Room treatment placement review?

Rprokop63

AK Subscriber
Subscriber
Hi Everyone.
I have spent quite a bit of time reading through the forums for advice on treating my 14'x12' listening space/office. I had moved in here from a smaller 10'x10' space expecting an improvement and got anything but that!! I studied the first reflection thread and then ordered some GIK 242 panels for the walls. So far the sound is way better but was hoping one of the local experts could take a look at my pics and seem if I might benefit from some better placement etc. Originally the room had very rubbery boomy bass and the rest of the sound was shrill and distorted. Now the bass is much tighter and there is nearly no echoes in the room. Actually, the sound improvement from these panels made more of a difference than swapping speakers or anything else I've done so far.


So now I am hoping someone who actually know what they are doing can take a look at the attached photos and tell me if the placement looks ok or if there is still room for more improvement.
FYI, the speakers are on the long wall and there are two windows behind the beige curtains on the right side and opposite wall. I'm open to any advice on the subject.
 

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You have too many uneven surfaces there. This is not the best for sound quality. In that kind of room I would start with acoustic treatment of ceiling. There are special tiles for that, cover it all - wall to wall.
 
You have too many uneven surfaces there. This is not the best for sound quality. In that kind of room I would start with acoustic treatment of ceiling. There are special tiles for that, cover it all - wall to wall.

Thanks for_p1. By uneven surfaces do you mean the bookcases and the desk or the stuff on them? Not that I can do too much about either as I need the room for work, but it helps to learn the "why"of things. The ceiling is a popcorn ceiling with a large ceiling fan so that has its own issues. Right now I can remove all the panels and just patch 7 nail holes. If I mess up the popcorn that is another story.
 
Actually, the uneven surfaces along boundary layers (walls/floor/ceiling) help scatter sonic content and if this content is being scattered in a direction away from the listening spot that's a GOOD thing. However, scattering is very unpredictable (unlike diffusion) and it's impossible to tell exactly how much scattered sonic content is being reflected toward the listening position in the form of an early reflection...which is a BAD thing. This is why when controlling early reflections absorption and/or diffusion is the best method, scattering the next best, and a flat reflective surface the worst.

Now, articles in the room that interfere with direct wave sonic content arriving at the listening spot is another matter. If you have decor or furnishings that are situated such that they actually lie between you and the speaker (or even a little bit outboard of the area between you and the speaker) you will get an uneven propagation of sonic content from the two speakers with the end result being compromised tonality and resolution. So clear the area between you and the speakers and the area immediately outboard of that if you want the most balanced, least altered arrival of sonic content from the speakers (and if you're interested in optimized fidelity then that is what you want).

Next you should make sure the earliest reflections are attenuated or eliminated and you have the goods to accomplish that. Best place to start with a room of your dimensions is at the side walls as they offer the shortest indirect path of sonic content between the speakers and the listening position...or an early reflection (also referred to as first reflection). Finding this spot on each side wall is easily accomplished with the mirror method.

Now you can move to other areas creating early reflections at the listening position....ceiling and rear wall (behind you). If you sit within six to eight feet of the rear wall you'll need panels there and, once again, the mirror method will show you how to find the spots to locate the panels. Ceiling panels are located by drawing a line between the speaker and listening spot, finding the half-way point between those spots, looking up and placing a panel on the ceiling at that half-way point. I like using plant hanging hooks to hang my ceiling panels, but you will have to drill a small hole for the drywall anchor.

Panels on the front wall (behind the speakers) don't necessarily control early reflections, but they can improve mid and upper bass clarity and resolution which absolutely pays dividends toward overall fidelity.

And way to go with the acquisition and implementation of acoustic treatments! You've seen the light!! :thmbsp:
 
Treat the primary first reflection.
then bass trap the corners.
then put as much treatment as possible on the back wall.
the front wall is the last wall to treat.
 
Thanks for_p1. By uneven surfaces do you mean the bookcases and the desk or the stuff on them? Not that I can do too much about either as I need the room for work, but it helps to learn the "why"of things. The ceiling is a popcorn ceiling with a large ceiling fan so that has its own issues. Right now I can remove all the panels and just patch 7 nail holes. If I mess up the popcorn that is another story.
You do jot need to do anything with popcorn. Tiles will cover over it. You will loose an inch of height though. For walls, I would start with 4" thick panels right behind speakers. This will improve bass.
 
Treat the primary first reflection.
then bass trap the corners.
then put as much treatment as possible on the back wall.
the front wall is the last wall to treat.

That depends on what you call the "back" wall. For me the back wall is the wall behind the listening position. I call the wall behind the speakers the front wall because it's in front of me. l realize that some are speaker/stage centric and for them the wall behind the speakers is the back wall. Since there is a difference of terminology here you need to be specific about what you're calling the back and front walls.

The first reflection points are pretty much agreed on.
 
All,
I really appreciate the comments and ideas so far.

Tomlinmgt-
It was a few of your posts that got me to buy the panels in the first place from GIK.

p1-
My worry about the popcorn ceiling is for if I move and have to return it to original condition. Taking down popcorn is a real PITA that I would rather avoid.

Murphy & Joe-
Thanks for your input as well.

As you can see from the photos there is not a lot of spare space I the room. My listening position is only 2' off the wall tops. And that wall is mostly covered in ikea cd cases. I did get one 2x4 panel behind my seating position and that helps.
The panels in the first reflection points started as the 12" panels I bought. They work and don't block the room entrance. :) I swapped them with the 2x4 ones from behind the speakers and that instantly cleaned up the rubbery bass sound I have been having. However taking the panels from the wall behind the speakers brought back all the piercing irritating sound I didn't like so I may need more 2x4 panels for the wall behind the speakers. (The wall behind the speakers is metal studs and sheetrock. The other 3 walls have concrete block behind
them.)
Thanks for the input as it is really helping the room sound much better!
 
Actually, the sound improvement from these panels made more of a difference than swapping speakers or anything else I've done so far.

A-ha! You've seen (heard?) the light!

You are on the right track, you've got the first reflection points covered, you can do the same thing on the ceiling too.

I have a few questions:

I'm wondering what's behind your listening chair. At only two feet off the back wall, you probably have a lot of acoustic energy bouncing at you.

What is your major complaint about the sound now? Too much boomy bass can be tamed by moving your speakers up, off the floor and/or away from the walls. Getting the tweeters up to head height can really improve the stereo image too.

Are you using three pairs of speakers at once? I've never heard that help sound quality.
 
I have a few questions:

I'm wondering what's behind your listening chair. At only two feet off the back wall, you probably have a lot of acoustic energy bouncing at you.

What is your major complaint about the sound now? Too much boomy bass can be tamed by moving your speakers up, off the floor and/or away from the walls. Getting the tweeters up to head height can really improve the stereo image too.

Are you using three pairs of speakers at once? I've never heard that help sound quality.

Hi Chef,
Right now behind my listening chair are two GIK 12"x48" acoustic panels. I added the second one since the first comments came back on the thread.

Right now after moving things around to cover off the feedback in the thread above I am very satisfied with the sound. I have 3 24"x 48" panels on the wall behind the speakers and that pulls all the distortion ( maybe not the right word) out of the room. Instruments and voice are much clearer and cleaner this way for my ears. Adjusting the panels on the side walls a bit adding the second one behind my chair seem to have tamed the bass issues as well.

As for the speakers, I can use two sets at one if I wanted. Currently the Cornwalls are connected to the Mac along with all my source devices. The Focals and Paridgms have been rotating on my tube amp at the moment. I like different things about each pair but find that instrument separation and soundstage suffer a bit with more than one pair running. The Cornwall tweeters are at ear height and have the best bass so they get the most use.
In general, it's a toss up as the Cornwalls have the better bass and sound great with jazz (especially horns) but the Paradigms and Focals seem to do better with rock and vocals they just lack bass.

I do want to thank everyone who posted for their advice as it has helped a lot and really made a difference in the overall sound quality in this room!
Thanks,
Bob
 
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