Pioneer HPM-150s vs TZ-9s. A fair fight?

[xlbee]

143 lbs... At least I can lift my 150s! I have mine on 6" risers.

Interesting to me they use dual 10" woofers. A quick calculation of the woofer area of both TZ's 10" woofers together = 157 sq inches; the single 15.75" (40 cm) woofer of the 150 has 194.5 sq inches. Just an observation.. :scratch2:

Ah yes Ed, very good point. I'm definitely not a speaker engineer but what I wonder is with that much surface area, with the weight and inertia of the material that makes up that surface area, can a single coil accurately control all of the mass of that surface area?

So far, with no eq and no tone controls, I haven't noticed any difference in the amplitude of the bass between the two, but to me, with the TZ-9s the bass seems to be clearer and deeper. What I'm going to do today is set the tone generator on the SD-1100 to around 40Hz and switch back and forth between the two sets of speakers to see what differences I hear.

 

[Valveglow]

Wow! You certainly have a "Pioneering" spirit! The whole thing looks great! If you could, would you please post a photo of that rack with the lava lamp in this thread?

http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=579903

I could but just for the record, I inherited the lava lamp from my grandfather who was given it by his sister in the 60s. It is not a modern made retro style lava lamp, it's the real deal.

That makes it even better! Actual vintage! Looks beautiful.

 

[Ed in Tx]

.. but what I wonder is with that much surface area, with the weight and inertia of the material that makes up that surface area, can a single coil accurately control all of the mass of that surface area?

With a carbon fiber blended woofer cone for stiffness and light weight, a magnet ass'y that weighs nearly 8 lbs, and with a voice coil I can fit over my hand for a bracelet, no problem! The motor is plenty powerful enough to control the cone!

 

[xlbee]

With a carbon fiber blended woofer cone for stiffness and light weight, a magnet ass'y that weighs nearly 8 lbs, and with a voice coil I can fit over my hand for a bracelet, no problem! The motor is plenty powerful enough to control the cone!

Ed, now you're just showing off LOL!

I'll let you know how the bass experiments go...

 

[xlbee]

Ok, we have some results. I realize amplitude isn't everything but amplitude at different frequencies affects what we hear from the speakers and when comparing 2 sets of speakers, understanding how their amplitudes at different frequencies differ might help us understand the differences we hear when we listen to them. So, this is what I heard:

Hz - Loudest Speaker
30 - TZ-9
40 - TZ-9
50 - HPM-150
60 - HPM-150
70 - HPM-150
80 - Equal
90 - TZ-9
100 - TZ-9
200 - HPM-150
300 - TZ-9
400 - Equal
500 - TZ-9
600 - TZ-9
700 - TZ-9
800 - TZ-9
900 - TZ-9
1000 - TZ-9
2000 - HPM-150
3000 - HPM-150
4000 - HPM-150
5000 - HPM-150
6000 - HPM-150
7000 - HPM-150
8000 - HPM-150
9000 - Equal
10000 - HPM-150
15000 - Equal
20000 - My ears can't hear anything.

The surprising thing about the above results is that when I go back and look at my initial listening comments, the above matches exactly what I was saying:

"Very clear sounding. Very clean deep bass. Not at all boomy or rumbly. I've always felt that all of the HPM series are a little lacking in the lower midrange area and too bright in the upper midrange, the TZ-9s are not like that. So far, I feel like the TZ-9s will need less EQing to sound good to my ears in my space."

 

[zebra03]

Looks like the answer is clear , you have to run all 4 .

TZ's for the lows and 150's for the highs . Yea , I know , you can't keep both . Looks like you have some tough choices .

I'd like to have your problem . :yes:

 

[laatsch55]

Your ears and mind would adjust to the 1K to 10K range on the TZ-9's if the bass is right and tight...

 

[Valveglow]

^^^Yes, the numbers do seem to support your listening commentary.

 

[xlbee]

^^^Yes, the numbers do seem to support your listening commentary.

Agreed but let's remember that this is not at all scientific. My hearing isn't perfect and the room they are in certainly isn't acoustically dead. At the end of the day, what really matters is what is more pleasing to my ears in my space and with my system.

Both sets of speakers are AWESOME but having to decide between to sets of fantastic speakers is a good problem to have.

 

[xlbee]

With a carbon fiber blended woofer cone for stiffness and light weight, a magnet ass'y that weighs nearly 8 lbs, and with a voice coil I can fit over my hand for a bracelet, no problem! The motor is plenty powerful enough to control the cone!

Ed,

Since you showed me yours, I'll show you mine:

 

[Ed in Tx]

Heavy-duty! I like the threaded rod with a wing nut to brace the woofer. Looks like they attached a couple of extra magnets outside the main magnet structure to cancel out the stray magnetic flux field for use near a CRT TV. Being late '80s vintage that would have been a concern. And they used at least a dollars-worth of glue on the crossover!

 

[xlbee]

Heavy-duty! I like the threaded rod with a wing nut to brace the woofer. Looks like they attached a couple of extra magnets outside the main magnet structure to cancel out the stray magnetic flux field for use near a CRT TV. Being late '80s vintage that would have been a concern. And they used at least a dollars-worth of glue on the crossover!

Yeah, the threaded rod is connected between the front and rear woofers.

 

[xlbee]

Well, I love both sets of speakers but one set has to go. If I had lots of space and money, I would keep both but that is not the case.

The TZ-9s win. They will be staying.

As reluctant as I am to let go of them, my NOS HPM-150s will be sold.

 

[krowmagnum]

Yeah, the threaded rod is connected between the front and rear woofers.

Does the rod move ?

 

[zebra03]

Well, I love both sets of speakers but one set has to go. If I had lots of space and money, I would keep both but that is not the case.

The TZ-9s win. They will be staying.

As reluctant as I am to let go of them, my NOS HPM-150s will be sold.

The TZ-9 must be a great speaker if it can beat out the HPM150 . I would love to hear it .

 

[xlbee]

The TZ-9 must be a great speaker if it can beat out the HPM150 . I would love to hear it .

They are both fantastic speakers and they each have their own sound. I am really enjoying the sound from the TZ-9s on my system in my space.