A good new production 2A3? (Shuguang 2A3C)

I had pretty much settled in with the RCA dual black-plate tubes in my 45/2A3 amp but have been considering some of the newly manufactured 2A3’s as the RCA’s won’t last forever and the holy-grail stuff like single-plate RCA’s have become unobtainable.

I have heard some of the cheaper new 2A3’s (Sovtek, EH & a few mystery Chinese pairs) and while I liked the Sovtek, they just weren’t in the same league as the OS RCA and Westinghouse tubes I have. The JJ’s are supposed to be good ($200/pr) as are the pricey KR mono-plates ($375/pr) but at these prices I’d like to hear them before diving in. Some say the best there is – even compared to those rare/expensive OS RCA mono-plates – are the EML solid and mesh plate 2A3’s but the apparent lack of reliability (unfortunately confirmed with my 300B EML’s) has scared me off of these.

I did play with some of the pricier Chinese tubes (TJ) in other amp configurations (2.5v and 5v 300B mesh, 45 mesh) and while they impressed at first, I later found that I preferred the midrange, balance and sense of space and air you get with the Western Electrics or OS tubes.

And now these. It’s still real early and they only have a few hours on them but the mono-plate Shuguang 2A3C that is getting raves elsewhere is proving to be pretty damn nice and may be a great choice for a reasonably priced 2A3.



The $68/pr they sell for from SuperTNT out of Hong Kong turned into $104/pr landed but delivery to Toronto took under a week (!) and they came in bomb-proof packaging – a very nice buying experience. They look like 300B’s, appear well built and when I first plugged them in I was surprised by how quiet they are – a little tweaking on the hum-pots has them much quieter than any tube I have tried in this amp.

I know they have a ways to go break-in wise as they changed a fair bit the first few hours but initial impressions are very good – all the 2A3 strengths are there with nice balance and imaging. Midrange is a little closed in (at least in comparison to the RCA’s) and treble extension a touch soft but these are the areas where they seem to be improving the most so I’m not drawing any conclusions yet. The biggest surprise is in the bass – these seem to go deeper, tighter and with more power and authority than any of the 2A3’s I’ve tried including those expensive OS tubes.

They may loose their ‘shine’ over time like the TJ’s did for me but for now I’m enjoying the hell out of them and the bass improvement alone has me plowing through the record racks to re-visit music I haven’t listened to in a while – a very good sign.

Pretty impressive so far and in the 2A3 world, a relative bargain.

Bill, I anxiously await your findings... Your initial assessment of the tube's sonic characteristics sound like the magic bullet answer to what I want for my amp.

Keep us posted!

Nice post Bill, and I too have been thinking of what to do when I go through my modest stash of OS. Heck, for 100 bucks, I'm game. Is the link you posted where you ordered yours from? Thanks, Jay

Yes Jay, I got them direct from SuperTNT in HK - I don't think anybody in the US sells them.

Hey, they look good as well! A white ceramic base always makes a tube look sturdier to me.
This is another of those audio names that could only come from outside the English speaking world. Can you imagine a US or Canadian company putting the letters TNT in a tube name? Not necessarily the most positive associations.
Okay, I'm done making fun of them. Please keep us posted on how they perform.

Shuguang power tubes

This may be semi-unrelated, but I have to sing the praises of Shuguang just a little to give the Chinese their "propers" when it comes to power tubes (seems they've been getting slammed for making junk elsewhere in the world).
I have a prototype "Bellaire" www.rockandrolldoctor.com Blackface-1965- Fender-Super-like 1 x 12" combo guitar amp that uses 1970 GEC KT-66's that are dead-on perfectly matched. The highs are incredible. The bass is perfect without being 1% muddy. And the mids couldn't be any better. The pair cost $300 from Tubeworld in Wisconsin. Absolutely perfect. Now, after swapping those tubes out and having the tech who made the amp adjust the fixed-bias status when introducing the Shuguang KT-66's we found that we really lost nothing! The GEC KT-66's were just a wee bit more refined and articulate in the high registers of the electric guitar playing than the Chinese tubes. The rest was all on par with the GEC's. I'd say the Shuguang company hit it on the nose 90% of the way!!! And the tubes were bought from Groove Tubes for cheap. I like American Groove Tubes 12AX7M's in the pre, by the way. I haven't really had much luck with Chinese preamp tubes compared to those. Both have had their toasted, right-out-of -the-box-lighting-up-purple-like-a-Christmas-tree run-ins with my usage of them. But the latest batch of 12AX7M's have been great. The Shuguang KT-66's have even won my heart over a pair of NOS Philips 7581's----which sounded dull and lifeless compared to the brilliant Shuguang tubes. I would surmise that not much is different with the 2A3's. Thanks for letting me sound-off here. Good luck and happy hi-fi listening.

Shuguang makes nice 845s too. I didn't care for their KT-88s. I haven't tried their 2A3Cs out yet, but their older (generic?) 2A3s were mediocre.
Jack

Bill, you've had those tubes for a few months now... what's the word? Do you still like them?

Good post. If anyone knows about their EL94mi's or 12AX7 tubes, please post your reviews. Right now I have 48 year old tubes in a 1 year old amp. Sounds sweet, but I'm ready to "roll the tubes" if there is a substantial improvement with Suguang tubes...

wizargoz

Redboy said:

Bill, you've had those tubes for a few months now... what's the word? Do you still like them?

Click to expand...

These tubes are damn nice – they’ve mostly stayed in my amp since I posted this. The midrange opened up a touch more and treble seems a little more extended but I never felt they quite equaled the RCAs in those areas.

Last night I went back to the RCAs and selected a few albums for a careful comparison to confirm my thoughts – LP’s where Cannonball Adderley - Something Else, Sarah McLachlan – Afterglow, Johnny Cash – American IV, Buddy Guy & Junior Wells – Going Back to Acoustic and SACDs John Hiatt – Master of Disaster and James Taylor – Hourglass.

These are both very good tubes and the true measure for me was that I got taken away by this music and often forgot that I was trying to do a comparison – I have really come to love the 2A3 in my current system and neither tube disappointed. I’ve heard a few say that the Schuguang 2A3C is just a 300B with 2.5v filaments and doesn’t sound like a real 2A3 but that’s fine with me, it’s strengths make it a viable alternative (especially considering price) and it held it’s own with the RCA.

The RCA has a liquid, sweet midrange presence that really puts some music in the room with you and the treble is clean, clear and extended. These tubes are just outstanding with brass instruments, harp and voice, especially on cuts like McLachlan’s Answer (wow!). The Schuguang has a slightly more laid-back presentation that is very palatable and actually preferred on some albums and with some equipment I’ve had – they get along very well with the Altecs.

The Chinese tube retained its bass advantage over the RCAs though and because of this just seemed to have a better overall balance. This was especially noticeable on the above mentioned ‘Answer’ track where the piano just seemed to have more weight carrying the tune along better and even on Cash’s American IV where the guitar had a fuller, meatier sound.

So I like the Schuguang (at least this 2A3C version) and will go home tonight and put them back in to replace the RCAs – they seem to better suit the kind of music I’m listening to of late. I’d love to find a tube that combined these 2 tube’s strengths (maybe the RCA single plate, EML, KR ?) but it’s sure nice to have them both around.

Because of what the RCA blackplate can do in the midrange I wouldn’t say the 2A3C is better than or even equal to the RCA but it IS a nice sounding tube and an absolute bargain 2A3.

Wow. Excellent review, Bill. Thanks for taking the time to write that up.

It looks like I'll need to pick up a pair of these for myself.

Hi Bill

Long time. I need to find a cheap replacement for my amp and I think I might try these out as I know what the Sovtek's are like; ok, but a little harmonically lean. The EML are wonderful but pricey.

MikE

Hi Mike. I'd love to try EML 2A3's as I suspect they may be the best there is but the price, apparent reliability issues and my experience with their 300Bs has me shying away from them, maybe someday.

I remember that you preferred 45 to 2A3 and given some real efficient speakers I might agree but if you want to try a cheap 2A3 again I think you'd like these 2A3Cs.

We had to get some new 2A3's for a Seeburg amp after a speaker unexpectedly fell from a shelf by itself onto the amp and destroyed some of the original tubes! We got some Electro-harmonix 2A3 gold tubes and found that they are somewhat more sensitive to circuit conditions. One of the EH tubes began to glow red in the power output stage whereas the original RCA and Sylvania tubes never had a problem.

Swapping the suspect 2A3 into the driver stage and putting another EH 2A3 in the power output socket resolved the problem. This amp uses 4 2A3's in push pull parallel with about 400 volts on the plates driven by 2 2A3 drivers so it is pretty demanding of the 2A3's.
Any comments about audio characteristcs are beyond my expertise, I can just say it sounds good and sounds like the originals. It is used to amplify 78 RPM records.