Please help me solve a mystery - speakers cut out at low volume only

The111

New Member
I've been dealing with this problem on and off for over a year with TWO different receivers and speaker setups in two different rooms. Not sure if the two cases are even related, or what, but I will list all the variables (too many, I'm afraid) to see if anybody can make more sense of this than I can.

The biggest similarity I can think of is that in both cases, when the sound begins to cut out at low volumes, I can fix it by cranking the volume way up and then back down. Of course 5-10 minutes later it may start happening again.

Setup #1:

In one room I have a 10 year old, sort of cheap, Pioneer SX 205 receiver powering two large Pioneer tower speakers (also old). From time to time one speaker will start cutting out, if I'm listening at low volumes. This happens from multiple sources (iPod and PC sound card) so I am pretty sure it's not the source. Usually the problem happens with the right speaker, but when I swap the speakers the same thing happens, so it's not the speaker either. I figured it was the receiver for a long time, but now that this is happening in another room with my GOOD new receiver, I'm thinking otherwise. Sometimes I will go days without it happening, sometimes it happens every 5 minutes all day. I am using Acoustic Research 16 gauge speaker wire (for setup #2 also).

Setup #2:

In the other room I have my "good" system - a Pioneer VSX-816 and Athena Audition series 5.0 speaker setup (all less than a year old). However, I have the same audio cutouts here on low volume, occassionally. Usually it is most evident in the center channel, but I think that's just because of its dominance; if I put my ear up to the towers when the cutouts are happening, I can hear it there sometimes too. It was mostly from the cable box for a long time, so I thought it was the cable signal or the box device, but again, cranking up the volume would fix it, so that would make you think it's not the cable. However, it has also happened from DVD and Wii connection now too. One thing that may be in common in some cases is that it's in Pro Logic II mode (something I was made aware of with my new Wii... a sort of surround signal actually being sent through a stereo component connection), but I really don't think that has anything to do with it.

One glaring similarity between both cases is Pioneer receivers, but I really doubt that has anything to do with it.

My top guesses are:

1) The connections somewhere (speaker wires or stereo inputs)... but I took a lot of care with all my connections and I can't believe this would be happening on both systems
2) Something I do that may be really stupid... in some cases I use speaker wire lengths that are way too long (25' wire for 8' run, for example)... and I simply coil the excess up between receiver and speaker, on the ground, sometimes near other cables and power lines. So if you look behind my TV stand there are GOBS of cables back there, between all the power cables, the massive surge protector, and all the coils of excess speaker wire. I am fairly ignorant about analog signals and power transmission/interference, etc... but I am just guessing maybe I'm doing something wrong here?

Any ideas? I really doubt both of my receivers could be bad. This has stumped me for a very long time, and it's even tougher to troubleshoot since it doesn't happen consistently, even at low volumes it only occurs sometimes, and at high volumes never.

Thanks!!!
 
Actually you already mention possibilities and tested some so I think you are already on track analyzing this.

Troubleshooting is really just trying to eliminate possibilities one step at a time. Testing your guesses and applying the possible solution you suspect.

When you mention PC sound card I assume you have your computer hooked up to your SX-205.

I have powered speakers hooked up to one PC and the jacks and input on the sound card are especially sensitive to dust and occasionally need to be cleaned for good contact. I can jiggle the jacks connected to the sound card and hear static and channel dropouts when they get dirty. Make sure the sound card is securely in the slot.

Do you smoke or does dust come in through open windows?

Have the receivers been cleaned lately? I believe some of the symptoms you mention are common for receivers that just need to be cleaned.

A 10 year old SX-205 could probably stand for some cleaning. There a a lot of threads on cleaning with deoxit and faderlube. And unfortunately, it could be natural aging and product wear cannot be discounted.

You might try cleaning volume and balance controls and connections in the back of the receivers. Speaker terminals, pre-amp jumpers, etc.

Check the owner manuals for proper setup. Large v Small settings, specific surround sound channel setups, etc.

Try stereo mode without any surround sound to see if it's unique to the processing modes.

Do you have another plain stereo receiver you can test the speakers?

I just mention stuff you can do on your own. The more complicated stuff maybe a tech can offer some suggestions.

Maybe someone can answer the question of wire distance and gauge if that is a problem.

But don't take my word for any of this. I just offer ideas as requested. I have already been labeled as That Idiot Guy Who Dances with Nonsense! ;)


Good luck.
 
" I have already been labeled as That Idiot Guy Who Dances with Nonsense! "

Sorry terra1, That's ME! and OP, lucky you gets the 2 weirdo's on the site to respond first! Well for a doozey of a first post, what did you expect? The panel of experts!:D They should be along shortly to clean up after us, hopefully:yes:
Welcome to AK, you took the time to join put in an avatar, and a pretty colored sig. Not to mention a very bizare first post. But, you failed to note where you lived, or, more specifically, are there alot of alien abductions in your area? Do you wake up feeling not so fresh in the morning?:scratch2:

Probing this thought(sorry)I think your speaker wires are the culprit.How old are they? Do you have $25 to get some 12 gauge stuff? Cut shorter lengths, with maybe 2ft extra, and see how that works! wrapped gobs of wire near things like you have causes weird anamolies that only Sansui Louie can explain properly:D(you'll get it later) Just try that or borrow some from someone. Then try other things one at a time to stop the madness.
Peace Craig
 
Do both speakers cut out or only one? The fault you describe sounds like high-resistance contacts in the signal path somewhere. In other words, connectoritis.

Low current (low volume) the resistance is too high between metal parts such as crimp terminals, slide connectors, and screw connections, while at higher volume levels the resistance can be over come. Could be as simple as corrosion on the input terminals.
 
Thanks for the replies, guys.

But, you failed to note where you lived, or, more specifically, are there alot of alien abductions in your area? Do you wake up feeling not so fresh in the morning?:scratch2:

Well, I just moved from Orlando to Houston and I had the problem before and after the move. I am not sure about the alien abduction stats for either area, but I know both areas are very HUMID. The problem almost seems worse here in Houston, and I am fairly certain the power in this house/grid is not great. I've noticed a few blackouts in the past few days, and our light bulbs seem to burn out more frequently than normal. But before you get too excited, I did have the cut out problems in Orlando too, and I have no reason to believe the power in that house was poor too.

Still on the power train of thought... could it have anything to do with my surge protector?

Probing this thought(sorry)I think your speaker wires are the culprit.How old are they? Do you have $25 to get some 12 gauge stuff? Cut shorter lengths, with maybe 2ft extra, and see how that works! wrapped gobs of wire near things like you have causes weird anamolies that only Sansui Louie can explain properly:D(you'll get it later) Just try that or borrow some from someone. Then try other things one at a time to stop the madness.
Peace Craig

It's 16 gauge Acoustic Research speaker wire, less than a year old. I don't think I'll buy 12 gauge just yet, but I will cut shorter lengths of this stuff, re-strip the ends, and try to keep the crimps as clean as possible. I actually need to get a new audio tower... the one I have is not deep enough (receiver is almost shoved up against the back wall) so all of the speaker wires have to bend pretty sharply behind the receiver to reach the tower panel access hole. No room for banana plugs even if I wanted them. It's be easy to hypothesize that the sharp bends there are responsible for the channel cutouts, but out of all 5 channels, why is the center channel the one cutting out (both before and after I moved, and totally re-setup the whole system).

That's another thing. I only moved 8 weeks ago. I set up this whole system from scratch, so in a way all the connections have been "double checked." It's acting the same way as it did before I moved. But I guess I can try to set it up again...
 
Do both speakers cut out or only one? The fault you describe sounds like high-resistance contacts in the signal path somewhere. In other words, connectoritis.

Low current (low volume) the resistance is too high between metal parts such as crimp terminals, slide connectors, and screw connections, while at higher volume levels the resistance can be over come. Could be as simple as corrosion on the input terminals.

Well in the computer room (old 2-channel receiver) it is almost always the right channel. But when I swap speakers, cables, and even interconnects, it's still the right channel.

In the living room (new 7-channel receiver) it's almost always the center channel, but last time I heard it happening with the center channel, I moved my ear close to the front tower tweeters and could hear them cutting in and out too. I think the center channel is just the most obvious because it's dominant when watching TV.

The most frustrating thing of all is that I can't re-produce the problem on demand. I had a theory that this only happened when the receiver was turned on from cold, with the volume low, so last night I started up my old 2-channel receiver and listened to it as quietly as possible for 10 minutes, and could not get the sound to cut out.
 
Hmm, another really wild thought.

All the connections going into the back of my living room 7-channel receiver (2x red/white stereo and 2x digital coax) are going through right angle RCA M-F couplers because of the afore-mentioned lack of space in my audio tower behind the receiver. I would if those connectors are faulty? I just bought them off of eBay from who knows what source... although they seem well-enough made.

I am certainly going to go out and get a deeper tower to allow me to not have to use those stupid right angle adaptors.

This would NOT solve the mystery of the old 2-channel receiver in my bedroom, but in that case it could be a million other things, that receiver is so old.
 
If it were one system, I'd say there's a dirty control or switch somewhere. However, since this affects two systems similarly, it's either an identical problem occurring coincidently on both systems, or it's a single problem outside of either system that affects both.

First thing I'd do is see if it occurs simultaneously. When you notice it on one, turn on the other and see if it's also happening there. If so, then you should be looking for an outside source that affecting both systems, either something within your house, or from the neighbor, or the power company.

If not, then it's likely a similar problem on each system, maybe related to the bundle of cables you mentioned. I'm still leaning toward dirty contacts somewhere, probably in the volume control.

It's an interesting problem, thankfully not mine, and I look forward to the solution.
 
First thing I'd do is see if it occurs simultaneously. When you notice it on one, turn on the other and see if it's also happening there. If so, then you should be looking for an outside source that affecting both systems, either something within your house, or from the neighbor, or the power company.

A good idea I hadn't had yet. I'll add that to my list of checks.

Troubleshooting is so fun because it's the only time you hope for intermittent errors to happen MORE frequently so you can observe them.
 
Sounds like a dirty or bad relay contacts. You can popping the cover off the relay and cleaning the contacts. If the relay is the problem, I would probably pop a new one in.
 
Sounds like a dirty or bad relay contacts. You can popping the cover off the relay and cleaning the contacts. If the relay is the problem, I would probably pop a new one in.

This just went beyond my area of experience... though I'm sure with enough nudging in the right direction I could figure it out. Not even sure what a relay is. I'm pretty ignorant about what goes on inside my receiver... just know how to hook it up. But I'm an engineer and have experience building PC's so I'm no dumbass either. ;-)
 
Get some Deoxit and Faderlube. Read up on cleaning procedures here on AK. Clean everything and then return with the results. Corrosion is a big problems in areas like where you and I live and Deoxit takes care of it big time. Give it a go.
 
Sounds like a dirty or bad relay contacts. You can popping the cover off the relay and cleaning the contacts. If the relay is the problem, I would probably pop a new one in.

+1

I had this same problem with three of my receivers. I burnished the relay contacts on one of them, deox'd them, and the problem went away... haven't fixed the other two yet :nono:
 
Sounds like relays to me too....

Do a search and you'll find some answers, including a nifty thread on how to take relays apart with a special tool....:thmbsp:
 
It sounds like a resistance/impedance problem to me as well - it could be a impedance mismatch between amp and speaker i.e. too low - causing amp. to activate protective circuit/relay and that would explain why only one channel cuts out. What impedance are your speakers? Most speakers use 8 ohms and others can be as low as 4. Many amps. do not like very low impedance and will activate protective circuitry to save the amp from destroying itself.

Is the 16gauge wire single or multiple strands. Look closely at your connections - a single strand of wire out of place i.e. shorting would also give exhibit similiar results.

Try a different gauge wire on the offending channels to isolate problem to either speaker/wire.
 
I had this problem a wile back and found out that I had a capacitor in the cross over that was starting to go bad and leak. Might want to inspect the cross over just in case.
 
Look for the simplest solution first. If you do end up at a more complicated fix, at least you will have eliminated the others first. Nothing worse than doing a complex repair, only to find it's still there. Example:Couple weeks ago the right channel started sounding bad, then worse, then terrible. Turning the volume control up seemed to make it worse, so I decided to try switching speakers first. The first banana plug I grabbed, slipped right off the speaker wire. Turns out the knob that clamps the wire had vibrated loose and the louder it played, the more it bounced around.

I still bet it's dirt in a control somewhere. It seems to be the most common problem and most likely to show up on multiple equipment. Next time it occurs, instead of turning the volume way up, try just wiggling the knob without turning it more than a few degrees. If it has any effect, you've found the problem. If not, then try tape mon switches, speaker switches, source selectors, anything in the signal path.
 
Thanks guys, I posted this to a few different forums and got by far the most numerous and confident responses here. If the problem persists after a simple re-wiring, I guess I'll educate myself on cleaning the contacts as so many here have recommended.
 
Thanks guys, I posted this to a few different forums and got by far the most numerous and confident responses here. If the problem persists after a simple re-wiring, I guess I'll educate myself on cleaning the contacts as so many here have recommended.

There ya go! IMO, the simple stuff first, then try the next, and so on. This BTW is completely against how I view things in life but, with audio, methodical rules, makes more sense too. Keep us up to date, remember, you're helping other's now and in the future as well.
Craig
 
Hmm, another really wild thought.

All the connections going into the back of my living room 7-channel receiver (2x red/white stereo and 2x digital coax) are going through right angle RCA M-F couplers because of the afore-mentioned lack of space in my audio tower behind the receiver. I would if those connectors are faulty? I just bought them off of eBay from who knows what source... although they seem well-enough made.

Well, I'm not positive yet, but I think I may have guessed correctly here. Last time I had the problem happening on my good receiver with the 90 degree connectors in the back, I slid it out a couple inches (so it now looks ugly jutting out the front of the tower a bit) and was able to get rid of the 90 degree connectors, which immediately made the problem go away, and it hasn't happened again since then.

As far as the other "old" receiver in my room, I honestly think that problem, though similar, may come from a completely different source, which in this case may just be dirty contacts inside the old receiver. I'm not as worried about that one right now.
 
Back
Top Bottom