MC402 owners...

Hi All,

i have the opportunity to get a demo unit MC402 and also had a good price quote for MC452(new). The difference between the 2 amps in price is 3.5k...

Aside from the obvious difference in power of 50 watts and the aesthetics, does the price difference justify getting the MC452?

For those who have compared the 2 amps, is it true that the MC452 does not sound like the old Mcintosh (not in a bad way) as we know it, most say it is really fast and detailed....

What will i miss if i get the MC402?

Thank you.

I've owned them both.

I never thought the bass was right in the MC402. I used it with different speakers, different preamps, and in different rooms and the issue was the same.

The MC452 solved that issue for me. I think the "really fast and detailed" description might be a bit much, but the amp does move in that direction.

If you can afford it, get the MC452.

I have only had the MC452, but the description above seems to fit how I find the amp to sound....

I think its worth the couple of extra $$ to get the MC452, it is the last amp you'll buy, they are a lifetime investment.....I intend to keep mine for as long as I am on this earth.....

You cannot go wrong with the MC452......if you have the budget......

If you believe what you read and hear from dealers, the high frequencies and details at lower signal levels should be the big difference. But I have heard 402's driving XRT 28 vs 501's and 1200 watt models and I think the 402 seems to be a step behind. But then I have heard 452 driving 1K's and I think the 452 comes in last compared to a 602 , 1.2K. But then none of the speakers mentioned are real bass performers. I'd rather have a pair of XR290's and a 2600. But I wouldn't throughout a pair of 1.2k amps if given to me. Side note: 601 with Ik speakers don't show me much either. So if I were going to audition amps I would prefer some other than current Mac speakers. As I have said before I don't like metal tweeters unless dampened properly and the current speakers don't compared to the older silk tweeters which have a much smoother life like, not studio like, performance.

I KNOW I SPELLED DAMPED WRONG again!!!!!!!

twiiii said:

I KNOW I SPELLED DAMPED WRONG again!!!!!!!

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Hahaha......You made me laugh!!......:thmbsp: you have to have those tweeters good and damp for them to work properly....

But seriously, the MC452 description I agree with is that it is a very fast amp, very accurate detail, amazing clarity.....
My MC452 only runs down to 74hz anyway, I have the Crown Macro-tech on my subs, I think its the damping factor of >1000 which controls those L'acoustic 15" subs with precision....

At the end of the day if you put the MC452 with the right speakers, it is a pretty hard amp to beat....remember, we aren't sitting in out lounges running these amps at full power, and with that, a MC452 has all the power most people will ever need, probably more....

OH I agree, even my 207 has more power than I'll ever need. A quad balanced 2120 or 2105 would be just perfect for me with a 200 damping factor. It would need to be able to drive 2 ohms, to 8 0hms. A 7100 if truly Quad balanced would be an answer.. I really don't need 120 db signal to noise, the 112 +db I have now is adequate. I like every thing about my 207. It could be a touch dryer on the bottom and as I have never run the unit into the power guard, the 2 ohms has n't caused any ill effects. The crossover is set for 250 Hz for 2 channels. The other 5 channels are running 8 ohms. The other 207 runs 8 ohms, too. The meter switch is in the 8 ohms position. The 2 2ohm channels are monitored by my MPI-4.

I don't have issues with lack of anything with my 402. It's driving a pair of JBL L250s sounds very clean and bass is thumping. The only thing Im lacking is another one, the L250s still have some legs that can handle more than the 400wpc.

You can't run the 452 parallel mono like you can the 402. So the naysayers that there is no bass, well 800w will defiantly push the bass out. So for about a grand more than the 452 you could have two 402 mono blocked @ 800 WPC

4-2-7 said:

I don't have issues with lack of anything with my 402. It's driving a pair of JBL L250s sounds very clean and bass is thumping. The only thing Im lacking is another one, the L250s still have some legs that can handle more than the 400wpc.

You can't run the 452 parallel mono like you can the 402. So the naysayers that there is no bass, well 800w will defiantly push the bass out. So for about a grand more than the 452 you could have two 402 mono blocked @ 800 WPC

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Don't need to run the MC452 in mono, if you need more power, its time for a couple of mono-blocks....MC601 or MC1.2KW......:thmbsp:

I never said the 402 had no bass, I said it would depend on your speakers, I'm willing to bet that in the case of the member who said that, his speakers have more to do with it than the amp does........I'll bet your L250 and 402 combo sounds fantastic......no argument there, but you do know doubling your power will give you an unimpressive 3db more headroom.....
If you really want to kick those L250's I would be thinking about the MC1.2KW.....
But more power doesn't necessarily mean more bass either, it has more to do with how your speakers are ported and/or damped combined with the damping factor of the amplifier in question.....those things are contributors more than the power is....


Value for money, the MC402 has to be right up there, but if 400ish watts is enough and you have the budget, the MC452 is an amp which really needs consideration, it's a stunning sounding amplifier.....I am gobsmacked at how good it is......

kevzep said:

Don't need to run the MC452 in mono, if you need more power, its time for a couple of mono-blocks....MC601 or MC1.2KW......:thmbsp:

I never said the 402 had no bass, I said it would depend on your speakers, I'm willing to bet that in the case of the member who said that, his speakers have more to do with it than the amp does........I'll bet your L250 and 402 combo sounds fantastic......no argument there, but you do know doubling your power will give you an unimpressive 3db more headroom.....
If you really want to kick those L250's I would be thinking about the MC1.2KW.....
But more power doesn't necessarily mean more bass either, it has more to do with how your speakers are ported and/or damped combined with the damping factor of the amplifier in question.....those things are contributors more than the power is....


Value for money, the MC402 has to be right up there, but if 400ish watts is enough and you have the budget, the MC452 is an amp which really needs consideration, it's a stunning sounding amplifier.....I am gobsmacked at how good it is......

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I know your not knocking the bass and are smitten with your 452. Just didn't want the OP to fear that the amp had no bass. I would love to try those 601s BUT!!!! ha ha another 402 is a lot closer to my budget. In my house the one 402 is plenty. I actually run the 402 L250 combo with the mono blocked 275s / SP-5000 combo together.

4-2-7 said:

I know your not knocking the bass and are smitten with your 452. Just didn't want the OP to fear that the amp had no bass. I would love to try those 601s BUT!!!! ha ha another 402 is a lot closer to my budget. In my house the one 402 is plenty. I actually run the 402 L250 combo with the mono blocked 275s / SP-5000 combo together.

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All, good, really, you have some nice gear there....Love your MC275 mono blocks.....I bet they kick those SP5000's along nicely.....

Yeah I have to say if your on a budget, the MC402 is pretty good buying, it gets you a lot of quite recent McIntosh horsepower.....

kevzep said:

All, good, really, you have some nice gear there....Love your MC275 mono blocks.....I bet they kick those SP5000's along nicely.....

Yeah I have to say if your on a budget, the MC402 is pretty good buying, it gets you a lot of quite recent McIntosh horsepower.....

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To tell the truth Kev the 275s and the SP-5000 kick butt all over the 402 and the 250s. If I want extreme rock-n roll loud I have to turn off the 402. The power protection starts flashing and the other system ie:275s have more to go. Those amps and speakers are a nice power match. You would not believe it's only 180 wpc.

4-2-7 said:

To tell the truth Kev the 275s and the SP-5000 kick butt all over the 402 and the 250s. If I want extreme rock-n roll loud I have to turn off the 402. The power protection starts flashing and the other system ie:275s have more to go. Those amps and speakers are a nice power match. You would not believe it's only 180 wpc.

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Nice one.....:thmbsp: Well, next thing you know, the OP will be strapping a pair of MC275's on his speakers.....

Mc501

Mc452 vs mc501s

I might be able to get an mc501 for less $$$ than mc452, will it be a good move?

Thanks

arien said:

Mc452 vs mc501s

I might be able to get an mc501 for less $$$ than mc452, will it be a good move?

Thanks

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You mean a pair of 501s don't you?

MORTIS said:

You mean a pair of 501s don't you?

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Sorry, Yes, a pair of 501s.

arien said:

Sorry, Yes, a pair of 501s.

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My local dealer had a mint set that the owner only opened the boxes. They might still have this set, they were asking $9,000. I talked him down to $8000 but then went for a 402 @ $4300.

They looked awesome and they might still have them. :thmbsp:

I'd take a MC452 over a pair of 501's all day.........

But its up to you at the end of the day, we can tell you what we would do, but it might not be the best thing for you.....

The best value for money around the 400-500watts mark with McIntosh has to be the MC402......

The MC452 however is a new McIntosh amp with the newer generation sound......I know we are talking subjective, using different speakers, but the common things I have read about the 501's is that they don't like being run hard, they have inadequate cooling for use at high power for extended periods....
And they are darker, more dense sounding amplifiers than the MC452....
Those are the common issues I have read from owners, and particularly an owner that upgraded from 501's to MC452....

The best thing to do is listen, go forth and listen.......Or pick up your MC402 and see if you like it, if its not quite what you're after then sell it and move on to something else....
But if you wanted to move on from a MC402, going to a pair of 501's won't be an upgrade, to upgrade you'd need to go to the newer Quad Balanced with Thermatrak transistors..etc...etc....in otherwords the MC452...
They do sound different, and it would pay if you can to audition.....In my case it wasn't possible so I had to make a theoretical decision, but it turned out to be the right one.....

I think its either a 402 or a 452........but that's just me......

There is a MC452 on audigon for less than 6K as an FYI....that seems like good buying to me....:thmbsp:

Never listened to a 452 in my system but have heard it at a local Mac dealer and it was awesome. With that said I own the 402 running two B&W 803 and two 805 speakers and it is absolutely incredible. You will never go wrong with either. Sound is subjective but you are debating awesome vs. incredible! Cant go wrong. There will always be the latest greatest, i still listen to my 34 year old system as well as the newer one. Like them different. Don't let others insist one is better, just different. We all wish to know our decisions were correct. Either will be correct! Have fun.

Hi Rick, thank you so much, what you said is so true, " there will always be something better" and if we always want the best, we end up broke:scratch2:

Rick R. said:

Never listened to a 452 in my system but have heard it at a local Mac dealer and it was awesome. With that said I own the 402 running two B&W 803 and two 805 speakers and it is absolutely incredible. You will never go wrong with either. Sound is subjective but you are debating awesome vs. incredible! Cant go wrong. There will always be the latest greatest, i still listen to my 34 year old system as well as the newer one. Like them different. Don't let others insist one is better, just different. We all wish to know our decisions were correct. Either will be correct! Have fun.

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