• The move to the new server is done. There are some software and database maintenance updates in process. This has us passing the hat around to help out. We appreciate any donations. Seriously, even a dollar helps. The payment page may be found here - https://www.audiokarma.org/support.html

Marantz CD-63 KI mods

Bigerik

AK Subscriber
Subscriber
I know there is a monster of a thread at DIY audio going on these. The problem is, it would likely take me a month to get through it.

Anyhow, I just got for a song, likely because it is a Europe only piece, a Marantz CD-63 Mk II KI. Yes, the infamous version of the cd-63 that has all the SE upgrades, plus the special stuff that Ken Ishiwata did to them.

Anyhow, I am just wondering if anyone can give me a précis of the mods. What makes the most sense. Best bang for the buck, etc.

Thanks!
 
Register to hide this ad
My CD63 experience from a 2009 thread

MY CD63SE has benefited greatly from 1) a Superclock III, 2) Audiocom voltage regulators in place of the IC regs, 3) AD825 OpAmps on Brown Dog adapters, 4) replacement of electrolytics with better quality, 4) by-passing power supply electrolytics, 5) replacing power supply diodes with Schottky 11DQ10, 6) additional by-passing on the DAC outputs under the board, 7) a ferrite collar on the mains input, 8) IES power socket and upgraded power cord (PS Audio with ferrite-jacket and shielding), 9) damping applied to the cabinet.

I'm still experimenting with different electrolytics and by-passing. My output path has four different electrolytic variants on it, I'm going to replace all with Elna Cerafines (on order) and see how it sounds. I've not taken the HDAMs or the muting transistors out of the path, I'm wondering about the wisdom of that. In fact, there is a lot of stuff online about mod'ing the CD63 and I think a lot of it is suspect. I've waded through a lot of it and only done mods that seemed to have a consensus of opinion behind them.

I installed sockets to facilitate switching OpAmps. I tried Burr-Brown OPA2604s in the CD63 and found them to be oily-smooth and laid back in their sound - a little dark and veiled for my liking, though they are easy to listen to; my wife loved them. The 2604s were a huge improvement over the NJM2114 that Marantz uses, but I felt there wasn't enough life to them. I switched in a pair of AD8620s, which to me sounded great, much more dynamic, though the base response was off a bit compared to the 2604s. BUT, my wife could not listen to the 8620s, they were too harsh in the high end. Females hear high frequencies we males don't get. Maybe the 8620s can be tamed a bit with better by-passing, I don't know. So I put the 2604s back in, and found that I couldn't listen to them after hearing the 8620s. So I carefully soldered four AD825s onto Brown Dogs and popped them in. Soldering these itty-bitty surface-mount OpAmps had held me back from trying them, even though I've had them for a year or more. But WOW! Everything I've read about how good these sound is right on the money. Now we can both listen to the player, and it sounds fantastic. I have put LM4562s into another player and liked them a lot, but I like the 825s so much in the CD63, I think my OpAmp experiments are done.

I'm extremely pleased with the CD63SE after all these changes. With my latest changes, I seem to be at a point of diminishing returns; we'll see if the Cerafines help matters any more. But there are other areas that may merit attention. I am considering a separate power supply for the clock, and I plan to look at the non-electrolytic caps and resistors, to see if upgrading some of these will produce further gains. Also, I understand the sockets add capacitance to the output path and can adversely affect the performance of the OpAmps (this is even mentioned in the data sheet for the LM6172, which I haven't tried for this reason), so I may take the sockets out and solder the Brown Dog adapters directly into the PCB. I wonder if any AKers have any experience in this?

I'll still stand by this. I have not done any further work since installing the Cerafines (didn't hear any clear difference, maybe I should try Silmic IIs). Now that iTunes is so much easier than wrangling CDs, and having ripped my CDs at a higher bit rate, I can't tell the difference without serious A-B comparisons. Not sure I want to know.
 
Thanks!
I remember you posting that now. Which of the mods make the most sense? I've heard tell that the Superclock III is the killer mod of them all. True? Just trying to get the most sound out of the least dollars!
 
I think the Superclock and the OpAmps make the most difference, and it will be immediately obvious to your ears. I don't know about the voltage regulators, I bought them when Partsconnexion put them on sale and I thought I'd give them a go. Overall, the changes I made in my CD63SE made it sound comparable to the sound character of my Linn Sondek TT, so I was very happy.

There is a sonic character to Marantz gear, even the CD players. Since replacing the carbon-comp resistors in my Marantz 2270 with metal film resistors and removing the three-martini warmth (in my opinion it sounds much better without the warm coloring), I've been wondering about revisiting the CD63.
 
Where did you source the Superclock from? Also the AD 825's? How about the brown dogs? Any tips on what I need with any of those?
 
Where did you source the Superclock from? Also the AD 825's? How about the brown dogs? Any tips on what I need with any of those?

I bought the Superclock from Partsconnexion, I think I bought their last two. I don't know if they are still available. I still have one that I never got around to installing in a second player. There seems to be a proliferation of clocks available out there, now, they're even on ebay. The AD825s came from Digikey, I think. The Brown Dog adapters came from cimarrontechnology.com, you can buy them online.

I mounted the clock on the case using nylon standoffs. I attach info that I used when I did the installation. It was quite easy. I think the long black wire is the power supply. I think I gave it a ferrite donut at a later date, but I didn't notice any difference in sound.
 

Attachments

Thanks again!

Which Brown Dogs would I need for it?

I think it's this one for the AD825 SO8 OpAmp. Seems to me the AD825 is a single OpAmp and you are replacing duals (NJM 2114's), so you need the Single-to-dual Op-Amp Adapter, p/n 020302A. Two AD825's on each adapter: one under, one top-side. This is my memory talking, so it would not hurt to check the data sheets and verify!

http://cimarrontechnology.com/single-to-dualop-ampadapterpn020302.aspx

The new version is a smaller outline since I bought mine, which is nice.

You need an itty-bitty soldering tip. And maybe a magnifying lens!

There are several drop-in choices that would be cheaper than the AD825's and BD adapters. For a popular example, the LM6172; I even have a pair that I have not tried, because I liked the AD825's so much. Some would recommend the Burson Audio treatment, even pricier than the AD825/BD combo. The 2604 was highly recommended by many, so I tried it and I've documented my results on AK. You ultimately have to trust your ears, and maybe your wife's ears, as I found. Rolling opamps gets very subjective, very easily! I've been very happy with the AD825's, so much so that I've never felt the need to try any other opamps. My mod'ed CD63SE sounds great, and compares so well with my Linn Sondek turntable that I don't feel at all hard done by, having to listen to CDs.

Then there's: http://www.fidelityaudio.co.uk/brents63.html. Is this over the top?

Last night I tried an A/B test of my mod'ed CD63SE vs iTunes files ripped at high bit rate played via WiFi through an Airport Express optical digital out to my PS Audio Ultralink DAC and thence to my recently mod'ed AU-D11II (which I am absolutely thrilled with). Perhaps I can do better on the DAC but it's the one I have and for now, I can't tell the difference between my CD player and iTunes. Now, is that good or bad? Maybe I should drop in the 6172s and compare the output to iTunes.
 

Attachments

  • Brown Dog Adapter.jpg
    Brown Dog Adapter.jpg
    58.6 KB · Views: 66
LM6172 Op Amps in CD63SE

Well, I tried the LM6172 op amps this afternoon and they are very, very good. They put out a slightly lower level than the AD825's but once the levels are matched (I'm comparing to iTunes optical out through an outboard DAC again), they are so close to the AD825's as to be indistinguishable. I'm going to leave the 6172's in the player for a while.

For what it's worth, here's another opinion on the sound comparison between the LM6172 and AD825: http://www.octave-electronics.com/lcaudio/ad825.shtml
 
Last edited:
There is a simpler alternative to the AD825 on Browndogs. The AD827 sounds very much like the AD825, has very similar specs and is a dual opamp package available in DIP-8. The Chinese electronics recyclers sell them for $3.50 ea. shipped.
 
There is a simpler alternative to the AD825 on Browndogs. The AD827 sounds very much like the AD825, has very similar specs and is a dual opamp package available in DIP-8. The Chinese electronics recyclers sell them for $3.50 ea. shipped.

Could you translate the DIP-8 part for me please. :)
 
Well, I tried the LM6172 op amps this afternoon and they are very, very good. They put out a slightly lower level than the AD825's but once the levels are matched (I'm comparing to iTunes optical out through an outboard DAC again), they are so close to the AD825's as to be indistinguishable. I'm going to leave the 6172's in the player for a while.

For what it's worth, here's another opinion on the sound comparison between the LM6127 and AD825: http://www.octave-electronics.com/lcaudio/ad825.shtml

Ok, so if they are indistinguishable, why use them? And really, I am not being dense. I'm just trying to learn.
 
In case anyone is wondering what a Marantz CD-63 KI is, here is a pic:

246245667-1514272-700_700.jpg


Other than the cool plate on the front:

marantzcd63mk2ki2.jpg


You get a bunch of improvements under the skin.

The stock CD-63 looks like this:

cd63stock.jpg


Whereas the KI looks like this, all full of copper, with a big toroidal transformer:

cd_63_mk_ii_ki_signature_74cd63_95b_604848.jpg
 
Could you translate the DIP-8 part for me please. :)
It's an 8 pin dual in-line package, two rows of four pins, a standard op amp package. If the Brown dog with two AD825s fits your board, so will this.

The 825s are single opamp in an SOIC package, thus the need for the adapters. The AD827 is a dual op amp so should be a drop-in replacement for the NJM2114s you have now with very similar performance to the AD825. No need for the adapters or trying to cleanly solder SOIC packages in tight quarters.
 
Last edited:
Ok, so if they are indistinguishable, why use them? And really, I am not being dense. I'm just trying to learn.

Cost seemed to be an issue, that's why I suggested the 6172s might do you fine - they'll be cheaper, I expect, because you don't need adapters, they'll fit into sockets, or solder directly into the PCB. They do sound a little different, but it will take some listening to decide if it's an issue for you or not. The LM6172's have been described as a little colder in sound. When I listened to them yesterday, I heard that, but wasn't sure if it was the op amp or the level difference between them. Now that I have the levels right, I can hear the difference. The LM6172's are about $5 each; you'd need two. The AD825's are also about $5 each; you need four, plus the BD adapters, plus shipping, etc. The math is up to you! Sockets are extra, too. And the itty bitty soldering tip if you don't have one.

The 827's wouldn't need adapters either. If you want to be changing Op Amps to compare them, you'll need sockets. I can't remember what they cost, but if you want them you can get them wherever you get the Op Amps. There are two different sockets (one with gold-plated contacts, and an un-plated cheapie) in the foreground of the photo, and another on its side to show you how the socket takes the place of an Op Amp on your PCB. Then you can insert the Op Amp of your choice (w/ parameters that fit the circuit, natch) to try it on your ears. The photo also shows AD825's on BD adapters; and a single Op Amp chip like the ones you'll remove from your CD63SE PCB.
 

Attachments

  • Sockets and OpAmps.jpg
    Sockets and OpAmps.jpg
    44.8 KB · Views: 47
Back
Top Bottom