellow AK'er. Due to Texas heat, it's back in its box awaiting next Fall.

I had a chance to do some listening sessions with it before packing it up. Pretty darn impressive! Especially sensitivity and the quiet background. But as far as overall sound quality, I've got to say I think several of my vintage tuners beat it (Kenwood KT-8007, Sansui TU-717, Akai AT-2600, Nikko NT-850).

Beats me why folks are spending such big money on the little Sony. But eBay prices can be mysterious to say the least.
 
59volvo said:
punker x forced analog and hi fi mods take it to the top level
Click to expand...


I bet...

Punker X did some work/upgrades on my Yamaha T-85 and I'm very pleased with it.

Comparing the T-85 with the stock Sony the Yamaha wins - IMO. Just has more gravitas
 
to the Sony-bashers with upscale tuners:
I think you're delusional!
The Sony is so far removed from every other tuner I've ever had in terms of sensitivity and selectivity, adjacent channel rejection that there is no comparison!
Currently I use a Yamaha T2 and a PunkerX refurbed TX1000. I love them.
When I want to listen to a far-out college station, the Sony is the solution.
I did the common mods to the Sony myself; in terms of fidelity it's VERY close to the T2 and a wash with the TX1000. I don't mind listening to it at all, especially when there is no other viable option!
To give you a sense of it: I'm north of Phiadelphia, due west of NYC (roughly 90* apart from one another) If I aim my APS-13 antenna at WFUV/90.7/Fordham U in the Bronx, and then tune to 90.9/WHYY/Public Radio in Philly, I can receive a listenable signal from a feed that is 90* from one of the most highly directional FM antennas ever manufactured.
The other tuners? Only the whitest of noise with no hint there is a station present!
Pretty stupendous. I will never sell the little magic box until something better appears, but for now, it fills a niche that others only can aspire to.
EDIT: all observations made in forced analog mode, although HD is pretty neat for casual listening; WNYC/Public Radio/NYC become three good stations! Try that with your analog rig!
 
I don't have quite the same experience as you with the Sony.

On FM, it's not more sensitive than my stock Onkyo T-9090 II. The Onkyo would sometimes hear things the Sony couldn't. But we're talking about signals on the verge of reception- 10 to 20 dBf- often fading in and out above the noise floor. Signals ~5dBf or more above that level would often sound quieter on the Sony, but the T-9090 II was consistently more listenable at the lowest signal levels.

The Sony is generally more selective, but not always.

Sometimes the (stock) Sony doesn't sound as good, but that depends on the individual station. I do agree that I'll probably not sell it.
 
I had stored my Sony HD tuner for awhile in my basement, which is unfinished and unheated. It is a dry basement, but being near salt water, the humidity can get high. It can get up to 90 percent on a humid day. When I hooked up the Sony last night, I was really disappointed with the quality of sound, but today the sound really cleared up. I'm assuming that the dampness affected the electronics, but after running it for a day it dried out and performed up to snuff. I will NEVER store it in the basement again!
 
Sounds like you need a dehumidifier. Couldn't imagine doing anything in my basement without one.
 
I have a dehumidifier, but don't run it all the time because our electric company wants our first born! If I were to finish the basement, I would take measures to get the humidity down, but we are empty nesters and really don't use the basement, so no big projects there. Only the Sony seemed to be affected, so it will stay upstairs form now on.
 
Sorry to dredge up this old thread...

I'm looking for input from anyone who's successfully tapped into the XDR's HD I2S data bus to extract digital audio from the XDR. I actually have this working but I'm using a DAC of dubious quality for testing. It sounds pretty good but the board's line-level output is too high and there's no way to adjust it (yet).

The goal would be to have an outboard DAC and not have to use the XDR's (which is pretty good but probably not the best).

Anyone have any thoughts on whether this is worth pursuing?

EDIT: Just to be clear, this is for HD only.
 
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HD I2S data bus to extract digital audio from the XDR
Click to expand...

I have not done it nor do I own the unit, but I have been working on a similar thing, in my case I was going to use the Si4770 radio chips optional I2S and send it to a SPDIF transmitter, using a TI DIT4192.
One would think that a well designed external DAC would make it sound that much better. I am currently using a Si4735D60 and I am surprised how good it sounds for a chip radio.
If a external DAC improves the sound for a HD signal, I can not see why it would not do the same for a non-HD signal!
 
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With the XDR's design, it's possible to export the HD Radio datastream before it hits the XDR's DSP/DAC. I don't see how to tap into the analog signal before it passes through the XDR's DSP/DAC. Still researching...

The only gotcha I can think of is if the XDR's DSP section is "massaging" the HD digital data to make it "better". Or is it limited to just converting the digital to analog, without otherwise messing with it...
 
rcs16 said:
I have not done it nor do I own the unit, but I have been working on a similar thing, in my case I was going to use the Si4770 radio chips optional I2S and send it to a SPDIF transmitter, using a TI DIT4192.
One would think that a well designed external DAC would make it sound that much better. I am currently using a Si4735D60 and I am surprised how good it sounds for a chip radio.
If a external DAC improves the sound for a HD signal, I can not see why it would not do the same for a non-HD signal!
Click to expand...

Not exactly Sony radio related, but you reminded me that I have a project that I need to get off of the back burner.

You keep mentioning the various Silicon Labs chips. I need to make another modified C. Crane FM transmitter. I will feed the Silicon Labs transmitter chip with a I2S signal. Since I am one of the few people that do not have a smart phone, I want to use the FM transmitter to stream old time radio programs to an FM radio when I am outside exercising and all though I claim to be an analog guy, I would like my streaming audio signal to be digital all the way to the FM transmitter.

And I would be inside one of the Sony radios if I had one.

I just missed out on those because I was going through a rather rough time with my health.

This is an interesting thread, thanks to all that have posted.
 
xdrguy said:
Sorry to dredge up this old thread...

I'm looking for input from anyone who's successfully tapped into the XDR's HD I2S data bus to extract digital audio from the XDR. I actually have this working but I'm using a DAC of dubious quality for testing. It sounds pretty good but the board's line-level output is too high and there's no way to adjust it (yet).

The goal would be to have an outboard DAC and not have to use the XDR's (which is pretty good but probably not the best).

Anyone have any thoughts on whether this is worth pursuing?

EDIT: Just to be clear, this is for HD only.
Click to expand...

I'm certainly interested. It's my only working tuner now. A better output section and/or better DAC would only further benefit my listening.
 
Hi JB guy,
I do not want to de-rail this OP thread, but to answer your ?
Look at Silicon Labs Broadcast Audio Selector Guide. In it, they identify Si4711/13/21 parts as having digital audio input capabilities for the transmitter function.
If you wish, we can start a new thread just talking about these unique parts. Although a transmitter is off topic, for a tuner thread. Probably the diyaudio forum is a better place to talk at a higher technical level than is place. Send me a PM and we can discuss and trade ideas.
AN383 is the extensive programming guide for the whole family. Once you get one of this family of chips, up and going at the programming level, the others fall in line quite easily. Have you done any programming?
P.S. hope your health is improved cheers Rick
 
xdrguy said:
With the XDR's design, it's possible to export the HD Radio datastream before it hits the XDR's DSP/DAC. I don't see how to tap into the analog signal before it passes through the XDR's DSP/DAC. Still researching...

The only gotcha I can think of is if the XDR's DSP section is "massaging" the HD digital data to make it "better". Or is it limited to just converting the digital to analog, without otherwise messing with it...
Click to expand...

I did a lot of mods to the Sony, mostly in re-doing the analog outputs completely using discrete components and an external 18V supply.

It's been a while, but my recall of the philips chipset used was that it did not do HD IBOC processing, as it was made for an international market. It did the tuning, and and IF A/D conversion, then in digital domain did IF selectivity filtering and conversion to stereo, lastly D/A to analog, and output a signal in analog domain.

The wide digitized IF included the HD sidebands, which by my analysis were then exported to another outboard chip for processing (under Ibiquity licensed firmware) then re-turned to Philips chip in digital form to be converter to analog. I seem to recall you could catch the return stream and use that to get your HD digital output.

Since this strategy works for HD only, it was of little interest to me, and I never pursued it further. I have built DACs from scratch, so was interested in getting the analog FM out in digital form, but never found a way to achieve it. I could also never get the documentation on the Philips processing chip - it may have been some sort of a custom FPGA with user loaded firmware.
Bob
 
Update

I have successfully tapped into that HD module I2S bus on its return trip to the DSP and am converting the I2S data to TOSLINK optical out, for processing by an outboard DAC. It works and it sounds good. Whether it's an improvement using an external DAC of the user's choosing, vs the XDR's internal DAC/DSP, is open to discussion. But just the fact it can be done is cool. :)

I suspect the XDR's DSP/DAC is actually quite good. But having another option to play around with is intriguing.
 
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