Can I bi-amp?

janikphoto said:

No, your process is not confusing us. Obviously, it can be done. It's just a sort of odd way to set things up. You could use two separate integrated units, use the Y adaptors on every input device (CD, DAC, Tape, etc), and then you'd just have to adjust twice as many knobs and buttons for every function. It's kind of like welding two Honda Civics together to carry around a family of six or seven, instead of just buying a van or SUV to move them about.

Anyway, nothing wrong with doing something in a different and unique way... but, it sure isn't the normal way to bi-amp!

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Before you said it required a preamp so now I'm glad you admit it can be done.

It's only odd to you as you've never tried it but it works fine with zero signal degradation.

Having two separate volume controls is better than one as it means you can level match the two drivers.

Add a switch box for multiple devices.

Another good way I've found to bi-amp without a preamp is using a AV receiver to power the woofers and in doing so taking full advantage of it's internal DAC.

Older AV receivers without HDMI can be found on the cheap and many provide excellent power in two channel mode.

To bi-amp you need a CDP ( or DAC ) with both analog and digital outputs and most do. And except for SACD players they will output from both at the same time.

Connect the analog outputs of the CDP/DAC to the main integrated amp and connect the digital output ( optical/coax ) of the CDP/DAC to the corresponding digital input of the AV receiver.

Set the AV receiver to the appropriate digital input and you're bi-amping. Can't use an Fmod but a low pass at the woofer works. Since AV receivers have remotes you've got control of the bass from your easy chair.:thmbsp:

Poultrygeist said:

Before you said it required a preamp so now I'm glad you admit it can be done.

It's only odd to you as you've never tried it but it works fine with zero signal degradation.

Having two separate volume controls is better than one as it means you can level match the two drivers.

Add a switch box for multiple devices.

Click to expand...

When I said it requires a pre-amp, I meant it does for practical purposes. I use a source directly into an audiosource amp with a volume control knob on my workbench. The amp is designed to be a sort of "add-on" amp to run speakers and an amp in several different rooms... you'd have your source and pre in the living room, and then you can piggy back the audiosource amps in other rooms, patio, etc.

Since it has in/out rca's and a volume, it makes it pretty flexible to use for testing gear and speakers without a pre. I could also buy more of these amps and bi-amp or tri-amp speakers, if I wanted... but it just seems like an impractical choice. I have my speakers tri-amped the same way that others have suggested: I have my music sources going into a McIntosh mx-113 pre-amp, which feeds an Ashly three-ay active crossover, which feeds for amplifiers (two running mono and two running stereo) to give me the six channels of power for tri-amping the NAS Studio Monitors.

But, yeah... I wasn't meaning to say in the most literal and technical sense that you can't bi-amp without a pre... I meant that you can't do it on a practical level. I'd hate my system, if I didn't have those center controls on the pre. I don't want to adjust four amps with six different volume knobs every time I want to turn up the volume!

Here's the open baffle speakers I'm trying to bi-amp. I copied PG's design.
These things sound incredible.

fsdaron said:

Here's the open baffle speakers I'm trying to bi-amp. I copied PG's design.
These things sound incredible.

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Very nice. Where did you get the wood for your baffles?

cubdog

Fred,

Your OB's are excellent. I see you've already got the low pass filters ( same as I gave cubdog ). All you need is an amp to drive the Alphas and you'll be bi-amping.

The plate amp you mentioned in your PM is also a good option for the Alphas assuming it has RCA line in's and you can share the signal source with your SET as discussed earlier. Of course you won't need the low pass filter as the plate amp has it's own.

Your naked plate amp will need a simple frame like the one I made pictured below.



When you get the Betsy/Alpha's bi-amped they'll knock your socks off. The Betsy/Alphas were my first multi-driver OB and they so totally thrashed the Zu Omens that I couldn't sell them fast enough.

Here's another way to bi-amp using a plate amp without a preamp:

Assuming the plate amp like this Yung has line-in RCA's and the line-out RCA's are pass through ( signal passed through without being altered ) you can:

Connect RCA cables from a source to the plate's line-in ( the crossover will then be applied to the connected and powered Alpha woofers ). The Yung's Speaker level-in's are never used as the plate's internal power leads are connected to a single pair of binding posts which drive the woofers as shown in the previous post.

Connect RCA cables from plate's line-outs ( signal pass through ) to the MP SET amp powering the Betsy's and you're bi-amping. In all these examples the Betsy's run full range and the crossover is only applied to the Alpha woofers.

^^^ - mmm, dunno of the amp but like the phase adjustment knob. :thmbsp:

Look into a MiniDSP....

whoaru99 said:

Look into a MiniDSP....

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I use an Ashly XR-1001 electronic crossover with my Lowther OB's but the OP is about how to bi-amp without a preamp.

While the MiniDSP is a great active solution I like analog and it's on-the-fly twist of a knob adjustability without using a PC.

edwyun said:

^^^ - mmm, dunno of the amp but like the phase adjustment knob. :thmbsp:

Click to expand...

The new Yung plate amps sold by Parts Express sound good and are class D which means unlike conventional plate amps they produce no heat, are compact and lightweight. Best part is the price. I bought the 300 watt Yung on sale for $99 which translates into $.33 per watt.

cubdog, got the wood at lowes.