Cone And Surround conditioner.

cleonjr

cleonjr

Super Member
I was thinking,some of my speakers are over 40 years old.is there some conditioner for the paper fibre or carbon poly cones as well as the textile surounds to be sprayed on or brused on.to bring the speaker back to original composition. or a homade concoction like some thinned down rubber sealer or acrylic sealer.
 
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Do a search on 'sealers'. You'll get plenty of hits.
Carbon poly cones don't need anything. Paper cones could use a decent level of humidity (40-50%) range year round.
 
I made a paste carrot oil and poly latex acrylic resin and carnuba wax,for the surrounds and they came out beautiful and the cones i used a water based polyuterane wood perservitave watered down and they came out awesome too.I brushed some of the carnuba and carrot oil on some foam surrounds and it seemed to make them more softer and pliable.

I would not recomend any one try this because I do not know long term results yet. But I love my speakers and like to pamper them like a car.
 
Actualy this speakers sound really good I think they are ready for some final touches and they will be finihed.probally just me but it seems the lows sound a lot better after the conditioning.
 
cleonjr said:
I made a paste carrot oil and poly latex acrylic resin and carnuba wax,for the surrounds and they came out beautiful and the cones i used a water based polyuterane wood perservitave watered down and they came out awesome too.I brushed some of the carnuba and carrot oil on some foam surrounds and it seemed to make them more softer and pliable.

I would not recomend any one try this because I do not know long term results yet. But I love my speakers and like to pamper them like a car.
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Gees. Here, folks, we have a MAD scientist. :yes:

I gotta know. How did you come up with that mixture?

I hope that concoction doesn't blow up. :D

cleon. Happy Holidays
 
cleonjr said:
I was thinking,some of my speakers are over 40 years old.is there some conditioner for the paper fibre or carbon poly cones as well as the textile surounds to be sprayed on or brused on.to bring the speaker back to original composition. or a homade concoction like some thinned down rubber sealer or acrylic sealer.
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Back in the day, some guys used vaseline. :yes:
 
cablephil212 said:
Gees. Here, folks, we have a MAD scientist. :yes:

I gotta know. How did you come up with that mixture?

I hope that concoction doesn't blow up. :D

cleon. Happy Holidays
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Hey Phil back atcha' pal.have a good holiday.you helped me get these baby's sounding so good.I will do some pictures and I did a couple more add ons with the tweets i will elaberate soon.take care.
 
cleonjr said:
I made a paste carrot oil and poly latex acrylic resin and carnuba wax,for the surrounds and they came out beautiful and the cones i used a water based polyuterane wood perservitave watered down and they came out awesome too.I brushed some of the carnuba and carrot oil on some foam surrounds and it seemed to make them more softer and pliable.
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Dang ! Good thing those Speakers have NO residual value.
 
bare said:
Dang ! Good thing those Speakers have NO residual value.
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I beg to differ on that Sir,if you could personaly be here to see them and hear them I think you would say top job son.speakers are living breating creatures that need love and nurishment too.and boy do they have personality.

They have plenty of value to me I did not take on this endeaver lightly.I rearched.my ingredients very carefully before diving in.if anything I changed the characteristics of the sound by making the materials more resilant and pliable.Just like some treat the wood of the cabinents I chose to do the same with my components.and I would do the same to JBL,Klipsch or any other name brand speaker.Which by the way I think my Speakers sound every bit as good as the top dog speakers.

Money value maybe But I think I might have increased the value.but the real value is in the listening,they sound superb.:banana:
 
I would surely want to know if someone did a custom coating on any speakers I was looking to buy -
If I found out that a previous owner did something like that I'd go elsewhere.

The sound ENGINEERS who design and make speaker drivers know what they are doing and they use proper materials to get very specific,
repeatable performance that's measurable with test equipment in anechoic chambers. They KNOW what they are doing and how it works.

Adding ANYTHING like a coating to a speaker cone changes the weight of the cone and changes the way it works.
Sound Engineers don't just whip up something that seems like its good from household products in a food processor.

If you like the way it makes the music sound, go for it - but keep it to yourself -
please don't use that junk on any speakers you may resell. For god's sake, not on JBL or Klipsch or anything OF VALUE!

My main speakers are JBL L200s that have been customized with hand-built replacement crossovers and upgraded with JBL Pro drivers ...
if anyone came at them with such a wackamole carnauba/carrott puree, I'd wing that offender right out the door.

Carnauba wax is for vintage cars - its not meant for paper speaker cones.

There is a guy locally that flips speakers. For every single speaker cabinet he gets his hands on, he paints it with a polyurethane (plastic) finish.
He says it makes them maintenance free and they no longer need oiling. But that pretty much destroys the true collector's value on vintage
JBL cabinets, among others ... the factory says to wipe them down with boiled linseed oil and over a number of years, they develop a patina ...
sealing them in plastic paint kinda kills that.

But no one can tell him any different ...

Speakers are not "living breathing Creatures" - you've got them confused with Compost and cattle somehow ...

Merry Christmas to ya, son, and Happy New year.




cleonjr said:
I beg to differ on that Sir, if you could personally be here to see them and hear them,
I think you would say top job son.
speakers are living breathing creatures that need love and nourishment too.and boy do they have personality.

They have plenty of value to me I did not take on this endeaver lightly.I rearched.my ingredients very carefully before diving in.if anything I changed the characteristics of the sound by making the materials more resilant and pliable.Just like some treat the wood of the cabinents I chose to do the same with my components.and I would do the same to JBL,Klipsch or any other name brand speaker.Which by the way I think my Speakers sound every bit as good as the top dog speakers.

Money value maybe But I think I might have increased the value.but the real value is in the listening,they sound superb.:banana:
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hjames said:
I would surely want to know if someone did a custom coating on any speakers I was looking to buy - something like that and I'd go elsewhere.

The sound ENGINEERS who design and make speaker drivers know what they are doing and use proper materials to get very specific, repeatable performance that's measurable with test equipment in anechoic chambers.

They don't just whip up something that seems good in a food processor.
If you like the way it makes the music sound, go for it - but keep it to yourself -
please don't use that junk on any speakers you may resell. For god's sake, not on JBL or Klipsch or anything OF VALUE.

My main speakers are JBL L200s that have been customized had-built replacement crossovers and replacement JBL Pro drivers ...
if anyone came at them with carrott puree I'd wing the offender out the door.

Carnauba wax is for vintage cars - not high end speaker cones.
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exactly ,they are my speakers and I have no intentions on selling them,and if I did I would disclose all additions done.I give you your right to not agree with me.and you can do with yours as you wish,but let me enjoy mine as I see fit.I am sure people thought hot rodding was wrong too.having a open mind goes a long way in every aspect of life.,But please remember I give you the right to say what you please and respect what you say and take it at face value Sir.You are a valued contributer in this community.oh and by the way i still like my speakers. here is a little side bit,Remember when Little Walter took the doors off his caddilac in Caddilac records cause he liked it,Kinda my thing too.
 
I do not buy speakers to flip,I buy them to enjoy,and not all speakers need improving but if i see were there can be improvement i think on it and I also go for advice.that is why I come here.If I kept my ideas to mayself I would surely invite disaster.I am by no means a speaker disigner or engineer.and have no formal electronic education.speakers to me are a work of art and I know the designers and thought put into them was in some cases a labor of love.And I respect that in the builder.

when I get speakers I listen to them a lot,and sometimes I get A light bulb ilumminating above my head,and like they say "it's on"but what I do I certainly do not want for others to do.but I do believe I have the right to share My experience. I collect diecast cars too and take them out of there packaging so I can admire them better.there are 2 kinds of collecter one that truly enjoys and the other that puts them on a pedestal and just has them.
 
Well, its Heather - I am a Ma'am, not a Sir ... but you are not the first to assume ...

I wish we could change the laws of physics just for you, but ...

You are mistaking hot rodding with customizing ... Hot rodders have rules too - weight to horsepower ratio is a good one!
Removing doors certainly makes a car lighter - but you may get cold or wet from time to time.
The builders decided what was an acceptable tradeoff in their design. Its an educated compromise.
Car customisers generally place a higher value in looks over the function ...

I do have an open mind, but I've been around sound gear since the 70s and its not magic, its engineering.
(I worked as a engineer in a 2000,000+ customer 120+ channel CATV system headends in the 90s - Sound, Video and RF - dish and fiber).
I do have a bit of a technical bent with signals and playback.

Notice my choice of words in the original post - measurable, repeatable performance.

If you want to paint your speakers with some kind of wax/carrot smoothie, its your right and your joy -
have at it and have a great time ... Just let us know they have been so tweaked if/when you list them for sale so we can avoid them.
 
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I am Sorry Heather,Please exscuse me Yes I just assumed.I have no Issues with you.You seem to pop up to berate me in most of my posts(that is my preception anyway) I do not know why.but I will not cease to be a part of this forum.I am not as great as you but still there is breath in me and I will continue.I just Simply Love my music and I like to come in here for a chat too. ,
And You have a Merry Christmas Also!!
 
cleonjr said:
I am Sorry Heather,Please exscuse me Yes I just assumed.I have no Issues with you.You seem to pop up to berate me in most of my posts(that is my preception anyway) I do not know why.but I will not cease to be a part of this forum.I am not as great as you but still there is breath in me and I will continue.I just Simply Love my music and I like to come in here for a chat too. ,
And You have a Merry Christmas Also!!
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Hopefully not trying to beret you - you have a great deal of enthusiasm, but I'm hopefully encouraging you to take a more thoughtful and educated approach to some of your plans. Pretty sure I've only popped up in 2 of your threads - but I saw that before I spoke one of the other folks encouraged you to do a search on speaker coatings as well.

I know there is a paint on product that makes cones look shiny that some folks here have used, and I know JBL has a (nearly impossible to buy) compound they have engineered and used called "Aquaplas" which is a water based product designed to be painted onto a speaker cone (or diaphrams) and is designed to add a specific amount of mass to certain of their drivers. Not sure they use it anymore on new designs.

I think CG chemicals also had some kind of speaker coating product - but its not something they whipped up out of thin air because it fit their budget ...
 
hjames said:
Hopefully not trying to beret you - you have a great deal of enthusiasm, but I'm hopefully encouraging you to take a more thoughtful and educated approach to some of your plans. Pretty sure I've only popped up in 2 of your threads - but I saw that before I spoke one of the other folks encouraged you to do a search on speaker coatings as well.

I know there is a paint on product that makes cones look shiny that some folks here have used, and I know JBL has a (nearly impossible to buy) compound they have engineered and used called "Aquaplas" which is a water based product designed to be painted onto a speaker cone (or diaphrams) and is designed to add a specific amount of mass to certain of their drivers. Not sure they use it anymore on new designs.

I think CG chemicals also had some kind of speaker coating product - but its not something they whipped up out of thin air because it fit their budget ...
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I will apoligize I do get kinda huffy sometimes and misinterpret.Probaly because of my lack of education.But I whole heartedly Welcome You as a friend.I know You love Your Gear Just as much as I love Mine.I must say I have done some things in the past that makes even me cringe.but most of the stuff i play with is what I have built and not non of my better peices.my ADS 710's sound beuatiful like they are ,wich I am thankfull for since I do not want to change anyting about them.soon I will put up some pictures of my frankenspeakers and you will breath a sigh of releif ,there was realy nothing to lose.but in another breath,I will say no speaker is sacred to me if iI get the Tim Allen bug.Thank You Heather for understanding me.I am a certifiable nut for sure but a harmless one unlees you are a speaker,and lets be thinkfull my soldering skills suck.
 
This is a subject that will often raise controversy! There are so many unknowns that there is no one answer. With paper cones I prefer to do nothing mainly because I don't know what I am doing and, like a Rembrant, anything I do will be hard to undo. The speaker is a tuned system and the cone weight is important. I don't want to add weight. What if it is dried out and has lost weight though. No way to tell how much so I will leave it alone. The surrounds are different. Intact foam surrounds must be left alone. When they have a problem they will tear and you will replace them. If fabric surrounds are leaking ait because they are dried they need a special "dope" which you can fine from one of our members here. Search on surround dope or coatings. Pleated surrounds can also need a special coating. Search on pleated surrounds to find out how and when.
That having been said really, as long as you won't be selling them you won't hurt them much, you might improve stiffness, you could make them look nicer so keep it as minimal as you can but do what makes you happy and let us know if it works.
 
Kahoona said:
This is a subject that will often raise controversy! There are so many unknowns that there is no one answer. With paper cones I prefer to do nothing mainly because I don't know what I am doing and, like a Rembrant, anything I do will be hard to undo. The speaker is a tuned system and the cone weight is important. I don't want to add weight. What if it is dried out and has lost weight though. No way to tell how much so I will leave it alone. The surrounds are different. Intact foam surrounds must be left alone. When they have a problem they will tear and you will replace them. If fabric surrounds are leaking ait because they are dried they need a special "dope" which you can fine from one of our members here. Search on surround dope or coatings. Pleated surrounds can also need a special coating. Search on pleated surrounds to find out how and when.
That having been said really, as long as you won't be selling them you won't hurt them much, you might improve stiffness, you could make them look nicer so keep it as minimal as you can but do what makes you happy and let us know if it works.
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You have some nice Speakers And I share your sentiment.And think you for your response.

I will be getting some Wharf's w90's soon as some pop into my radar and I hope they are sonicly as people say or me and GT are going to have some issues LOL,I would not hesitate to go to work in my mad scientist laboraty with them.but in reality a good reputable speaker such as JBL Klipsche or wharferdale will stand on its on merit and not need some dumbass coming at them with a soldering iron or brush with toxic waste on it.I do know my limitations though.

Just like the Guys that are classicly trained to create speaker designs all the legends I am sure they always have ideas going around in their heads ,Iam by no means comparing myself to them.but what i am saying a lot of inventions have comeabout just by fooling around with ideas.and of course being here in okieville dont help i get the invention bug quite a bit.
 
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