Ultrasonic Cleaners - They do Work...

jgordon

jgordon

Super Member
I had a chance to hear a multi-hundreds of thousands of dollar system today. Naturally, the guy had an ultrasonic cleaner. I had my promo copy of Steely Dan's Aja with me, and it had been put through the VPI 16.5. I had thought it was clean. However, there was apparently some grunge on the right channel that this system wasn't enjoying. My friend pulled it off the table and ran it through one of the high-dollar, KL Audio ultrasonic cleaners.

Long story short, it was much, much cleaner than I had been able to get it on my VPI.

Logical Questions:
1. Could my technique on the VPI be improved? Probably.

2. Could multiple cleanings on the VPI get me there? Likely closer, but no, I don't think so.

3. Is it worth ~$3,000? My collection is roughly 5,000 albums. The question is whether it's worth an extra $0.50 per album to achieve that level of cleanliness. I would say it is worth it. However, I would need more cash to make that purchase, so it's all relative.

I see them debated a lot here (as well as the VPI vs. nitty vs. sink). I thought I'd give my findings that yes, it is significantly cleaner after a spin through one.
 
I'm hearing the same message that the ultrasonic cleaners are a step up over the VPI 16.5 which probably includes all the other models and makes like Nitty Gritty. $3,000 is a significant amount of money and these have only recently come on the market, I'd give it some time for prices to come down as they become more popular. With 5,000 albums I would say you could eventually justify an ultrasonic cleaner.
 
jgordon said:
I had my promo copy of Steely Dan's Aja with me, and it had been put through the VPI 16.5. I had thought it was clean. However, there was apparently some grunge on the right channel that this system wasn't enjoying.
Click to expand...

Some noticeable "grunge" after a VPI clean?
Wow.
Anyway...

There's an ebay seller who ultrasonic cleans his records...
the dude can sell 'Brothers In Arms' for $60. Unreal.
His hyperbole is ridiculous.

I wonder if someday there will be a more high end cleaner that will remove the grunge left by the Ultrasonic?
 
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Ambien Gnome said:
Some noticeable "grunge" after a VPI clean?
Wow.
Anyway...

There's an ebay seller who ultrasonic cleans his records...
the dude can sell 'Brothers In Arms' for $60. Unreal.
His hyperbole is ridiculous.

I wonder if someday there will be a more high end cleaner that will remove the grunge left by the Ultrasonic?
Click to expand...

Are you calling bullshit or are you expressing actual surprise (in a non-snarky way)? Hard to tell from your post. No reason not to believe the OP.
 
jgordon said:
I had a chance to hear a multi-hundreds of thousands of dollar system today. Naturally, the guy had an ultrasonic cleaner. I had my promo copy of Steely Dan's Aja with me, and it had been put through the VPI 16.5. I had thought it was clean. However, there was apparently some grunge on the right channel that this system wasn't enjoying. My friend pulled it off the table and ran it through one of the high-dollar, KL Audio ultrasonic cleaners.

Long story short, it was much, much cleaner than I had been able to get it on my VPI.

Logical Questions:
1. Could my technique on the VPI be improved? Probably.

2. Could multiple cleanings on the VPI get me there? Likely closer, but no, I don't think so.

3. Is it worth ~$3,000? My collection is roughly 5,000 albums. The question is whether it's worth an extra $0.50 per album to achieve that level of cleanliness. I would say it is worth it. However, I would need more cash to make that purchase, so it's all relative.

I see them debated a lot here (as well as the VPI vs. nitty vs. sink). I thought I'd give my findings that yes, it is significantly cleaner after a spin through one.
Click to expand...

1) That depends on the technique and cleaners you presently use.
2) Yes, again depending on technique and cleaners used
3) With a collection of 5000 records a $4k RCM is justified (provided you have that kind of scratch).
 
Allow me to clarify. The grunge in question was not noticeable on MY system. However, there was definitely something going on in the right channel. Some fuzz and crackling that was just not there on my setup. We pulled the record and cleaned it, and when we put it back, it was 96% gone.

I guess the other variable here is the quality of the playback equipment. If you're using a crosley and a steel needle, you likely don't need a VPI, let alone an ultrasonic. I haven't played it back on my system yet to see if I can hear a difference.

Ambien Gnome said:
Some noticeable "grunge" after a VPI clean?
Wow.
Anyway...

There's an ebay seller who ultrasonic cleans his records...
the dude can sell 'Brothers In Arms' for $60. Unreal.
His hyperbole is ridiculous.

I wonder if someday there will be a more high end cleaner that will remove the grunge left by the Ultrasonic?
Click to expand...
 
withmusic said:
1) That depends on the technique and cleaners you presently use.
Click to expand...

Agreed.

withmusic said:
2) Yes, again depending on technique and cleaners used
Click to expand...

Agreed.

withmusic said:
3) With a collection of 5000 records a $4k RCM is justified (provided you have that kind of scratch).
Click to expand...

Also agreed. I would have no problem paying an extra $.50 each at the time of purchase. But parting with $3k at once is a lot harder to justify. Especially with tonearms, preamps, plinths, etc. all calling my name and asking for my money.
 
A couple things to consider:

Not all albums have the ability to cleanup the same. I wouldn't assume that every LP you own will be able to get better (as Aja did), with an Ultrasonic.

Is Aja's level of improvement much more noticeable played back on your system? Can your system "hear" the difference it made?

You might mostly be hearing this guy's multi-hundreds of thousands of dollar's system rather than the next level of cleaning the US provided.

Or maybe it's worth every penny no matter what you clean or play it back on. Who knows. One way to find out.
 
Ambien Gnome said:
Some noticeable "grunge" after a VPI clean?
Wow.
Anyway...

There's an ebay seller who ultrasonic cleans his records...
the dude can sell 'Brothers In Arms' for $60. Unreal.
His hyperbole is ridiculous.

I wonder if someday there will be a more high end cleaner that will remove the grunge left by the Ultrasonic?
Click to expand...

Maybe it's one of those Hot stampers that I see pop up on the internet from time to time. and after being Ultrasonic cleaned it's worth every penny of the 60 dollars spent:D
 
There's one other thing to consider in evaluating where the noise on Aja was coming from. A good amount of the time, after I clean a record on my vacuum RCM, there is a good bit of noise in the groove. This can be caused by residual dirt, the fluid itself not being fully rinsed out, or even static that cannot be eliminated even with my industrial ionizer -- the only way to get rid of the noise is to play the record, sometimes more than once. This phenomenon is even noted in the instructions that come with the Disc Doctor Miracle Record Fluid I use. So if you had just cleaned your copy of Aja, you might have eliminated the noise by playing it the first time at your friends' -- IOW, it might have been quiet upon a second play even without the ultrasonic cleaning.

Not saying the ultrasonic didn't solve it, just throwing that out there. And FWIW, I would love to put together an ultrasonic cleaner, for the excellent results people report, and also because I really hate the multi-step washing/rinsing involved in my vacuum cleaner setup.
 
GreatTone said:
.... the fluid itself not being fully rinsed out,
Click to expand...
+1

Anywayz, ultrasonic cleaner is doable, in DIY manner.

Take a look at this thread, many people came with their own soluttions

P3290092.jpg


http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/analogue-source/120394-i-made-myself-record-cleaner.html
 
An ultrasonic cleaner is definitely on my wish list.
Until then, I feel that I am getting the best I can out of my VPI 16.5 using the Walker Audio Quartet four step cleaning system.
The first step is an enzyme cleaner, then a detergent cleaner, followed by two different rinses with three platter rotations of vacuum suction between steps.
I'm happy with the results I'm getting this way.

Al. Wise
 
When my venerable 16.5 gives up the ghost I'm giving ultrasonic a close look. One advantage for me would be the ability to clean multiple LP's simultaneously.
 
I have held off buying either the VIP or the Audio Desk cleaner, as I want the ultra sonic method but I have read a number of post from owners of the Audio Desk regarding reliability, and then customer service issues. I am hoping they get the bugs out of it or that a competitor comes out with one cheaper and more reliable. I also don't like the idea of blow drying them dry, that will just get them dusty all over again. If they use the blow drying method they need a cover over the top and small air filters to filter the air used to blow dry them.

There seems to be a number of post trying to figure out if it was something else other than the fact a VIP didn't get it completely clean. I really don't know but if the OP ever goes back over to his friends again, he should take a few more to verify his results. From the commercial reviews they seem to think that the ultra sonic cleaners took cleaning to a whole new level not found with conventional RCM's.

I should also add, I have not seen any Audio Desk for sale for 3,000 dollars the ones I have seen are 4,000 dollars.
 
Last edited:
jgordon said:
3. Is it worth ~$3,000? My collection is roughly 5,000 albums. The question is whether it's worth an extra $0.50 per album to achieve that level of cleanliness. I would say it is worth it. However, I would need more cash to make that purchase, so it's all relative.
Click to expand...
I was saving for an 'upscale' MC, but have shifted my sights to the KLAudio cleaner for the same reason you've mentioned (the MC will have to wait). But, am wondering where you have found for $3K? Best I've found, with a 'group buy' on another forum, is $3850.

One reason I prefer the KLAudio compared to the competition that I've read about is that the LP comes out ready to play (dry). With the less expensive models (one on that auction sight for $899) you are left with a wet LP to do something about. Lots of coin, but you only go around once in life.
 
Last edited:
Question for the OP: is your promo copy of Aja a white label? I picked up a promo copy recently, which was the original AB press, and it has the regular yellow/orange ABC label, but with a gold promo stamp on the cover. thx
 
GreatTone said:
Question for the OP: is your promo copy of Aja a white label? I picked up a promo copy recently, which was the original AB press, and it has the regular yellow/orange ABC label, but with a gold promo stamp on the cover. thx
Click to expand...

I have a AB promo with the regular label as well.
 
I can just see the OP's friend cringing because his stylus is cleaning out the Aja grooves. Nothing like a $5,000 groove cleaner.

Anyway I come home from the record store with too many albums. I bought an Oki Noki but only use it when disc are bad after hearing them. So the albums I come home with and this is like 60 at a time all get hand dusted and new cover sleeves.

I just can't do one record at a time so this is what I'm getting. It does 8 disc at a time and list at $1500.

Ultra Sonic V8 Record Cleaner
http://www.analogplanet.com/content...-cleaning-machine-cleans-8-records-10-minutes
 
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