your thoughts on using a Jelco SA-250ST on a Thorens TD160
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hakaplan
Needs professional help
Two things.
First is that the specified mounting distance (center of pivot to center of spindle) for the Jelco is 210mm while it is 216mm for the original TP16 arm, so you couldn't mount it in exactly the same spot. If you were to do that, there are no viable null points to make that geometry work. You would have more distortion over the play of the record.
Second is your choice of cartridges. This is a low mass straight arm. Low mass arms mate better with high compliance cartridges, i.e. those with softer cantilever springs. And that would be indicated by a low tracking force requirement. The two cartridges you chose are a little high with median TF of 1.8g; I might have looked for cartridges with lower TF, but I think your choices should still work and sound fine.
First is that the specified mounting distance (center of pivot to center of spindle) for the Jelco is 210mm while it is 216mm for the original TP16 arm, so you couldn't mount it in exactly the same spot. If you were to do that, there are no viable null points to make that geometry work. You would have more distortion over the play of the record.
Second is your choice of cartridges. This is a low mass straight arm. Low mass arms mate better with high compliance cartridges, i.e. those with softer cantilever springs. And that would be indicated by a low tracking force requirement. The two cartridges you chose are a little high with median TF of 1.8g; I might have looked for cartridges with lower TF, but I think your choices should still work and sound fine.
markd51
Nyuk Nyuk
Howard, Your absolutely correct in your first paragraph, but I believe slightly incorrect in your second.
As far as I know, the Jelco ST-250,(which is in essence the exact same Tonearm as the now discontinued Audioquest PT-6-7-8 Arms) is a medium mass Tonearm, not low mass. These are fairly versatile arms, that will work well with many cartridges.
Unless either of the two cartridges the original poster is mentioning are either ultra high, or ultra low compliance, I don't think there will be any problems. Mark
As far as I know, the Jelco ST-250,(which is in essence the exact same Tonearm as the now discontinued Audioquest PT-6-7-8 Arms) is a medium mass Tonearm, not low mass. These are fairly versatile arms, that will work well with many cartridges.
Unless either of the two cartridges the original poster is mentioning are either ultra high, or ultra low compliance, I don't think there will be any problems. Mark
Big Bill
Summertime Rolls.....
:ntwrthy:
markd51
Nyuk Nyuk
Yes Howard, I know i made a mistake writing the model number. :yes: I was going to go back and edit my post to make the correction.
This is the AQ PT-6-7-8 Arm though. Or more correctly, the AQ was the Jelco. Only difference that made the different AQ model designations, was the Tonearm Cable used. These are Dual Pivot Arms. Another similar Arm, that was nothing more than a spruced up Jelco SA-250ST, was the discontinued Graham Robin.
Audiodragon over at Audiogon sells these Jelco's for $290, as well as many other Jelco Arms. IMO they are very good for the money, tough to beat for the price spent. Mark
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hakaplan
Needs professional help
Now that's more like it!
bigdirty
High fidelity brah
hey guys, thanks for the input. Im more interested in the table / tonearm combo than the cart. Ive read somewhere that rega arms are not good with thorens suspended decks because of the wait of the arm. does this apply to the jelco at all?
back to the topic of carts, how does the 103r fair on the jelco? if it matters was planning on a ZU audio.
big
back to the topic of carts, how does the 103r fair on the jelco? if it matters was planning on a ZU audio.
big
rkay5
Active Member
Hi,
I have a TD150 with AudioQuest PT6 on and it works I also have TD166mkII with rare 10mm bearing and have used the AQ PT6 on it. The Jelco SA-250ST is a very good and for $290 you can not go wrong as for a armboard go to http://soundsupports.com/Thorens160Linn.htm
and have a look. and the mass is 18gr
I have a TD150 with AudioQuest PT6 on and it works I also have TD166mkII with rare 10mm bearing and have used the AQ PT6 on it. The Jelco SA-250ST is a very good and for $290 you can not go wrong as for a armboard go to http://soundsupports.com/Thorens160Linn.htm
and have a look. and the mass is 18gr
hakaplan
Needs professional help
No idea on the weight issue, but being a low mass arm, I can't imagine it would pose a problem.
The DL-103R is a terrible match. The recommended tracking force is 2.5g indicating that the cantilever is very stiff (low compliance). Your low mass arm mates better with a softer spring cantilever. You'd want carts/styli that use lower tracking force. The DL-103R mates better with higher mass arms. The AT OC9 would be a good MC choice.
bigdirty
High fidelity brah
Yes i do, not sure its in 100% working condition though. Even with the platter level, when reading the VTF i get different measurements across the platter. This is what started me in the direction of the jelco.
bigdirty
High fidelity brah
Thanks for the input, I havnt heard any AT product. I'll look in to it. Also on the list is Denon 301 MKII, higher compliance than the 103. Having a benz cart im enjoying in my rega im also thinking of stepping up the benz line to a MC Gold.
melofelo
Addicted Member
not to sound contentious hopefully..but i noticed a website quoting an effective mass of 18gm for the SA-250ST
..not sure if the figure is right..but bear in mind that what some would regard as a medium mass arm and fairly flexible is usually around the 10 - 14 gm effective mass range for the tone arm..ie linn akito,rega rb 250/300 etc..
even my ariston enigma arm which was reputed to be of jelco origin back in the 80's has an 'quoted' effective mass of around 11.5 gm if i remember correctly...
if the sa-250st does indeed weigh in at 18gm effective mass..then assuming the likes of the rega arms are considered medium mass arms..it would suggest using it with a relatively low compliance cartridge (stiffer suspension)..no ? :scratch2:
just wondering what others regard an 18gm effective mass for an arm to be.. low medium or high ? :scratch2:
an old copy of hi-fi choice lists the denon dl110 as being compatible with arms of effective mass between 6-16g...(this is a rough guide btw)..
perhaps that arm's effective mass figure of 18gm is a little out of its range ..but by no means impossible to use i guess ?
..not sure if the figure is right..but bear in mind that what some would regard as a medium mass arm and fairly flexible is usually around the 10 - 14 gm effective mass range for the tone arm..ie linn akito,rega rb 250/300 etc..
even my ariston enigma arm which was reputed to be of jelco origin back in the 80's has an 'quoted' effective mass of around 11.5 gm if i remember correctly...
if the sa-250st does indeed weigh in at 18gm effective mass..then assuming the likes of the rega arms are considered medium mass arms..it would suggest using it with a relatively low compliance cartridge (stiffer suspension)..no ? :scratch2:
just wondering what others regard an 18gm effective mass for an arm to be.. low medium or high ? :scratch2:
an old copy of hi-fi choice lists the denon dl110 as being compatible with arms of effective mass between 6-16g...(this is a rough guide btw)..
perhaps that arm's effective mass figure of 18gm is a little out of its range ..but by no means impossible to use i guess ?
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vinylkid58
Super Member
I have a Jelco 370H on my LP12, which originally had an Akito I mounted on it. The Jelco is a versatile and great sounding arm, a real bargain IMHO. Having a removable head-shell is a real bonus for rolling different cartridges. I enjoy mine with a DL-103R, but give some time to an AT33PTG, which sounds pretty sweet.
Mounting distance is similar to Rega.
Jeff
Divotdog
"I can fix it Grampa"
This is an arm that I am considering for the TD-150 project, I too would like to see Howards thoughts on this arm. :scratch2:
vinylkid58
Super Member
Check out this TD150 with an SA-370H:
http://www.theanalogdept.com/34259.htm
The first pic shows the arm with a Sumiko HS-12 headshell and the optional "heavy" counterweight to balance a wood bodied DL-103.
Jeff
http://www.theanalogdept.com/34259.htm
The first pic shows the arm with a Sumiko HS-12 headshell and the optional "heavy" counterweight to balance a wood bodied DL-103.
Jeff
hakaplan
Needs professional help
Yes, agree on the DL-301, as well.
hakaplan
Needs professional help
I'm not personally familiar with it, Mel, but it looks like a terrific arm--now it's starting to get me thinking. :sigh: I can't find specs on the TP-13 arm on the TD-150, but I'd lay bets the Jelco uses a different mounting distance, so just be aware of that.
