Hi folks. as I was looking last friday for a smaller set of speakers for my garage I run across a set of ess amt moniters . pawn shop. Wellllll...I bought them for 125.00. sound ok but need a little work. My question is are they worth me spending time and money to put them back in shape?
ESS AMT monitors
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diamondsouled
Recycle belly button lint!
The Great Heil tweeters in them sell for around $400 a pair so you did well. They are a very decent speaker well worth restoring. :yes:
Great Heils........
I traded my Klipsch KG 5.5.s for another set of ESS AMT3's-and didn't look back.
I don't miss the Klipsch (or any Klipsch for that matter)-they can't come close to competing with the tonal accuracy, (real) imaging, air, and effortless sound of the Great Heil. And do this all without the harshness and laser point highs of the Klipsch horns.
Side by side (in the case of my KG 5.5's and Quartet's at the time-very similar voicing to most Klipsch speakers) the Klipsch sounded more to me like they were "trying" to make music, rather then letting the music flow, and let the music be the focal point.
The harshness of the Klipsch horns becomes very apparent side by side with the Great Heil, as well as the "off" tonality.
Cue up a piano solo, and this "off key" tonality/rise/decay also becomes very apparent.
They can be picky about driving equipment to sound their best (not unlike Klipsch) especially the 2-ways.
The 3-way AMT3's are really the way to go, but those monitors are a close second.
I would also check, and recap/rewire/re-resistor (basic overhaul) the crossover, reseal the cabinets and pull and redistribute the stock stuffing.
Be aware that your Monitors really require a recap/rewire and some other refurbing to sound their best. Being a high resolution speaker, even crossover/internal inadequacies become apparent quite easily.
Don't short change them.
IMHO I think you will be surprised. They will, when up to snuff, give your Klipsch a serious run for the money.
Not Klipsch bashing here, but IMHO any AMT3, or Monitor with the Great Heil (when refurbed and up to spec), is at leasta couple steps up from any Klipsch speaker I have heard through the years. Especially some of the newer offerings-late 90's on up.
I like Klipsch, believe me-had them for years-the Great Heils are IMHO that much better.
I traded my Klipsch KG 5.5.s for another set of ESS AMT3's-and didn't look back.
I don't miss the Klipsch (or any Klipsch for that matter)-they can't come close to competing with the tonal accuracy, (real) imaging, air, and effortless sound of the Great Heil. And do this all without the harshness and laser point highs of the Klipsch horns.
Side by side (in the case of my KG 5.5's and Quartet's at the time-very similar voicing to most Klipsch speakers) the Klipsch sounded more to me like they were "trying" to make music, rather then letting the music flow, and let the music be the focal point.
The harshness of the Klipsch horns becomes very apparent side by side with the Great Heil, as well as the "off" tonality.
Cue up a piano solo, and this "off key" tonality/rise/decay also becomes very apparent.
They can be picky about driving equipment to sound their best (not unlike Klipsch) especially the 2-ways.
The 3-way AMT3's are really the way to go, but those monitors are a close second.
I would also check, and recap/rewire/re-resistor (basic overhaul) the crossover, reseal the cabinets and pull and redistribute the stock stuffing.
Be aware that your Monitors really require a recap/rewire and some other refurbing to sound their best. Being a high resolution speaker, even crossover/internal inadequacies become apparent quite easily.
Don't short change them.
IMHO I think you will be surprised. They will, when up to snuff, give your Klipsch a serious run for the money.
Not Klipsch bashing here, but IMHO any AMT3, or Monitor with the Great Heil (when refurbed and up to spec), is at leasta couple steps up from any Klipsch speaker I have heard through the years. Especially some of the newer offerings-late 90's on up.
I like Klipsch, believe me-had them for years-the Great Heils are IMHO that much better.
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The bass can be a bit warm, especially with the older Alnico woofers.
Not unlike older Klipsch Heritage models.
They all need to be recapped, and a thorough check out. This makes a huge difference, and should not be discounted.
The 3 way AMT3's can benefit from the modern Dayton ST255-8 woofer, but cabinet mods/bracing and porting is required for it to work well.
My thought on the 2 way Monitors would be a complete crossover overhaul with low DCR larger gauge wire wound inductors, and new resistors, along with low ESR caps, and new hookup wiring as well. The stock 12" woofer/passive setup should be fine.
Reducing the overall crossover resistance makes a audible improvement and improves efficiency.
Much of the coloration you mentioned probably has more to do with your driving equipment, and how well they interact/drive the Monitors.
In my experience they seem to sound best when driven my neutral sounding equipment, such as H/K amplification, that also has plenty of low end drive AND control. Not unlike the ESS amps of the day.
AMT speakers are picky about amplification-something one needs to take into account.
The preferred model is the 3-way AMT3, but you can get those Monitors to sound very good with a few simple things.
The vintage AMT Monitors/3's etc aren't plug and play by any means.
I just want to second what automojo says here. I have had 4 pairs of ESS (down to 3 now) and they greatly benefit from a recap. AMT monitors are some of the best models they ever made. You will be greatly surprised at the sound of them once restored. Do come back and tell us what you think once you are done and you have replaced your Klipsch with them so we can say 'told you so'! 
IBJamon
IBJamon
I just want to second what automojo says here. I have had 4 pairs of ESS (down to 3 now) and they greatly benefit from a recap. AMT monitors are some of the best models they ever made. You will be greatly surprised at the sound of them once restored. Do come back and tell us what you think once you are done and you have replaced your Klipsch with them so we can say 'told you so'!
IBJamon
Thanks!:thmbsp:
No lookin' back to Klipsch with the Great Heil for this cat!
Just a note on the ESS stock inductors.
ESS really used some nice air core wire wound units on these speakers, and are far from sub-par, especially when you compare them to the inductors used by many manufacturer during that period. They produce much less distortion then the core/transformer types Klipsch used.
My point was, and in my own experimentation, using a larger gauge air core inductor then the ESS stock types makes a audible improvement in the bass, and bass efficiency.
The high resolution nature of ESS AMT speakers makes small improvements audible, and worthwhile IMHO.
Sames goes for internal wiring and connections. 40+ years of aging and oxidation also make this a must. Remember these aren't new, and nearing a half a century of age.
The cabinets can also benefit from a sealing job, and strengthening of the driver mounting surfaces, due to the stock and evil black silicone used by ESS.
Judging the performance of these speakers with merely refoamed drivers is really cutting their true potential short, and is hardly a accurate way to gauge their true potential.
VYNULADIKT
Active Member
Ah, don't listen to those guys.
Give me your address and I'll come pick them up before you waste any time on them. Heck I'll even give you the $125 so you won't have even lost anything on the deal. You probably wouldn't like putting all that work in them just to find out you scored the best sounding speakers you've ever heard.
Give me your address and I'll come pick them up before you waste any time on them. Heck I'll even give you the $125 so you won't have even lost anything on the deal. You probably wouldn't like putting all that work in them just to find out you scored the best sounding speakers you've ever heard.
:thmbsp:
And if you sell them for some weird reason (like a did my 3-way ESS PS1220's-bought new in 1987), like to buy a (new) pair of Klipsch KG 5.5's, you will after some time realize you made a mistake.
No horns came come close to Great Heil IMHO.
I was fortunate to find locally two pairs of AMT3's within a year and a half of each other.
My mint KG 5.5's where used as a trade for the second pair. Yeah, I took a bit of a hit $ wise on them. But my increase in listening enjoyment was well worth it.
IMHO most ESS AMT's are a real bargain, even with the cost and effort of a overhaul.
Just a quick look at the Adams Audio, or even the Golden Ear Triton 2's, and you will be way under that mark.
If I look at the initial cost of my 2 pairs of AMT3's, not counting the experimentation-but just the cost of the upgraded components I put in them, under the price of 1 pair of Golden Ear Triton 2's. And I have 2 pairs of kick a$$ speakers than can favorably compete with just about anything out there, in terms of real world listening.
For all it's faults, ESS came up with some great speaker foundation models. They sound great stock, but with a little work can easily compete with the best.
Funny how Golden Ear, and Adams are finally realizing the benefits of ESS's 3-way design.
Audio Mart seems to be the first to modify/upgrade this 3-way design, and it sat idle for years. Patents I suppose, but even after those expired all you saw was mainly smallish 2 ways with angle baffled woofers (maybe this is what Oskar preferred). Overall bass output with those models probably leaves alot to be desired in larger rooms.
From my experience bass driver matching is a real pain , not to mention the midbass driver. In the case of the AMT3's, and adding cabinet constaints, they are very few viable candidates. And even those require some extensive mods.
Even starting from scratch, the AMT seems to like fighting integration, and requires good driver overlap, and smooth responses, and fairly precise level matching to stabilize the imaging and get that "wall of sound" effect that can be so addicting with the Heil. Thank goodness for L-pads!:thmbsp:
Any of the 2-ways (and for most people the AMT3's), I would stick with stock drivers, and completely rebuild the crossover, and find a nice powerful neutral amp to drive them with, and you should be in audio heaven!
Add as much as 14g mass to the new passives you've ordered. Do a tinker-tech job of finding a way to spread that added mass, as opposed to centering 2 quarters (or other coins lol) with hobby glue. It's muy importante that the passives have finer tuning than going with generics right out of the e-store.