Playing the Infinity Reference Threes...

thedelihaus

Nocturnal transmissions
I was able to get my KA-7100 Kenwood out of storage as well as my Infinity Reference Threes until the contractors return after a week off. I did a De-oxit treatment to the 7100 and have been running them at 40% full volume for about 6 hours.

The Reference Threes feature the Polycell tweeters. They sound a bit veiled at times, not often, but I'm going to attribute this to the Kenwood's slightly darkish sound. When the notes need to get high, like a cymbal crash or similiar notes, they work nicely, and are an enjoyable listen. I wish I could run them off my other amps, a pair each of vintage Sansui and Marantz units.

Midrange is good too, but what really surprises me about these is the bass they kick out. A nice tight thump, occasionally (rarely) a bit boomy. Since I've limited space, even with the contractors away, I'm unable to tell if it's due to the speaker itself or to the placement. No matter, bass sounds good and strong, the boominess only shows up on rare occasion. The woofer performance has really suprised me.

At a 6 ohm load, I was wondering how they'd tax my amp., The 7100 is warm, like touching a kitten or small dog, so not even close to sweating.

I'm aware that this model is not the cream of Infinity crop, but it is still a very nice speaker, and I enjoy watching the price rise on them. I payed $100 for them with stands and in near-mint condition. but felt that I payed a bit too much, even with free delivery. However, last pair to sell on the auction site went for $145, not nearly as nice, and without stands.

An enjoyable speaker I look forward trying with my other vintage amps I mentioned above, when I can. And since they don't seem to make a mess of the TV when I'm playing them, maybe they'll do duty as an excellent HT front speaker pair.

Just wanted to add, I'm across the house, diagonal from where the speakers are playing, and the room I'm sitting in is filled with clear, crisp, loud sound, still at the same settings as I had them before. Impressive!
 
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thedelihaus,

Are these the 4 footers with the 2 8" woofers, rounded corners?

Pretty good size speaks :thmbsp:

Take a look at the crossover schematic over here http://www.infinity-classics.de/infinity/manuals/RS_III_technical_sheet.pdf

This is an interesting crossover...loooks like some 1st and 2rd order (6 and/or 12 dB/octave stuff) with high/low bandpass on all but the tweeters. The woofers look split in their frequency ranges - one up to 60 Hz, the other covering 60 to 300 Hz, the mid covering the 300 to 3000, and the Emits covering 3000 and up. Anyone feel free to correct me if I'm wrong on this :scratch2: .

Also, the mid and the tweeters are wired out of phase (per the schematic :D ) to the woofers which is interesting. Infinity was either still screwing up schematics or carrying on their time/phase alignment theories from the 70's :naughty:

Anyway, glad to hear you like these guys. Maybe not the TOTL or best of the best, but still some Infinity technology and who knows what else was ground-breaking science in these when they came out. Don't know how many other manufaturers split up the frequency ranges of a dual woofer system...kinda cool. Hey...1000$ speakers when new in the early 80's...can't be too shabby.

Enjoy the :music:
 
Before one can comment upon schematics, one must first look up the correct speaker model ...

REFERENCE THREE - 3-Way 125 Watt Speaker

PRODUCT SPECIFICATIONS

Frequency Response: 47Hz - 25kHz
Crossover Frequency(ies): 400Hz and 3.5kHz
Sensitivity: 90dB (1 watt/1 meter)
Nominal Impedance: 6 ohms
Power Rating: 20 - 125 watts
Woofer: 8" (20.3cm) IMG
Midrange Driver: 5" (12.7cm) IMG
Tweeter: 1" polycell

- JP
 
Charivari said:
Before one can comment upon schematics, one must first look up the correct speaker model ...



- JP

Hey, just kiddin at ya bud, I was wondering if I had the right speakers. Oh well.

Correct model notwithstanding, the schematics are the schematics for the model I was looking at. Still is what it was.

Couldn't see any other reference threes on the .de site. Still thought it mighty strange/consistent on these, though, with the reversed polarity business going on. Would be worthwhile to scan a lot of those schematics from this era. I think Infinity had some some "really different" thinking going on back then. Maybe it was messed up....but it was their thinking.

Please show me what these speakers are though. I'm either blind or the Infinity Classics site doesn't show a Reference 3 vs a Reference Standard III.

FYI (the more I listen to mine in "free air state" as wired per schematic, it is sounding right. Any more "boost' in the lower midrange would be unnatural. I think the shootout situation for your speakers in a different setting will be very, very interesting. Whether right or wrong, or what sounds better - which is subjective - I want my Q2's to be factory spec....warts and all :dunno: . The more I listen....these are incredible speakers....my other brands now all sound.....small, dull, small...did I say small?)
 
Here's some pictures of my system, temporarily out of exile, but not in the permanent location it'll be in. Not the best quality photos, I know, and no jokes about the decorum and the mini christmas trees in April- not my choice, so be kind and no ribbing! The ubiquitous can of de-Oxit and Elvis glasses both on the corner table however, are mine, so that's free range for you to poke fun at...

Kencat, you got me excited about the double 8" woofers- I kept looking for where my othyer two might be! Couldn't find 'em, but swear I could hear them...

all kidding aside, these do have nice bass...

Oh, and those are the factory stands they are on and this is spelled as the Reference Three, not the Reference 3, I was told by the previous owner that spelling it out vs. just using the number 3 makes a difference in Infinity's I.D.ing of these- no kidding.
 

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thedelihaus said:
and no jokes about the decorum and the mini christmas trees in April- not my choice, so be kind and no ribbing!

Hey, those aren't Xmas trees...they're room acoustical tuning devices :yes:

I wish mine was back up....toned down the room liveliness noticeably.

thedelihaus said:
Kencat, you got me excited about the double 8" woofers- I kept looking for where my othyer two might be! Couldn't find 'em, but swear I could hear them...

all kidding aside, these do have nice bass...

:lmao: Ya, I should have waited for you to answer back if those were your speakers or not. I found the concept of splitting up the frequency range between dual woofers so cool though, I kept on rambling.

thedelihaus said:
Oh, and those are the factory stands they are on and this is spelled as the Reference Three, not the Reference 3, I was told by the previous owner that spelling it out vs. just using the number 3 makes a difference in Infinity's I.D.ing of these- no kidding.

Well, you learn something everyday and that is one of them.

Very nice looking speakers. I've always liked the vertically aligned driver look. Don't know if they are superior for sound, but they look like they should be. A perfect mirror image pair eh?
 
Nice speakers there, thedelihouse!

As for Infinity names, don't get me started [Grrrr!]....
RS 3 and RS III are different speakers, and I think there are at least two RS 3's, one for home audio and one for car systems.... Oh, and then there are A and B variations to the home-audio RS 3's... if the old Infinities didn't sound so durn good, I'd bad-mouth the idiots for their unbelievably confusing name schemes!

Those Reference Three's are nice. They remind me of my "6 Kappa" speakers [Note: NOT "Kappa 6" speakers... those darned names, again!] which have a similar vertically-aligned three-speaker set-up, but with Watkins woofer, polydome mid and EMIT tweets. The polydome mids on mine have been swapped out for AR mids, which made a slight improvement in the sound. If you find a pair, you might want to audition them. The EMITs never have that occasionally "veiled" sound you hear with the polydomes, if it is the speakers (not the source) that is causing it. I've had mixed feelings about some of the polydomes I've heard. EMITS, on the other hand, are crystal-clear way beyond the lmits of human hearing... your dog will love 'em! The only thing I've heard with a high-end to compare with them is the HEIL AMT units... and maybe a few electrostatic speakers.
 
Thank you Arkay.

Dunno if a retrofit would be a doable deal with these and some EMITS- I must say you've nailed it though with the occasional "veiled" sound. But only slight. However, on the plus side, I bet they are much more durable tweets, and really, there's no chance in hell for listener's fatigue with these- a big plus for me.

Bass is suprisingly excellent- it's really that good. Kinda baffled me...

Besides the sleightly veiled sound at times, these are very clear sounding speakers. and the cabinets are of excellent/supurb build quality.

Lastly, I landed them with the original factory stands. Goodie.

I agree the name game with Infinity is borderline rediculous. I thought advent could confuse things,,, geez...

Thanks for your input!
 
I have a set of the two-ways from that series, the Reference Twos. I find them to be lacking compared to my Qes and my RSBs. You should sell them and pick up an older pair.
 
I have a pair of Reference Threes purchased offa eBay for only $61 (no stands) but I had to drive ~130miles to pick them up. The woofer surrounds were refoamed and one was not centered correctly... I redid it and now they are perfect. However, I don't agree with the 'big bass' assessment though I will agree its definitely tight sounding... but it sounds to me like something is missing in the lower frequencies... it just sounds a little thin down low (were you using an equalizer? were you boosting the bass maybe?). I'm using them for my rear surrounds. My mains are Reference Sixes ($206 eBay in perfect condition) and these are the best sounding speakers I've ever owned. BTW, my side surrounds are a perfect pair of RS-4000s, EMITs and all original surrounds ($71 eBay) and these are definitely much better sounding than the Reference Threes... by far better sounding. If I can find another pair for under $100 I will replace the Reference Threes.
 
Monomer, welcome to AK.

No EQ was used with the Reference Threes. My room is, however, lively.

There's a pair of RS-4000s on eBay if you're interested right now. Only 13 hours to go.

For me, I've been playing with restoring some RS-9bs, and have moved on to chasing down some Infinity WTLCs or Infinity Monitor 1As.
 
Thanks for the welcome...
Yes, I've actually been watching that pair of RS4000s for quite awhile... its a re-listing. The first time around he had a starting bid of $119 but no one 'bit'. This time he has started it at a more reasonable $79... and this auction has had over 400 views so far with 10 hours to go... this often means there are 2 or 3 avid watchers that are probably waiting for the last few seconds of the auction to 'show their hand'. Unfortunately the shipping to my location is over $60 so its already out of my 'pre-determined' bid range. I decide ahead of time what I'm willing to pay for something in good to excellent condition and will let auction after auction go by if necessary.
Funny how prices go on eBay sometimes. I purchased all my current Infinity speakers last fall in the August-October time frame. Speakers were plentiful and real bargains on older Infinities could be found if you had the patience and will-power to wait... since then the prices people were willing to pay have really risen (I think partly due to Christmas and then later, for those who got some spending money for Christmas, after Christmas). But also the offerings of the older Infinities seems to have really 'dried up' after Christmas (except for the SMs but then again those were not really Infinity's best were they... and I have no interest in that line). I don't know if its all a cyclical thing or what... I've only been paying attention to Infinities on eBay since late Aug. Anyway, thanks for the 'heads-up' on those speakers.

Back to your Reference Threes... does yours have the original surrounds? as I'd mentioned earlier, mine were poorly refoamed and during the process of searching for new foam surrounds I'd come to the realization that all these 'after-market' surrounds are generic... basically the same density polyether foam in different dimensions and angles. I researched enough to know the original surrounds for older speakers were varied (in materials and flexibility and durability) and so I'm thinking the stiffness/flexibility of the surround could have some effect on how a speaker will sound. So that may account for the differences in bass reproduction we each have noted... though I don't doubt the room acoustics can have a great deal to do with it.... this I know from experience.
 
thedelihaus said:
Mine still have the original foam on them.


You put a sub on those guys. Take the low bass off of them completly (under 80Hz) and you will be blown away at how much it helps. You will think you bought new speakers. . .That speaker like you have are the ones that benifit most from a subwoofer. . .with a FR or 47-20K it is typical to be 'punchy' sounding giving you the impression they have more bass than they should. . .It will give them a 'tight' sounding bass but that speaker is trying to get all the way down when called upon to do so. The impact on the rest of the spectrum is huge. . .
 
gyusher, great suggestion.

after looking at the numbers on these, they sound much more bass-rich than they should be. Obviously, it's for the reason you described, and I'm sure the room I had them set up in.

Thanks for the excellent tip.
 
I was able to get some Infinity Threes in pretty good shape for $50. I noticed that the woofer may have been replaced with another Infinity woofer. But I haven't figured out which one yet. But I have been pleased with them.
 
Blackstone,
Nice score. Folks oftentimes, unfortunately, do that. However, if you are pleased with them that is all that matters.
Vito
 
Thanks, Vito. The tweeter and midrange were in good shape and working well. At least the previous owner replaced them with decent woofers. But I'm almost sure that I've seen these woofers on another Infinity speaker. I just can't remember where. I might take them out and look at the numbers on them again.
 
No digital camera, thedelihaus. But I'll check the number on the back of the woofers.

The pictures of yours were great. Mine are not in such mint condition, but seem to work well. What I do like is that the midrange seems to have it's own enclosure. That's something that my AR's do not have.
 
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